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lo-fi
Well-Known Member
Heritage R's (remember, plus auction fees)
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2020-ford-mustang-shelby-gt350r-86/
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2020-ford-mustang-shelby-gt350r-85/
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2020-ford-mustang-shelby-gt350r-84/
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2020-ford-mustang-shelby-gt350r-81/
All GT350Rs
https://bringatrailer.com/auctions/results/?search=gt350r
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2020-ford-mustang-shelby-gt350r-86/
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2020-ford-mustang-shelby-gt350r-85/
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2020-ford-mustang-shelby-gt350r-84/
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2020-ford-mustang-shelby-gt350r-81/
All GT350Rs
https://bringatrailer.com/auctions/results/?search=gt350r
Cobra Jet
Well-Known Member
The used car market overall, including niche/specialty/collector cars has come down in value over the last 3 years or so… and is trending lower at the moment.
What was selling at crazy inflated prices, the balloons have popped and the values are leveling out again.
Sites like eBay, BaT, Cars-n-Bids, etc. and the actual in-person auction events like BJ, Mecum etc. should not be used a guidance for any vehicle $$$ values. The (3) online sites mentioned are KNOWN for shill bidding activities, “dealer buddy to dealer buddy drive up my auction” activities, and listings that show as “sold” but then the vehicle resurfaces months later again for sale on different venues where the vehicle is listed over and over and over…. The in-person sites, those also experience shill bids, private party bid jacking between friends and bids driven by emotions or the my shit is bigger than yours mentality…
Vehicles like the Mustang (any year, any platform, any body configuration, and whether limited production or not) - these values are driven by actual “street values”, not “Blue Book”, not “Edmunds”, not “Hagerty”, etc.
The street value is what someone is willing to pay AND that is consistent with real world dollars, as well as real world price points. NOT “auction” sites or locales, but GENUINE historical pricing for a vehicle that has had a 60+ year following. This has been true evaluation for any Mustang I’ve seen in the 30+ years being in the hobby watching auctions (dealer auctions not those mentioned in this thread), private party sales trends, forum sales trends, classified ad sales trends (ie: listed/asking prices) and just basically being involved in Mustang Enthusiast circles for many years seeing what’s selling (and what isn’t).
YES, the “moniker” Mustangs like “Shelby”, “Saleen”, “Roush”, “SVT”, “SVO”, “RTR”, “Pettys Garage”, “BOSS”, “Bullitt”, “Mach 1”, “Cobra”, etc. - of any year - will always command a higher price point. That higher price point has determining factors such as but not limited to:
- Total Quantity Built per year
- Documentation to back up build #
- Ext/Int color combos
- Auto vs. Manual
- Option Groups vs. base/no options
- Certificate of Authenticities that include specific Ford Build #’s and dates.. Usually a lower Ford Build # will command better dollars because sometimes people seek a low build # as opposed to a higher build #. Sometimes people will also seek the last Build # or closer to last as well which can bring in better money
- Overall condition (ie: mothballed vs. driven)
- Overall miles accrued (mothballed vs driven)
- Stock or Modified
- Number of owners
- Originality (such as ext paint, int seating surfaces, original body panels, etc)
- Any other documentation to back up its history during ownership
(Let me preface this, the below statement is ONLY a hypothetical example since subject matter is a S550 Heritage R) -
Just because an S550 Heritage R sold for big bucks on Platform-X does not mean every single S550 Heritage R is now worth the same money and will sell for the same money.
The above thought process is similar to what I’ll call the McQueen effect. This is the thought process that the original 68 McQueen Bullitt Mustang Fastback sold at Mecum for over $3M - but every 68 Mustang Fastback owner thinks he or she should also be able to get $3M (OR “top dollar”) for their Mustang “just because, THAT other 68 Mustang sold for $3M”….
The used car market now is soft - and it’s due largely in part to people being upside down in car loans where they paid ridiculous money during the “covid era”. It is also because people aren’t trading up as quickly any more to a new vehicle due to economic situations. It’s also soft due to the fact that some people are struggling financially and “toys” aren’t a necessity/priority OR they plain can’t afford or don’t want to pay the prices that some used/niche/collector vehicles are priced at.
I think the OP has an extremely fair asking price. Could he raise it and try to get top dollar? Sure. The REAL used vehicle market (not auctions) is supporting lower overall prices at the moment. Sometimes people have to do what’s in their best interest if it’s selling a materialistic object at a lower price than the sheeple parade. Due to the current times, it will sell faster at the current price point than to sit for months or longer at a $6-figure ask…
The glorified online auction venues are ad-driven and click bait driven - the wilder the auction the more the draw, the more clicks, and the more revenue stream to those sites. They’re not value guides.
Sure you can look at an auction and see a vehicle or 3-5 others like it that sold for big $$$ - but it doesn’t mean those final sales are the precedence for future values or that the same vehicle in your, my or the neighbors garage will sell for the same.
What was selling at crazy inflated prices, the balloons have popped and the values are leveling out again.
Sites like eBay, BaT, Cars-n-Bids, etc. and the actual in-person auction events like BJ, Mecum etc. should not be used a guidance for any vehicle $$$ values. The (3) online sites mentioned are KNOWN for shill bidding activities, “dealer buddy to dealer buddy drive up my auction” activities, and listings that show as “sold” but then the vehicle resurfaces months later again for sale on different venues where the vehicle is listed over and over and over…. The in-person sites, those also experience shill bids, private party bid jacking between friends and bids driven by emotions or the my shit is bigger than yours mentality…
Vehicles like the Mustang (any year, any platform, any body configuration, and whether limited production or not) - these values are driven by actual “street values”, not “Blue Book”, not “Edmunds”, not “Hagerty”, etc.
The street value is what someone is willing to pay AND that is consistent with real world dollars, as well as real world price points. NOT “auction” sites or locales, but GENUINE historical pricing for a vehicle that has had a 60+ year following. This has been true evaluation for any Mustang I’ve seen in the 30+ years being in the hobby watching auctions (dealer auctions not those mentioned in this thread), private party sales trends, forum sales trends, classified ad sales trends (ie: listed/asking prices) and just basically being involved in Mustang Enthusiast circles for many years seeing what’s selling (and what isn’t).
YES, the “moniker” Mustangs like “Shelby”, “Saleen”, “Roush”, “SVT”, “SVO”, “RTR”, “Pettys Garage”, “BOSS”, “Bullitt”, “Mach 1”, “Cobra”, etc. - of any year - will always command a higher price point. That higher price point has determining factors such as but not limited to:
- Total Quantity Built per year
- Documentation to back up build #
- Ext/Int color combos
- Auto vs. Manual
- Option Groups vs. base/no options
- Certificate of Authenticities that include specific Ford Build #’s and dates.. Usually a lower Ford Build # will command better dollars because sometimes people seek a low build # as opposed to a higher build #. Sometimes people will also seek the last Build # or closer to last as well which can bring in better money
- Overall condition (ie: mothballed vs. driven)
- Overall miles accrued (mothballed vs driven)
- Stock or Modified
- Number of owners
- Originality (such as ext paint, int seating surfaces, original body panels, etc)
- Any other documentation to back up its history during ownership
(Let me preface this, the below statement is ONLY a hypothetical example since subject matter is a S550 Heritage R) -
Just because an S550 Heritage R sold for big bucks on Platform-X does not mean every single S550 Heritage R is now worth the same money and will sell for the same money.
The above thought process is similar to what I’ll call the McQueen effect. This is the thought process that the original 68 McQueen Bullitt Mustang Fastback sold at Mecum for over $3M - but every 68 Mustang Fastback owner thinks he or she should also be able to get $3M (OR “top dollar”) for their Mustang “just because, THAT other 68 Mustang sold for $3M”….
The used car market now is soft - and it’s due largely in part to people being upside down in car loans where they paid ridiculous money during the “covid era”. It is also because people aren’t trading up as quickly any more to a new vehicle due to economic situations. It’s also soft due to the fact that some people are struggling financially and “toys” aren’t a necessity/priority OR they plain can’t afford or don’t want to pay the prices that some used/niche/collector vehicles are priced at.
I think the OP has an extremely fair asking price. Could he raise it and try to get top dollar? Sure. The REAL used vehicle market (not auctions) is supporting lower overall prices at the moment. Sometimes people have to do what’s in their best interest if it’s selling a materialistic object at a lower price than the sheeple parade. Due to the current times, it will sell faster at the current price point than to sit for months or longer at a $6-figure ask…
The glorified online auction venues are ad-driven and click bait driven - the wilder the auction the more the draw, the more clicks, and the more revenue stream to those sites. They’re not value guides.
Sure you can look at an auction and see a vehicle or 3-5 others like it that sold for big $$$ - but it doesn’t mean those final sales are the precedence for future values or that the same vehicle in your, my or the neighbors garage will sell for the same.
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lo-fi
Well-Known Member
Direct question. Do you think the heritage links I posted above are out of line with your "real world price points". A 16 mile, 28 mile, 9 mile, plus a 7000 mile car. All 2020 Heritage GT350Rs. The 7000 mile car dropped dramatically in terms of final sale price.The used car market overall, including niche/specialty/collector cars has come down in value over the last 3 years or so… and is trending lower at the moment.
What was selling at crazy inflated prices, the balloons have popped and the values are leveling out again.
Sites like eBay, BaT, Cars-n-Bids, etc. and the actual in-person auction events like BJ, Mecum etc. should not be used a guidance for any vehicle $$$ values. The (3) online sites mentioned are KNOWN for shill bidding activities, “dealer buddy to dealer buddy drive up my auction” activities, and listings that show as “sold” but then the vehicle resurfaces months later again for sale on different venues where the vehicle is listed over and over and over…. The in-person sites, those also experience shill bids, private party bid jacking between friends and bids driven by emotions or the my shit is bigger than yours mentality…
Vehicles like the Mustang (any year, any platform, any body configuration, and whether limited production or not) - these values are driven by actual “street values”, not “Blue Book”, not “Edmunds”, not “Hagerty”, etc.
The street value is what someone is willing to pay AND that is consistent with real world dollars, as well as real world price points. NOT “auction” sites or locales, but GENUINE historical pricing for a vehicle that has had a 60+ year following. This has been true evaluation for any Mustang I’ve seen in the 30+ years being in the hobby watching auctions (dealer auctions not those mentioned in this thread), private party sales trends, forum sales trends, classified ad sales trends (ie: listed/asking prices) and just basically being involved in Mustang Enthusiast circles for many years seeing what’s selling (and what isn’t).
YES, the “moniker” Mustangs like “Shelby”, “Saleen”, “Roush”, “SVT”, “SVO”, “RTR”, “Pettys Garage”, “BOSS”, “Bullitt”, “Mach 1”, “Cobra”, etc. - of any year - will always command a higher price point. That higher price point has determining factors such as but not limited to:
- Total Quantity Built per year
- Documentation to back up build #
- Ext/Int color combos
- Auto vs. Manual
- Option Groups vs. base/no options
- Certificate of Authenticities that include specific Ford Build #’s and dates.. Usually a lower Ford Build # will command better dollars because sometimes people seek a low build # as opposed to a higher build #. Sometimes people will also seek the last Build # or closer to last as well which can bring in better money
- Overall condition (ie: mothballed vs. driven)
- Overall miles accrued (mothballed vs driven)
- Stock or Modified
- Number of owners
- Originality (such as ext paint, int seating surfaces, original body panels, etc)
- Any other documentation to back up its history during ownership
(Let me preface this, the below statement is ONLY a hypothetical example since subject matter is a S550 Heritage R) -
Just because an S550 Heritage R sold for big bucks on Platform-X does not mean every single S550 Heritage R is now worth the same money and will sell for the same money.
The above thought process is similar to what I’ll call the McQueen effect. This is the thought process that the original 68 McQueen Bullitt Mustang Fastback sold at Mecum for over $3M - but every 68 Mustang Fastback owner thinks he or she should also be able to get $3M (OR “top dollar”) for their Mustang “just because, THAT other 68 Mustang sold for $3M”….
The used car market now is soft - and it’s due largely in part to people being upside down in car loans where they paid ridiculous money during the “covid era”. It is also because people aren’t trading up as quickly any more to a new vehicle due to economic situations. It’s also soft due to the fact that some people are struggling financially and “toys” aren’t a necessity/priority OR they plain can’t afford or don’t want to pay the prices that some used/niche/collector vehicles are priced at.
I think the OP has an extremely fair asking price. Could he raise it and try to get top dollar? Sure. The REAL used vehicle market (not auctions) is supporting lower overall prices at the moment. Sometimes people have to do what’s in their best interest if it’s selling a materialistic object at a lower price than the sheeple parade. Due to the current times, it will sell faster at the current price point than to sit for months or longer at a $6-figure ask…
The glorified online auction venues are ad-driven and click bait driven - the wilder the auction the more the draw, the more clicks, and the more revenue stream to those sites. They’re not value guides.
Sure you can look at an auction and see a vehicle or 3-5 others like it that sold for big $$$ - but it doesn’t mean those final sales are the precedence for future values or that the same vehicle in your, my or the neighbors garage will sell for the same.
If so, give exact numbers based off your data, that they're worth.
MAGS1
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From what I’ve seen from local dealer sales, those prices track for the most part. The 7k mile Heritage R feels a little light in price but not terrible. 2019 & 2020 R’s with similar or slightly less miles were $90-$95k this past summer.
lo-fi
Well-Known Member
I certainly didn't feel like they were far off from reality. Are there shenanigans on these sites? Are there shenanigans at Mecum? You bet. However, I feel its the exception, not the rule.
Inthehighdesert
Well-Known Member
Imagine that. BAT, Mecum, Barrett, etc., all those sales aren’t legit sales. Schill bidding isn’t a thing on BAT, and I’m no fan of the site. The bid is the bid. Nobody’s bid gets bumped by another. Chris’s R will sell pretty quickly I’m bett’n. I’ll leave alone somebody telling others they should fire sale their property as opposed to waiting out for what a market value may be. We see this constantly on here, cars aren’t worth this or that and then you see dealers like Diamond where there cars are actually selling for those asks. And then you have dealers like Diamond bidding very high on all these cars that aren’t worth x but are outbid by those willing to pay x.
MAGS1
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Yep. Diamond is very active on BaT and other sites trying to find the best cars. And they almost always get their number when they put it for sale in their showroom. They usually have a good pulse on the market, at least for Shelby’s, Vette’s, Camaro’s and even some of the Mopars. I have noticed that some their higher priced exotics sit a while but that’s probably more the norm with cars priced over a half a mill. My wallet can’t handle that segment of the market so I don’t watch it too closely
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anacar312
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"Wrapper" Heritage Rs with delivery miles still command six figures, IMHO.
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anacar312
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Thanks for all the comments. I am enjoying the discourse.
Where I am at in my life, with young kids, I am focusing on "we" things rather than "me" things. This past summer I only drove it 2000 miles, mostly by myself. My twin girls are not old enough to drive it and they are no longer small enough to share the passenger seat. However, I am a car guy and I will always be one... so this is not "goodbye" to the hobby/community, it's more like a "see ya later".
In the end, I am a "karma" guy and as much as I have loved this car it is time for LR268 to find its next caretaker. Next time I go out an purchase a "fun" car I'd hope to be treated in the same manner I will treat the buyer of LR268. A fair price for a honest car.
Where I am at in my life, with young kids, I am focusing on "we" things rather than "me" things. This past summer I only drove it 2000 miles, mostly by myself. My twin girls are not old enough to drive it and they are no longer small enough to share the passenger seat. However, I am a car guy and I will always be one... so this is not "goodbye" to the hobby/community, it's more like a "see ya later".
In the end, I am a "karma" guy and as much as I have loved this car it is time for LR268 to find its next caretaker. Next time I go out an purchase a "fun" car I'd hope to be treated in the same manner I will treat the buyer of LR268. A fair price for a honest car.
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Mach 307
Well-Known Member
Is there anything we can do to convince you to hold onto her? You seem in love.
I know for me, my happiness depends a lot on having a fun car. Whether it’s being driven, or sitting in the garage.
Though I don’t have children yet, so I don’t quite understand that feeling of sacrifice a parent makes for them.
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anacar312
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Everything changes when you have kids. Anytime I asked myself… “would I rather spend a Saturday at a track day or a car show, or with my kids at the beach, or on the boat?” The answer was always the same.Is there anything we can do to convince you to hold onto her? You seem in love.
I know for me, my happiness depends a lot on having a fun car. Whether it’s being driven, or sitting in the garage.
Though I don’t have children yet, so I don’t quite understand that feeling of sacrifice a parent makes for them.
I do appreciate the sentiment, but one can only watch your kids grow up once…. Cars will always be there.
Inthehighdesert
Well-Known Member
Completely agree, twin boys(8). They love the track(races), cars and coffee stuff(imagine that) and anything to do with side by sides. Like yourself, if I’m not working we’re together. Have no other way.
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