Why not a 5.9L Coyote?

[The Watchman]

I have also thought about the same possibility of a larger Coyote based engine…but I always come back to the thought the Coyote platform currently holds world records for both 1/4 street car (Bret L.) and the Nurburgring (GTD) the Coyote is basically the best platform for everything you can imagine…lol…if it ain’t broke…

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[Rick#7]

Again, like others have said, the coyote platform can only top out around 5.4L before a major rework would have to occur to get more displacement.

My personal opinion…. I’d take the Godzilla over a Coyote any day. Simplicity is not to be underestimated. It’s impressive what Ford has been able to accomplish with the Coyote but it’s an extremely complicated engine pushed to the absolute limits to get that HP. The Godzilla is just getting started at its stock HP. Just a cam gets 600+hp as you said. Imagine a higher RPM focused head and intake design… 700HP N.A. on pump gas without direct injection.and mentioned 2 possiblbe

Your comment about torque is wildly inaccurate…. Peak torque might be somewhat close but the Godzilla is making more torque at 2K rpm then the coyote ever makes in stock form. Those Godzillas with a cam are making over 500tq at 2k rpm. The coyote needs a blower to even get close to that.

So everyone has their personal preference, you can like the coyote or Godzilla. Either is valid, moral of the story though is the coyote is at its limit without a complete redesign…

Exactly which comment about torque are you referring to? I already admitted that the small displacement of the coyote limits low rpm torque, and mentioned 2 possible paths for increasing that displacement that are completely within the designed modular casting system that Ford created the modular engine family specifically to do, 1) make a taller deck version of the coyote block to fit a longer stroke, which they previously had done to make the 5.4 from the 4.6, or 2) make a V10 version of the coyote, which Ford has previously done to make the 6.8 from the 5.4. Both options are possible without any major rework or re-engineering needed, it's already engineered into the modular family to have that capability. Either configuration would substantially increase displacement, which inherently increases the potential for making torque as long as the heads can move enough air to feed it. As far as comparing the production power numbers of the 2 engines, the coyote peak numbers do occur at higher rpm than the godzilla, I never suggested otherwise, I compared them to point out that the coyote heads already flow well enough as is to produce the power numbers referenced, all it needs is more displacement and proper tuning to move the power to a lower rpm range. At 5.0 liters, the coyote needs to spin at high rpm to move the volume of air required to make 410 ft-lb, but give it another .8 or .9 liters of displacement and it will move that same volume of air at a much lower rpm. With proper tuning to maintain a similar power per displacement ratio, the power potential of an increased displacement coyote would certainly pass the 500 mark in both HP and torque.

As I said before, I'm not knocking the godzilla, I think it'd be a blast to swap into a Fox body T-Bird, or a classic restomod. I wasn't trying to start a debate over which engine is better. My only point was that IMO Ford had easier options to making the target power numbers for the super duty engine options than a clean sheet build up of a new engine family.

 

[zackmd1]

Exactly which comment about torque are you referring to? I already admitted that the small displacement of the coyote limits low rpm torque, and mentioned 2 possible paths for increasing that displacement that are completely within the designed modular casting system that Ford created the modular engine family specifically to do, 1) make a taller deck version of the coyote block to fit a longer stroke, which they previously had done to make the 5.4 from the 4.6, or 2) make a V10 version of the coyote, which Ford has previously done to make the 6.8 from the 5.4. Both options are possible without any major rework or re-engineering needed, it's already engineered into the modular family to have that capability. Either configuration would substantially increase displacement, which inherently increases the potential for making torque as long as the heads can move enough air to feed it. As far as comparing the production power numbers of the 2 engines, the coyote peak numbers do occur at higher rpm than the godzilla, I never suggested otherwise, I compared them to point out that the coyote heads already flow well enough as is to produce the power numbers referenced, all it needs is more displacement and proper tuning to move the power to a lower rpm range. At 5.0 liters, the coyote needs to spin at high rpm to move the volume of air required to make 410 ft-lb, but give it another .8 or .9 liters of displacement and it will move that same volume of air at a much lower rpm. With proper tuning to maintain a similar power per displacement ratio, the power potential of an increased displacement coyote would certainly pass the 500 mark in both HP and torque.

As I said before, I'm not knocking the godzilla, I think it'd be a blast to swap into a Fox body T-Bird, or a classic restomod. I wasn't trying to start a debate over which engine is better. My only point was that IMO Ford had easier options to making the target power numbers for the super duty engine options than a clean sheet build up of a new engine family.

Not trying to get into a debate either so I apologize if that sounded harsher then intended.

A v10 coyote would be awesome but unfortunately would never happen. Modular doesn’t mean modular like you would think. Could these things be done? Absolutely, but you don’t get anything for free… A taller deck would require a longer connecting rod which would limit RPM for instance.

Bottom line is I think Ford has exactly what they want with the coyote and don’t feel the need to move beyond the standard configuration. The Godzilla was created for an entirely different purpose where longevity and durability were higher requirements than HP. Its simplicity is key to that durability and something a coyote based engine couldn’t replicate.

 

[robvas]

Forgot to include this

 

[Anyone3505]

Obviously the Coyote and Godzilla are fantastic engines!

The Coyote is literally one of the most efficient naturally aspirated engines at producing power that's ever existed. I think it's #2 all time for production engines, behind a modern Ferrari v12.

The Godzilla, on the other hand, and as it's configured for SuperDuties, is so awesome that it's canabalizing a lot of medium duty diesel sales. There are videos of people doing somewhat structured real world testing in an f250 and getting 20mpg towing 5k pound trailers across a range of grades. These are incredible machines and they're so mechanically simple compared to most other engines, offering incredible durability, reliability, and fuel efficiency.

However, one thing people may not realize here is that the Godzilla is only sold in vehicles that aren't included in CAFE and don't have to adhere to the same emissions controls as consumer vehicles. This is a major reason it's not available in F150s (and probably future Mustangs!)

 

[9secondko]

Forgot to include this

That torque curve differential is wild.

 

[Bob Lob Law]

The low end torque of the 7.3 was super impressive! I had it in a 7,000 lb 2022 F250 with 3.55 gears and 295/65r20(35's) and it would RIP! I couldn't imagine that truck with the optional 4.30 gears, or better yet a cam, headers and in a 3500lb car!

 

[I Bleed Ford Blue]

I've seen several YouTube videos where they claim ford is working on a 5.8L engine for the 27 F150. Not much info on whether its a tall deck coyote or a new engine design. Granted these videos are 99% clickbait but only time will tell.

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