Mid Corner Throttle?

[TeeLew]

This is a data trace which shows graphically what I've tried to describe. It's just turn 2 at Laguna, nothing else. This car had a pretty good balance.

Admission: I've cherry-picked this lap because it is a good representation. In digging, I found laps from other cars with more understeer in which the drivers had to maintain a small amount of brake pressure in what I term the 'coast phase'. This was done in an effort to counter a handling imbalance as opposed to an example of the preferred technique.

Further, Laguna T2 is not, by any stretch, a 'normal' corner. It falls away from you and has a very long total duration, both of which tax the front of the car. A good car at Laguna will almost always have some U/S in T2 as a compromise. Most times, if you don't accept a little understeer in T2, you'll be shitting yourself in T6 and T9.

Let the games begin.

Sponsored

 

[Shadow277]

If the car has entry oversteer, the driver will underachieve the entry to some extent & then have to go back to throttle to get load on the rear to avoid spinning. It's a technique to induce understeer which creates a boat load of problems, but sometimes that's the only thing keeping him out of the fence.

In this scenario, most drivers will report mid-corner understeer and snap loose at exit. The entry oversteer will rarely be mentioned. He'll have turned in early & shallow, because a late, aggressive steering input will induce a spin. He adds maintenance throttle, like Randy said, to stabilize the rear. At the apex, he's only done maybe 30% of the turning, so he has a slow minimum corner speed & ends up adding wheel to accommodate an ever shrinking corner radius. The throttle is applied, so load is shifted aft & the differential is locked, making the understeer terminal. As he gets to the exit, he's still not full throttle, but he's quickly running out of road and patience. So he gives it the boot which sidesteps the rear and causes a mad unwinding of the steering & cheers from thousands of adoring fans.

Entry oversteer is not a common complaint of nose heavy cars like ours, but it is very common in others. In general, we need to carry our braking into the corner to keep load forward & give the front enough authority to work. Genuine understeer gets a bad rap. It might be a little frustrating at times, but it's a damn site better than the alternative.

So if you need throttle on entry, a plethora of things have been done incorrectly?

 

[Shadow277]

What tracks do you normally run?

Litchfield Motorsports Park and Wild Horse Motorsports Park.

 

[TeeLew]

So if you need throttle on entry, a plethora of things have been done incorrectly?

Pretty much.

 

[TeeLew]

Litchfield Motorsports Park and Wild Horse Motorsports Park.

I don't have anything for AMP, but if you want to talk Firebird we can.

(I refuse to use all the new names on general principles.)

 

[Shadow277]

I don't have anything for AMP, but if you want to talk Firebird we can.

(I refuse to use all the new names on general principles.)

You have been of tremendous help. Thank you.

 

[TeeLew]

You have been of tremendous help. Thank you.

My pleasure.

 

[TeeLew]

So if you need throttle on entry, a plethora of things have been done incorrectly?

I should clarify this. This is true if we're speaking of lower speed corners (roughly 2nd and 3rd gear). The faster the corner (4th and especially 5th gears), the earlier you need to get everything done. If you're going through The Kink or Au Rouge (i.e. very fast corners), you need to be on throttle through the corner. You want to do your slowing early and then create understeer and stability by applying throttle all the way through the corner. In these cases, you're often better with a lesser the magnitude of lift and a longer duration.

 

[NightmareMoon]

I should clarify this. This is true if we're speaking of lower speed corners (roughly 2nd and 3rd gear). The faster the corner (4th and especially 5th gears), the earlier you need to get everything done. If you're going through The Kink or Au Rouge (i.e. very fast corners), you need to be on throttle through the corner. You want to do your slowing early and then create understeer and stability by applying throttle all the way through the corner. In these cases, you're often better with a lesser the magnitude of lift and a longer duration.

Agreed, that's all accurate. Another way to look at this: faster corners implies a wider radius, and wider radius with the same track width means effectively a more constrained constant radius line through the corner. With less track width to play with, we end up with more time at a constant radius and thus more maintenance throttle or moderate acceleration after entry and initial speed adjustment moves. The same corner with a wider track width and we'd be at maintenance throttle less because there would be more room to brake deeper and accelerate sooner. I'd draw a diagram but I'm lazy.

 

[Brian@BMVK]

I'd draw a diagram but I'm lazy.

You get a pass, 2x 2021 champ tour winner.

 

[shogun32]

https://www.motortrend.com/news/rob-corddry-learns-performance-driving-randy-pobst/

see YT on this post
https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/whats-the-difference.159178/page-2#post-3244116

 

[TeeLew]

If anything, Faulkner is underrated, but I'm good with the rest of the article.

 

[Caballus]

If you're going through The Kink or Au Rouge (i.e. very fast corners), you need to be on throttle through the corner.

https://www.tracktime.be/en/is-eau-rouge-flat/

 

[TeeLew]

Au Rouge is at the bottom, but Radillion, the left at the top, can be just as tough. What a cool track.

 

[shogun32]

and this would be an example of engine braking to set the nose and steady throttle for the 2nd.


I was surprised how poorly the prototype went about accelerating thru corners.
7th minute was rough - on/off/on/off/on throttle multiple times in 2 successive corners. Yeesh.

Sponsored