Manuals Are Losers

[BiancoV]

I can never wrap my head around why we can't love eachothers cars...every example should be appreciated

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[SEAICE]

I've gone back and forth so many times between manual and auto. Even with an auto, I can't drive w/o my hand on the shifter... I love using a clutch, but on the other hand... I can be lazy and a modern auto is always faster in a straight line. I made sure my son's first car was a manual '05 Mustang, because it's a skill that he should have.

 

[Hadelson]

1 "No, that just proves I have a rifle that can hit a target at 400 yards. It says nothing about how well I shoot." Seems like the same thing with the auto / manual argument.

I drive a MT 6 speed. Also, I shoot fairly well - tad bit more then 400 yard

 

[K4fxd]

I used to be able to hit the steel at 1000 yards, those days are gone.
(can't afford the practice ammo, anyone who can shoot that well will understand)
If a computer scope will let me bag that Elk, I'm ok with it.

 

[bluebeastsrt]

I’m from Jersey. We hold our pistols sideways and miss human sized targets from 12 feet. We can pop off 20 round clips and not hit a thing! Any homeboy that shoots like that will also understand.

 

[Norm Peterson]

So, you're saying that because *YOU* want to drive a manual transmission that *I* should buy one?

No.

What I'm saying with that is that you can't see this MT vs AT choice from the perspective of having your preference taken away from you. Simply being aware of the possibility of MTs going away isn't the same thing when it's not your choice at risk, while your preference remains intact. Not until your choice specifically goes away, or at least threatens to go away, can you see things in the same light.

That's 100% separate from whether I care what you or anybody else prefers here.


Norm

 

[Arthonon]

No.

What I'm saying with that is that you can't see this MT vs AT choice from the perspective of having your preference taken away from you. Simply being aware of the possibility of MTs going away isn't the same thing when it's not your choice at risk, while your preference remains intact. Not until your choice specifically goes away, or at least threatens to go away, can you see things in the same light.

That's 100% separate from whether I care what you or anybody else prefers here.


Norm

OK, I guess my confusion came in because you specifically quoted and responded to the part of my post that said " It seems like the only people who care what other people drive is manual owners." Give that, I assumed you were addressing why you cared what other people drive.

I chose a 10-speed for this Mustang purchase, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't prefer a manual for other vehicles. Between the manual and the auto for this vehicle, the auto seemed like a better fit to me for different reasons, so I bought it. I've mentioned before that I want to get a different vehicle that has a manual, because I like driving those too, and prefer them in different vehicles.

Unfortunately, the world changes, and we have to adapt. I've had several products, and classes of products, that I like go away due to market changes, but I didn't go to people buying other things and chastise them for not buying the stuff that I preferred. That seems to be the M.O. of manual drivers these days.

 

[Norm Peterson]

Unfortunately, the world changes, and we have to adapt. I've had several products, and classes of products, that I like go away due to market changes, but I didn't go to people buying other things and chastise them for not buying the stuff that I preferred. That seems to be the M.O. of manual drivers these days.

I guess we're getting as close as we're going to get here.

Though I do think the "M.O." sword has been cutting both ways here (what? you don't want to get the AT so you will be faster???).


Norm

 

[Arthonon]

I guess we're getting as close as we're going to get here.

Though I do think the "M.O." sword has been cutting both ways here (what? you don't want to get the AT so you will be faster???).


Norm

I think if you look, though, the auto-owners' comments are usually in response to a post from a manual owner telling them they made a mistake. The auto owners rarely start a thread condemning manual owners.

 

[Charlemagne]

3. Like it or not, today’s DTC’s are faster - also true

Yup, that's the reason new M3/M4 got conventional torque-converter eight-speed automatic from ZF.

I have DCT in VW Passat (7sp DSG) and it has its problems, nothing to put on a pedestal. Also its mechatronics just got fried somehow on its own, looking on 3k repair, meh. I'm sure 10R80 will be better than this DCT

 

[dpAtlanta]

Tis still a SILLY thread...............

 

[Zooks527]

I used to be able to hit the steel at 1000 yards, those days are gone.
(can't afford the practice ammo, anyone who can shoot that well will understand)
If a computer scope will let me bag that Elk, I'm ok with it.

I no longer hunt and just shoot for fun these days. Having the scope do all the work for me would take away most of that fun. Since the Mustang is my fun car, I feel the same way about the transmission.

All that being said, yeah, cost per pew has been stupid of late. Getting slightly better recently, but seems like it will be a while to get back to normal.

 

[ICU812]

1 ) The gearing differences and consequences thereof are news to people?

2 ) One of the guys in the office and I were talking about a new system for long range shooting. You program the unit with the ballistics info in use, sight a target through the scope, put a red dot on the target, and pull the trigger. The system laser ranges to the target, calculates the bullet drop, adjusts the sight image to accommodate, then fires the rifle when it is determined that it's pointing at the target spot, adjusting for any unsteadiness in the shooter's hold. Another employee asked if I was going to get it, to which I replied "No, that just proves I have a rifle that can hit a target at 400 yards. It says nothing about how well I shoot." Seems like the same thing with the auto / manual argument.

An auto today will be faster, but row your own will be more fun to drive.
Fun to drive doesn't win ego points at the stop light to stop light games. So those that buy by "spec" will shoot for the Automatic. They didn't buy for the fun, they bought for bragging rights. That said.
A manual shift car sucks in traffic And most of the vehicles that have the option of a row your own are sold in ares that see heavy traffic daily. I did it for years, it was hard on the left knee. Today it is better with the hydo clutch but back when you needed a stiff clutch pedal if you had big power in front of it, it was ruff on the knee and hip.
I wanted a manual, but Did not find one optioned the way I'd like.
I think the death of the manual shift car is not so much about epa mpg, it has a little to do with it, but much of it is because it is easier to program and control the torque management to keep from breaking stuff, and have the nanny controls in step of what the vehicle is doing with the meathead behind the wheel.
The computer knows what the automatic will do and when, it doesn't know what the meat suit thing in the drivers seat will do.
And lets face it, most drivers don't have the skill to keep a 300hp vehicle out of a ditch without all the nanny crap, never mind a 450-700 hp one.
Those that have the skill are 5% maybe 10% of drivers.
I remember when I was younger and hit the junk yards for upgrading the whip, seeing many cars that you could tell lost it into a telly pole, or tree , there was no shortage of them. Many a muscle car died from that fate.
Today when I go, there is maybe 1 that looks like it creamed a telly pole sideways hard. I hate nanny controls but it has saved many unskilled drivers from that fate, They just end up needing new boxers from crapping their shorts

 

[Rapid Red]

I wouldn’t be surprised if big gov bans manuals in the near future because of fuel . The way I drive, I’m lucky to get 10mpg because I don’t give a crap about fuel economy.

Fuel economy, the very last thing on my mind, AKA as never. I get great fuel economy, can literally fill the tank. And the car will run all the way to empty.

Hate to make this point and will sure as hell poke some holes in the dreamers out here..

The manual can get better MPG if driven correctly. Most folks cannot figure out the logic . A need for an understanding of rolling resistance is required to make it happen. (momentum)
Actually takes thinking & judgement on the fly while driving.

Eating Twinkies, gabbing on a cell, fiddling around with the beloved my tunes. Is all the uncoordinated can handle ... gas on gas off

 

[Balr14]

Yup, that's the reason new M3/M4 got conventional torque-converter eight-speed automatic from ZF.

I have DCT in VW Passat (7sp DSG) and it has its problems, nothing to put on a pedestal. Also its mechatronics just got fried somehow on its own, looking on 3k repair, meh. I'm sure 10R80 will be better than this DCT

I had the Porsche PDK and it's a wonderful transmission, mostly because of the programming. I have driven a Jag with the ZF 8 speed and I wouldn't be surprised if it replaces most of the DCT transmissions out there. In manual mode, the ZF changes gears as fast as the PDK and costs far less.

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