Limp Mode on the Track

[TRACK CRAZY GT350]

Exactly right. I'm in shock anyone planning on hitting the track would NOT order the extra cooling and still expect it to perform as well as the GT350 Track Pack and R versions.

Exactly wrong! Better get out of SHOCK! The tech pack may not perform as well as the track pack but not being able to do a 20 min. session is ridiculous. Take almost any 2016 car off the lot and it would be able to do five 20 minute runs with no problem and yes that is with a good driver. There is something very wrong when you spend 60k for a GT350 and it goes limp after only 15 minutes on the track.

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[1320']

Exactly wrong! Better get out of SHOCK! The tech pack may not perform as well as the track pack but not being able to do a 20 min. session is ridiculous. Take almost any 2016 car off the lot and it would be able to do five 20 minute runs with no problem and yes that is with a good driver. There is something very wrong when you spend 60k for a GT350 and it goes limp after only 15 minutes on the track.

How many cars on the lot at 526 HP, spinning up to 8,200 RPM and weigh in at 3,750lbs?

That's going to generate heat!

You can't compare a 200 HP FR-S or a 140 HP MX-5 to a GT350 :frusty:

 

[TRACK CRAZY GT350]

How many cars on the lot at 526 HP, spinning up to 8,200 RPM and weigh in at 3,750lbs?

That's going to generate heat!

You can't compare a 200 HP FR-S or a 140 HP MX-5 to a GT350 :frusty:

Please give it up!:tsk:

 

[zombiekiller]

You have the problem misidentified. The issue is not the lack of a cooler. The issue is the inability to handle more than 10-20 minutes on a track without a cooler. That is the issue. Period.

this is where we'll just disagree.

I get it.. Ford kinda sorta identified what would happen. Fine.

The difference between the two option packages on track was potentially not made as clear as some of us would have liked.

it was sort of disclosed. The reality is, the performance difference is larger than was anticipated. I'm not happy about it either.

You cant really expect a fix for free. if it is as simple as a TSB for some heat shield and that gets the car through a 20 min track session, AWESOME.

now if it isnt, i think most owners that experience this would be happy to pay a reasonable price to give the car the extra capabilities. based on some of the marketing, i'd hope that ford would work with us and honor our warranty if we make the recommended modifications of adding coolers.

" fix it for free or i'll sell my car at a loss and buy a bmw" is not something that would particularly resonate well with me if i'm at ford, making a fiscal decision.

My response would be to slap ya on the ass, send ya on your way and to tell you, enjoy your new bimmer.

you catch more flys with honey and all that.....

 

[cosmo]

I'm defending the truth, not Ford. If Ford had intentionally misled people then I would be holding them to task, but they didn't.

What I'm seeing is:

A: Someone who wants to know why their car went into limp mode-Valid question which I'm sure a Ford dealership will answer

B: A bunch of people upset that the Tech Package cars did not come with the track coolers, which Ford said are needed, and now expect Ford to fix a situation that they warned the customers of.

Ford clearly said that if you're going to track your GT350 base or technology package car that it will need extra coolers. They did warn people, they did their due diligence. This isn't a case where they covered it up or like the 99 Cobra scandal.

Ford put it in the owners manual. It isn't posted anywhere in their online ordering site under the track pack or tech pack information. Nowhere does it state "the only way to run this car reliably on the track, is with the track pack". Anyone else, and many who bought their cars here, thought the track pack would make them go faster around the track but wasn't absolutely necessary to track in the first place. It's the same situation as the PP on the GT. I don't think the only way I can drive with performance in mind is with the PP, I think the PP will enhance performance driving.

The fact that Ford is now mandating coolers on ALL cars is a sign of guilt that this vehicle isn't meeting the goals it was designed to. I can't think of another time that the packages were changed like this after ONE model year (15's & 16's were released simultaneously, no time to adjust '16 models).

 

[1320']

Ford put it in the owners manual. It isn't posted anywhere in their online ordering site under the track pack or tech pack information. Nowhere does it state "the only way to run this car reliably on the track, is with the track pack". Anyone else, and many who bought their cars here, thought the track pack would make them go faster around the track but wasn't absolutely necessary to track in the first place. It's the same situation as the PP on the GT. I don't think the only way I can drive with performance in mind is with the PP, I think the PP will enhance performance driving.

The fact that Ford is now mandating coolers on ALL cars is a sign of guilt that this vehicle isn't meeting the goals it was designed to. I can't think of another time that the packages were changed like this after ONE model year (15's & 16's were released simultaneously, no time to adjust '16 models).

Or maybe the majority of the GT350's ordered have been with either the Tech Pack or the Track Pack and the volumes of base GT350's ordered did not justify the continued availability of the base suspension? Ford only knows why they made the track pack standard now.

If it had been a cooling issue they would have just added the coolers to the base car, but they're making the track pack standard, which seems to me to mean that the majority of the cars ordered have had MagneRide on them.

It seems like the people who are upset about this are confusing "performance driving" and "track driving"...they're different. You can have a performance car that isn't a track car. You can have a track car that isn't a performance car.

 

[Caballus]

this is where we'll just disagree.

I get it.. Ford kinda sorta identified what would happen. Fine.

The difference between the two option packages on track was potentially not made as clear as some of us would have liked.

it was sort of disclosed. The reality is, the performance difference is larger than was anticipated. I'm not happy about it either.

You cant really expect a fix for free. if it is as simple as a TSB for some heat shield and that gets the car through a 20 min track session, AWESOME.

now if it isnt, i think most owners that experience this would be happy to pay a reasonable price to give the car the extra capabilities. based on some of the marketing, i'd hope that ford would work with us and honor our warranty if we make the recommended modifications of adding coolers.

" fix it for free or i'll sell my car at a loss and buy a bmw" is not something that would particularly resonate well with me if i'm at ford, making a fiscal decision.

My response would be to slap ya on the ass, send ya on your way and to tell you, enjoy your new bimmer.

you catch more flys with honey and all that.....

You have valid points. However, the root of our disagreement rests on two misperceptions:
1. ford did not disclose the issue. An owners manual is not disclosure.

2. I won't sell at a loss. I paid less than MSRP and will sell for well above that, without a doubt. Frankly, at that point, I could care less what ford thinks. I don't want a car that can't perform on the Autobahn or the track, and that's what's on the way.

Disagreement is healthy.

 

[Hack]

If the dealer didn't want to switch from Tech Pack to Track Pack then that is because they didn't want to be stuck with a track pack, lower level interior should the deal fall through. Most people walking off the street are going to look at a $56,500 price tag, plus tax and such GT350 with a cloth interior and say "hell no!"

Not so sure about that, but if the customer doesn't fit into the seats they might not be inclined to buy the car. Probably the dealer would tend to buy the cars that more people can comfortably ride in. The dealers are probably assuming (like most of us) that there will be no major issues with the performance of the tech pack cars for occasional HPDE use. Just like the majority of Camaros and Mustangs - you can easily take them to the track and have fun 20 minute sessions. IMO there's no reason for anyone to expect that a GT350 wouldn't be able to handle it.

You cant really expect a fix for free. if it is as simple as a TSB for some heat shield and that gets the car through a 20 min track session, AWESOME.

Most of us don't expect a free fix, but we do expect a recommendation from Ford on how to bring the tech pack up to a minimum level of ability that would match a base Mustang GT, for instance. It's only the guys with the track pack cars who are SAYING that we want it free, we want equal performance, blah blah blah. If you actually read what most of the tech pack guys are saying you will see I'm right here.

Frankly, the more I think about it - I do feel that Ford messed up pretty badly. The more people on here keep saying that a tech pack GT350 shouldn't be able to run briefly on the track in a performance driving situation - the more unreasonable/ridiculous they sound. I can only think they are jealous of the sweet heated and cooled seats and awesome Sync 3 system I have in my tech pack car, and their schadenfreude has them all wishing ill to the tech pack buyers. I can sure understand that. I would hate trying to live with those Recaros daily. That would be a killer.

 

[Spa2k]

I love how this has gotten so totally blown out of proportion at Mustang6G, based on a one-time experience reported by the OP: a self-proclaimed novice running a BASE GT 350. From that you guys have declared that GT 350 Techs are junk, that the cars will fail on the Autobahn, that Ford needs to be sued and that the sky is falling.

Sorry, but I'm not climbing onboard until I see a lot more FACTS, like we've seen here regarding paint and delivery issues.

 

[Hack]

I love how this has gotten so totally blown out of proportion at Mustang6G, based on a one-time experience reported by the OP: a self-proclaimed novice running a BASE GT 350. From that you guys have declared that GT 350 Techs are junk, that the cars will fail on the Autobahn, that Ford needs to be sued and that the sky is falling.

Sorry, but I'm not climbing onboard until I see a lot more FACTS, like we've seen here regarding paint and delivery issues.

I've been told it was 3, not one. I probably would have only posted a couple times except for all the track pack buyers keep posting negative angry miss characterizations of those posts, as well as insults to all the tech pack buyers. Not sure what the track pack buyers are so up in arms about something that doesn't affect them. I have some ideas though.

 

[montreal ponies]

I've been told it was 3, not one. I probably would have only posted a couple times except for all the track pack buyers keep posting negative angry miss characterizations of those posts, as well as insults to all the tech pack buyers. .

........ And don't forget all the base car owners. ;) We're out here too.

 

[Katastrophe]

I love how this has gotten so totally blown out of proportion at Mustang6G, based on a one-time experience reported by the OP: a self-proclaimed novice running a BASE GT 350. From that you guys have declared that GT 350 Techs are junk, that the cars will fail on the Autobahn, that Ford needs to be sued and that the sky is falling.

Sorry, but I'm not climbing onboard until I see a lot more FACTS, like we've seen here regarding paint and delivery issues.

I agree with your point 100%.

This entire thing has blown up. I understand where a lot of people will feel mislead and somewhat "cheated" by the sub-par track time from non-TP models...but we do need more data.

Suggestion: Maybe those with Base and Tech cars can go out and flog them a bit more and see what happens...? Get some more track time in and see if this is truly a widespread issue.

I will say, I'm not a fan of selective marketing or PR that requires a crap-load of asterisks for the CYA of the company, though. I still firmly believe that if a car (any car) is touted to perform up to a certain level and isn't meeting or exceeding it, there is cause for complaint.

Also, as previously stated...I do feel for those buyers who didn't lurk online for weeks/months reading what looks like separate novels of forum banter...

IMHO

EDIT: If it IS a widespread issue...especially considering MY2017's standard equipment, I can see quite a few unhappy campers...

 

[Trackaholic]

Situation is frustrating for all involved.

By making the track pack coolers part of the standard package for 2017 cars, Ford has tacitly admitted that they are necessary. It's annoying that they tried to keep the car cheap for 2015 and 2016, rather than including these components on all cars from the beginning.

I'm sure Ford engineers don't like seeing this negative backlash, and of course the owners feel slighted as well.

With that said, based on my own street and track experience, I suspect that even on the autobahn the GT350 will perform fine. At least in that case you will be in 5th or 6th gear at a high speed, giving lots of airflow for cooling. On a track, much of the power demands are required in lower gears and speeds, where the airflow isn't as effective.

If I had a tech pack car, and planned to track it, and was concerned about the transmission temperature issue, then I'd probably give a vendor like Mishimoto a call, to see if they could recommend or develop a kit for the GT350. They (along with other aftermarket companies) make all kids of cooling products that could probably be added relatively easily to solve this issue. The nice thing is that the GT350 at least has spaces to put the coolers, and airflow management already in place to handle them, so mimicking the Track Pack cooling kits might not be too difficult (of course needing to add a pump for the transmission kit does complicate things, but there should be solutions out there).

There is also the possibility of adding heat shields to the exhaust to mitigate heat transfer to the transmission as well. Maybe that will be sufficient.

In any case, I think it is a bit of an over-reaction to already be thinking of an exit strategy, because 99% of the time this car is going to be pretty amazing and exciting, and IMO there will be solutions available that can mitigate the cooling issues.

-T

 

[Wblv17]

turned down a 16 tech because of this and waiting for a 17

speaking of a 17

Ford knows the tech aint right and why all 17's will have all coolers.

just using common sense.

Also how does someone with less then 10 post call long term members pansies and not get banned?

 

[snaproll]

I love how this has gotten so totally blown out of proportion at Mustang6G, based on a one-time experience reported by the OP: a self-proclaimed novice running a BASE GT 350. From that you guys have declared that GT 350 Techs are junk, that the cars will fail on the Autobahn, that Ford needs to be sued and that the sky is falling.

Sorry, but I'm not climbing onboard until I see a lot more FACTS, like we've seen here regarding paint and delivery issues.

It's hilarious. I came here for info and tech and what you find is a bunch of bs page after page. And a bunch of Internet bench racing with some insults thrown in. If you've spent any time driving high HP cars at the track, you are not complaining about this issue because the whole thing is obvious.

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