GT350 gets a new FP350s crate engine

[VoodooStang]

Fair enough. Keep in mind you'll be still allowing some oil vapor to get into the intake. I've been instructed by multiple folks a straight vent to atmosphere system is ideal. But I don't have data to back that up other than anecdotal evidence.

Hopefully with the frequency that I’m changing the oil, after every track weekend, this won‘t be a problem. My thoughts are that when you continue to run oil diluted with the by-products of combustion it looses it ability to lubricate. That’s when you start harming your engine.

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[VoodooStang]

How does it work then? Does it only vent out?

 

[Angrey]

Interestingly, had a conversation with MPR about catch cans. Never noticed it, but the reason it's primarily on the passenger side is the molded baffling that's on the driver's side (but not on the passenger side). If you put the two valve covers side by side, you go "ohhhhhh, no wonder." Not sure why Ford did it that way, it doesn't APPEAR there's any reason for the lack of baffling on the passenger side (to clearance anything). The passenger side allows much more "windage" and disruption to the flung oil whereas the driver's side immediately contacts the flung oil and it drains back into the valve train.

 

[VoodooStang]

https://performanceparts.ford.com/part/M-6675-M52RR

 

[Gogoggansgo]

Ford Performance‘s recommendations are very conservative. Feedback from others running the cross plane crank 5.2 liter Coyote engines on track estimate their rebuilds are more like 80 track hours.

that’s what ducati puts the V4s at for rebuild

 

[Gogoggansgo]

What I’m impressed with is the power that the FP350s race engine has, 485 rwhp with stock exhaust and a conservative tune. Long tube headers should add 10-15 hp. The FP350s race engine runs very strong on track. The 5.2 liter flat plane crank production engine has about 445-450 rwhp and doesn‘t develop power until your above 3,500 rpm

The FP350s race engine has a cross plane crank in it. The Voodoo production engine has a flat plane crank. They do sound different. A lot depends on the exhaust system. I’m running cats so the exhaust note is quiet. The car behind me has an FP350s race engine and long tube headers without cats. It’s very loud.

you also need to remember they also blue print all of the frpp spec engines, that includes the aluminators. you’re up about 10-15whp over a run of the mill voodoo which is very interesting. More than likely the result of them balancing the living shit out of it and putting the engine together with a fine tooth comb “good ring pack, deck plant honed correctly lol, getting the cam degrees perfect” . This is also why the FPC was never really much of anything more than a gimmick from the standpoint of making the engine better than if Ford just used a CPC.

 

[Gogoggansgo]

CPC fires every 90* while FPC fires every 180* so a CPC has more torque down low, but the CPC weighs more (in this case 4-5lbs. more) so it revs slower.

the crank shaft on the voodoo weighs 50 pounds the CPC crank which Ford uses across the board is 55 pounds
Ford had to rig the FPC to work correctly in the coyote architecture. It’s been well documented on all the things Ford had to do, to make it work and what they had to give up. The point is the voodoo is a A compromised engine from the development standpoint as it isn’t a real FPC by firing order and intake Dynamics. They couldn’t use twin throttle bodies like Ferrari so they had to re do the firing order from scratch and ending up having to add weight back to the crankshaft. Ford also couldn’t use equal length headers because of packaging and emissions for catalyst light off. So as a result the gt350 has an odd sound track and the guys jerking off to it having a flat plane crank being the reason why it’s makes 526hp, is a bit stupid lol. but the point is if you had to replace a voodoo with a 5.2 CPC engine you won’t miss out on anything other than the cool sound.

this also comes around too why Ford is ending production of the gt350 and why a lot of the racing guys aren’t using the FPC engine. And that’s very simple “NVH” Ford used an Ferrari 458 for NVH development and a California for general development. The reality is the voodoo has major vibration issues and Ford hasn’t been able to fix them over time. This is a direct result of having to make a one off FPC engine that isn’t a traditional one. It’s like taking an XBOX and running an emulator to play older games. Ford worked harder to make the voodoo engine work than it was to just make a new engine from the ground up. I can’t stress that enough

 

[RPDBlueMoon]

So as a result the gt350 has an odd sound track and the guys jerking off to it having a flat plane crank being the reason why it’s makes 526hp, is a bit stupid lol.

LOL you made me laugh.

Isn't the Voodoo the first widely available FPC engine to be put in a car thats not a high end Ferrari or Porsche? From my understanding the other two FPC V8 engines is the one from the Ferrari and the one in the Porsche 918. So wouldn't you say that the Voodoo is better than those? Ferraris are not know for their reliability, and break often..

 

[Gogoggansgo]

LOL you made me laugh.

Isn't the Voodoo the first widely available FPC engine to be put in a car thats not a high end Ferrari or Porsche? From my understanding the other two FPC V8 engines is the one from the Ferrari and the one in the Porsche 918. So wouldn't you say that the Voodoo is better than those? Ferraris are not know for their reliability, and break often..

Ferrari also doesn’t void your warranty at the track, and Ferrari’s big issue is the same old song and dance, it’ll be everything but the engine and drivetrain lmfao. it’s not an apples to apples comparison

and the flat plane crank specifically in the voodoo does nothing as far as making power it’s not like they added the FPC and went wow we got 50 more hp LOL. It helps with bay To bay breathing but like i said they had to rig it to work within the constraints of the platform. As a result it’s not a traditional FPC engine which is why it’s gotten an odd reputation since it’s gotten out and a lot of mis information floats around

 

[RPDBlueMoon]

Ferrari also doesn’t void your warranty at the track, and Ferrari’s big issue is the same old song and dance, it’ll be everything but the engine and drivetrain lmfao. it’s not an apples to apples comparison

and the flat plane crank specifically in the voodoo does nothing as far as making power it’s not like they added the FPC and went wow we got 50 more hp LOL. It helps with bay To bay breathing but like i said they had to rig it to work within the constraints of the platform. As a result it’s not a traditional FPC engine which is why it’s gotten an odd reputation since it’s gotten out and a lot of mis information floats around

Do you think the rumored C8 Z06 FPC V8 will suffer similar problems? I'm pretty sure GM doesn't have the funds to build a FPC V8 from the ground up

 

[Gogoggansgo]

Ferrari also doesn’t void your warranty at the track

and the flat plane crank specifically in the voodoo does nothing as far as making power it’s not like they added the FPC and went wow we got 50 more hp LOL. It helps with bay To bay breathing but like i said they had to rig it to work within the constraints of the platform. As a result it’s not a traditional FPC engine which is why it’s gotten an odd reputation since it’s gotten out and a lot of mis information floats around

Do you think the rumored C8 Z06 FPC V8 will suffer similar problems? I'm pretty sure GM doesn't have the funds to build a FPC V8 from the ground up

It’ll have issues but what will help them will be the packaging. they can literally make a Ferrari engine just with a Chevy badge on it

so they can use the traditional RLRL firing order and use a twin throttle body intake manifold, equal length headers. This is why the gt350 doesn’t act or sound like a Ferrari

the crank shaft is also considerably heavier in the GT350, in the 458 is 38 pounds if i recall and it’s 50 in the gt350, that is a direct result of them having to change the firing order and adding counterweights, because the engine would of been out of balance. I love the gt350 but all these changes Ford had to do doomed this engine for long term viability. Which is why it’s now Gone

Everyone needs to remember that all FPC engines have vibration issues, very few of them can last over 100,000 miles without having to be rebuilt and that includes the voodoo. I’d love to see someone beat on one for 100k miles in the real world

 

[honeybadger]

the crank shaft on the voodoo weighs 50 pounds the CPC crank which Ford uses across the board is 55 pounds
Ford had to rig the FPC to work correctly in the coyote architecture. It’s been well documented on all the things Ford had to do, to make it work and what they had to give up. The point is the voodoo is a A compromised engine from the development standpoint as it isn’t a real FPC by firing order and intake Dynamics. They couldn’t use twin throttle bodies like Ferrari so they had to re do the firing order from scratch and ending up having to add weight back to the crankshaft. Ford also couldn’t use equal length headers because of packaging and emissions for catalyst light off. So as a result the gt350 has an odd sound track and the guys jerking off to it having a flat plane crank being the reason why it’s makes 526hp, is a bit stupid lol. but the point is if you had to replace a voodoo with a 5.2 CPC engine you won’t miss out on anything other than the cool sound.

this also comes around too why Ford is ending production of the gt350 and why a lot of the racing guys aren’t using the FPC engine. And that’s very simple “NVH” Ford used an Ferrari 458 for NVH development and a California for general development. The reality is the voodoo has major vibration issues and Ford hasn’t been able to fix them over time. This is a direct result of having to make a one off FPC engine that isn’t a traditional one. It’s like taking an XBOX and running an emulator to play older games. Ford worked harder to make the voodoo engine work than it was to just make a new engine from the ground up. I can’t stress that enough

Voodoo crank is actually about 47lbs or so (mine was 47.2).

There's a lot to the posts above...some good info mixed in with some large assumptions. Not really going to debate every detail, but what I will say is that the CPC and FPC variants are both perfectly suitable for racing - it comes down to what type of RPM and power curve you want. If you want to ring it out and keep it there, the FPC is better (narrower power band, but smoother). If you want torque and lower RPMs, the CPC is better for that.

I agree with your sentiment about NVH, but that's a problem for all+ big displacement FPCs - not just Ford's (the C8R is having similar issues and there's a reason the European FPCs have a larger bore size compared to the stroke). A true, purpose-built FPC engine from Ford would be awesome and help solve some of the Voodoo's issues, but likely wont see that.

 

[Gogoggansgo]

Voodoo crank is actually about 47lbs or so (mine was 47.2).

There's a lot to the posts above...some good info mixed in with some large assumptions. Not really going to debate every detail, but what I will say is that the CPC and FPC variants are both perfectly suitable for racing - it comes down to what type of RPM and power curve you want. If you want to ring it out and keep it there, the FPC is better (narrower power band, but smoother). If you want torque and lower RPMs, the CPC is better for that.

I agree with your sentiment about NVH, but that's a problem for all+ big displacement FPCs - not just Ford's (the C8R is having similar issues and there's a reason the European FPCs have a larger bore size compared to the stroke). A true, purpose-built FPC engine from Ford would be awesome and help solve some of the Voodoo's issues, but likely wont see that.

FRPP officially said at launch it was 5 pounds less than the coyote crank which is 55 pounds i can post the link. I don’t doubt Ford spent a lot of time after the first few model years rebalancing the engine to try and help with the NVH. And that’s why i said it doesn’t matter who makes it, FPC engines are by their nature, Hard to make reliable

 

[honeybadger]

FRPP officially said at launch it was 5 pounds less than the coyote crank which is 55 pounds i can post the link. I don’t doubt Ford spent a lot of time after the first few model years rebalancing the engine to try and help with the NVH. And that’s why i said it doesn’t matter who makes it, FPC engines are by their nature, Hard to make reliable

Agreed. But there's also a reason they dominate in so many forms of racing - they rev more freely, make smoother power, and are lighter.

Doesn't mean they're right for everyone is every mustang built, but they have their place and when built right are something very special.

 

[GT30fan]

I think it is wise to recall many respected magazines and journalist have highly rated the GT350 as one of their top drivers choice (#2, beat only by Porsche new 911 at a much much higher price), also a "GOAT" (Greatest of all time) pick, etc. It is true that there may be a better way from a technical point of view if your only goal is to create power (electric motor?) , but I think Ford did this one to have a special driving experience.... and with the special sounds and (for a V8) HIGH RPM's, I will let the expert reviews do the talking for me. In mine, I do not have any more vibration or noise in the FPC than in my other cars.... so whatever Band-Aids they must of used, it works Any kid with daddy's money can buy a GT500 or get an A10 GT and reach out to Fathouse or Steeda and be faster, but then to some it's just another fast car but with what some might argue has less individual soul or personality.

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