Frustrated Motor Cutting Timing!

[Pistol_91]

If your tires are spinning and your solution to the problem is turning on TC. Then complain the car is pulling timing. Well no duh. Buy better tires if you wanna drag race. Traction control shouldnt even exist in drag racing. You have to completely disable advancetrac like ZX said. You can have regular TC off and it will still pull timing if you spin too much. Hold the button down, buy better tires. Problem solved

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[GrayMater22]

Yes 100%. Also there is tq management separate from TC that will shite on your parade.

Exactly, that has happened to me multiple times. I didn’t have these issues with my 392 or SS1LE , I guess the only real solution is some 305 drag radials and up the octane by at least 2-4 just to make sure I’m no leaning out in the upper rpm range.

 

[ZXMustang]

Exactly, that has happened to me multiple times. I didn’t have these issues with my 392 or SS1LE , I guess the only real solution is some 305 drag radials and up the octane by at least 2-4 just to make sure I’m no leaning out in the upper rpm range.

Get a wengerd tune also. You’ll shit when you feel the difference.

 

[furdfan2018]

So wait. Are you guys saying that timing still gets pulled on a WOT A10 dig even with TC off, if you haven’t also disabled Advance Trac?

100% correct

 

[GrayMater22]

If your tires are spinning and your solution to the problem is turning on TC. Then complain the car is pulling timing. Well no duh. Buy better tires if you wanna drag race. Traction control shouldnt even exist in drag racing. You have to completely disable advancetrac like ZX said. You can have regular TC off and it will still pull timing if you spin too much. Hold the button down, buy better tires. Problem solved

I wasn’t spinning when I had traction control off, I was doing 86mph at the 1/8 at 7.9, already hit third and then it cut my timing, maybe I hit the limiter, not sure wasn’t watching my tach and the damn helmet muffles the motor so much I couldn’t tell. I have extreme contactsport2’s and they actually hook pretty good, was running 29lbs in the rears.

 

[young at heart]

Yes 100%. Also there is tq management separate from TC that will shite on your parade.

Many thanks ZX and you too Pistol! GrayMater too.

I knew about shutting off TC of course and could then feel the car spinning even on the 2-3 upshift so I figured I was good. Can’t wait for a few warmer days here so I can try disabling Advance Trac too. I should have tried it before now but thought it was in the background to save the bacon “just in case”.

I’m also interested to see how it helps my manual Mach 1.

I‘ve had and enjoyed a lot of fast cars in my long life but I don’t remember anything bone stock that could hang with my so far bone stock Mach 1s. Or my GT either for that matter. I romp ‘em pretty good and I’m not afraid of them but I do respect them. Don’t want to wind up on YouTube.

 

[Pistol_91]

I have had the car cut timing from having normal TC off, advanctrac on, at high speeds and high RPMs. The TC light wouldn't come on and the log wouldn't even show TC interfering. Turn advancetrac off and then I noticed the tires spinning once in higher speeds higher RPMs. The TC would notice it faster than me and shut the timing down quicker than I knew what happened. Such little spin TC would react so fast that it wouldn't show in the log. Always disable AdvTC unless you're ok with it interfering. Now on the other hand... I have had TC off, advancetrac on, and ripped it in 2nd and it blows the tires off and never cuts timing. Almost like everything was disabled. The TC system on these cars are weird.

 

[ice445]

I have had the car cut timing from having normal TC off, advanctrac on, at high speeds and high RPMs. The TC light wouldn't come on and the log wouldn't even show TC interfering. Turn advancetrac off and then I noticed the tires spinning once in higher speeds higher RPMs. The TC would notice it faster than me and shut the timing down quicker than I knew what happened. Such little spin TC would react so fast that it wouldn't show in the log. Always disable AdvTC unless you're ok with it interfering. Now on the other hand... I have had TC off, advancetrac on, and ripped it in 2nd and it blows the tires off and never cuts timing. Almost like everything was disabled. The TC system on these cars are weird.

Yeah, it's honestly not a great system. It's so quick to take away all your power when nothing yaw related is happening, and other times it seems like it's completely asleep and lets you fling the ass out across three lanes.

My car in particular feels like it gains at least 50 horsepower when I totally turn it off, and especially on my winter set I can just blaze them without effort, whereas when it's on it never lets me do anything. But I'm a baby and the car with all the assists off scares me so I almost never do it, lmao.

 

[Andy13186]

Track mode then TOGGLE tcs off, even though TCS off illuminates automatically when you put it in track mode like the OP was doing is the best mode. It will say TCS off, and it wont cut power when spinning and you will still have advancetrac. This is the only mode that I can use that doesnt cut power on shifts without Advancetrac totally disabled.


OP was already in the best mode, and his only problem was having to pedal the car. If he totally disables advancetrac he will have to do the same exact thing and pedal the car anyway, so totally disabling advancetrac is pointless. The solution is good drag radials and/or change suspension. You could also try a 2nd gear launch.

For 2nd gear launch without a 2nd gear launch tune, you put the shifter in S when you are stopped at the line ready to launch and paddle it up to 2nd gear then smash it on the green and after you take off, pop the shifter into D so it will automatically shift for you.

 

[KingKona]

...or you need to completely turn off traction control/advanced track by holding the button up for like 10 seconds. You will get the advanced track off message on the dash.....

Unfortunately, that doesn't really do anything. TC/AT is still on, just less.

 

[ZXMustang]

Unfortunately, that doesn't really do anything. TC/AT is still on, just less.

No its not. Not sure where you heard that from, but its 100% false. I have hundreds of datalogs from street and track runs with both AT on and off. When its off, the only source for tq reduction is tq management tables in the tune. TC/AT is not a tq source when its turned off.

 

[KingKona]

No its not. Not sure where you heard that from, but its 100% false. I have hundreds of datalogs from street and track runs with both AT on and off. When its off, the only source for tq reduction is tq management tables in the tune. TC/AT is not a tq source when its turned off.

And I've held the button, seen the lights pop on saying everything is off, then had traction control kick on in wintery, icy conditions. Just when I didn't need it.

Trust me, unless you pull the fuse, there's always some TC/SC/ST

 

[ZXMustang]

And I've held the button, seen the lights pop on saying everything is off, then had traction control kick on in wintery, icy conditions. Just when I didn't need it.

Trust me, unless you pull the fuse, there's always some TC/SC/ST

Trust me, there isnt. I trust the logs over internet forum "trust me" posts. As I said I have logs and logs of my car as well as a few others from street pulls and at the track. With whipple cars, turbo cars and e85 NA cars. When you turn off AT/TC completely, you're not getting traction control. You might be getting tq management from the trans or engine side. But no TC. Sure you can pull the dyno plug to keep it all off. But there is no difference between pulling the plug vs turning it off. Especially if you have the tq tables in the tune setup correctly. There a few other scenarios where you will get tq management. Most have to do with the car's logic to sense wheel hop, clutch protection and ABS events. But if you are doing it right, at the track you shouldnt need to do anything more than hold the button to turn off AT/TC. Then you are free to do burnouts and have complete control of the car without the TC nanny coming in.

Now what I CAN tell you is that you will get tq reduction in lesser modes like sport and track vs drag where you will not see any tq reduction unless you hit the tq ceiling in the tune. At that point its just a matter of changing some tables to up your tq limits. Most people raise them to 738lb ft.

 

[GrayMater22]

Trust me, there isnt. I trust the logs over internet forum "trust me" posts. As I said I have logs and logs of my car as well as a few others from street pulls and at the track. With whipple cars, turbo cars and e85 NA cars. When you turn off AT/TC completely, you're not getting traction control. You might be getting tq management from the trans or engine side. But no TC. Sure you can pull the dyno plug to keep it all off. But there is no difference between pulling the plug vs turning it off. Especially if you have the tq tables in the tune setup correctly. There a few other scenarios where you will get tq management. Most have to do with the car's logic to sense wheel hop, clutch protection and ABS events. But if you are doing it right, at the track you shouldnt need to do anything more than hold the button to turn off AT/TC. Then you are free to do burnouts and have complete control of the car without the TC nanny coming in.

Now what I CAN tell you is that you will get tq reduction in lesser modes like sport and track vs drag where you will not see any tq reduction unless you hit the tq ceiling in the tune. At that point its just a matter of changing some tables to up your tq limits. Most people raise them to 738lb ft.

I would agree with that, before I did my IRS alignment, braces, shocks/struts and tune, I ran full drag mode with TC/AT off and it almost put me in the wall from 2nd to 3rd gear. There was 0 nanny interference on that run, that is the one and only time at the drag strip I almost lost control of the car.

 

[KingKona]

Trust me, there isnt. I trust the logs over internet forum "trust me" posts.

Yes there is. Whether you chose to accept that reality is immaterial. Anyone (including you) can try what I've done, and see the truth for themselves.

Unless you pull the plug, it's still on. Just less.

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