Electric Mustangs = End of road racing’s future?

[Bear376]

Have learned a few things yesterday about running EVs on the track. It makes me wonder if the future will ever see Mustangs that can go from street to track when they go electric? A Tesla did some runs a Hallet recently. After each 15 minutes on the track, it took 90 minutes to recharge for another session. And the regenerative braking was not suitable for the track. The Mach E is worse since using max power will overheat the system. The worse issue is going to be the batteries. If, for any reason they catch fire, there is no effective way to put it out. Standard fire suppression with water or foam is not going to work and if it reacts with the lithium, can makes things worse. Using water, even if it does not react, would take several tankers worth. California fire departments are looking at a policy of just letting the cars burn. Not many tracks can afford to deal with the issues that might create. It is beginning to look like the political push to go total electric is going to create a return to the early seventies when they gutted performance and people could not fill their cars.

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[Tomster]

A lithium battery in a car is nothing but an array of many cells put together. Did you ever see a lithium battery explode? All you have to do is puncture it or damage it in a certain way and all that energy is released causing a chain reaction with the other lithium cells in the array. Its not a pretty sight.

Instead of making lithium batteries more energy dense, manufacturers are trying to develop safer cells that are not as dangerous.

I have an electric low speed vehicle (street legal golf cart) and for the above reason i have not made the transition to lithium batteries. If they were to ever "let go" it would most certainly burn the garage down. Likewise with one of those Tesla walls of power. Man, that is a crapload of energy that if released, would burn and destroy anything around it.

 

[shogun32]

It is beginning to look like the political push to go total electric is going to create a return to the early seventies when they gutted performance and people could not fill their cars.

That was patently OBVIOUS to one and all who bothered to crack open a Physics and Chemistry textbook back in high school. Political solutions are without fail the STUPIDEST and most DANGEROUS course of action because they are predicated on ignoring reality and cold, hard facts.

 

[Cobra Jet]

There's already been multiple EV fires where the FD's not only here, but overseas as well can't extinguish the EV vehicle fire effectively or efficiently. There's been reported instances of it taking literally HOURS to extinguish a single EV fire.

In most cases, they have to let the vehicle burn out - at which point and in every instance, the vehicle is a total loss.

There was a parking garage fire in Germany that was the result of an initial EV fire - the garage and other vehicles in it were a loss. IIRC, the article stated some parking garages in Germany now ban EVs due to the result of that incident.
https://www.motorbiscuit.com/fire-danger-underground-parking-lot-bans-electric-vehicles/

https://motorillustrated.com/an-underground-parking-lot-in-germany-bans-electrified-cars/70167/

People aren't looking at the big picture of EVs from the initial mining of the materials, to the production aspect, to the literal dangers IF something happens while or during assembly or during ownership, to the end of battery life when the owners can't afford a battery replacement after warranty period and the thing ends up in recycling limbo.... and once recycled, the energy and pollution needed to recycling that battery on a grand scale will be will be massive.

All that is happening is the money is exchanging hands and lining people's pockets to getting tax cuts and incentives for "going green" when going full EV is not the answer to going green. It's just offsetting the supposed problem into another bucket.

It's going to be fun watching though.

Manufacturers are already putting clauses in Warranty Booklets that EV battery drain is commonplace and "normal".... Just find and read the Mock-E Owner's Manual and Warranty pages - I already have, it's a joke.

Get ready for the whammies when those EV packs are out of warranty and it will cost the consumer $8k-$10k for a battery replacement... Who's going to dump $10k into a depreciating vehicle? They'll just run out and buy another. It's like buying a battery powered weed whacker for $150 and the lithium battery back craps - the replacement pack is $90... Are you going to spend $90 on just a battery when you can spend another $150 to get the most current replacement weed whacker? Vehicles will be more like throw away toys more than ever with this grand "Let's go 100% EV" ideology... The salvage facilities and landfills will be over burdened with a staggering amount of giant EV battery packs - wait and see.

We're not going green, we're going dumber, blind and deaf... but keep that $$$$ rolling in to line the coffers....

 

[CJJon]

We need to ditch the battery and rare Earth metals and go with the most abundant element in the universe instead - Hydrogen.

 

[br_an]

We're not going green, we're going dumber, blind and deaf... but keep that $$$$ rolling in to line the coffers....

 

[Balr14]

When I had RC cars and helicopters, I charged my lipo batteries in an open area of the basement floor, inside an old ammo box. They are very unpredictable. I have had old lipo batteries I intentionally tried to explode (so they couldn't do it unintentionally). I beat on them with a hammer, drove a nail into them, pour water on them, nothing! But, just let one discharge too far and recharge it too fast and poof (maybe)!

Lipo batteries are supposed to be safer than li-ion batteries, but I have never had a li-ion battery go bad, while I have seen several lipos burn.

I am all in favor of EVs. But, battery technology and their environmental impact has a long way to go.

 

[br_an]

That reminds me of that boat fire in 2019 that killed 34 people. If I recall correctly, it is suspected charging batteries may have ignited causing the fire, but lack of smoke detectors and improper training led to a disaster. It's a sad story

 

[shogun32]

it is suspected charging batteries may have ignited causing the fire

cell phone and freaking 'action' cameras no less. You have to be certifiable IMO to park an EV within a residential structure that isn't pure concrete and steel. But there goes the whole high-amp charger setup. Next up suing your neighbor for garaging their EV in a row-house because now 4+ families are at risk of being burned out of a home. You know this is coming - high insurance rates because your neighbor was fool enough to buy an EV and put a high-rate charger in the home.

I don't have the actuarial data but wanna bet the insurance guys aren't going to wade into big-time cross-referencing EV purchases amongst themselves? When you have a known self-ignition source and no effective means of controlling the inferno let alone putting the fire out, it should demand stratospheric insurance rates.

A couple years back the entire Moto-E paddock burned to the ground (well, all the bikes and their batteries) because there was a fire during the overnight charging and it was at least 3 months before replacements could be sourced. WW2 subs sank from battery fires (well, also hydrogen explosions).

 

[DougS550]

That was patently OBVIOUS to one and all who bothered to crack open a Physics and Chemistry textbook back in high school. Political solutions are without fail the STUPIDEST and most DANGEROUS course of action because they are predicated on ignoring reality and cold, hard facts.

I would never, Never own a EV car. Not just because I think they are a hazardous waist dump and useless for my travels, but because the Dip shit Extremist who are trying to shove this bullshit crap down my throat. Period,

 

[bluebeastsrt]

Unfortunately Nancy polosi’s husband has already invested heavily in EV stocks. So needless to say it’s happening!

 

[BMAGOO]

As an electrician I can tell you that it's going to get interesting when/if the majority of people own EV's. The transformers in neighborhoods aren't large enough to be able to charge more than a few EV's at the same time along with the original demand. They would need to re-do the whole electrical grid. Transformers, supply conductors, house service, etc. How costly will that be ? Not to mention what the local power company decides to do with rates. They'll have you bent over a barrel with no lube and nothing you can do about it !

 

[Norm Peterson]

Have learned a few things yesterday about running EVs on the track. It makes me wonder if the future will ever see Mustangs that can go from street to track when they go electric? A Tesla did some runs a Hallet recently. After each 15 minutes on the track, it took 90 minutes to recharge for another session. And the regenerative braking was not suitable for the track. The Mach E is worse since using max power will overheat the system. The worse issue is going to be the batteries. If, for any reason they catch fire, there is no effective way to put it out. Standard fire suppression with water or foam is not going to work and if it reacts with the lithium, can makes things worse. Using water, even if it does not react, would take several tankers worth. California fire departments are looking at a policy of just letting the cars burn. Not many tracks can afford to deal with the issues that might create. It is beginning to look like the political push to go total electric is going to create a return to the early seventies when they gutted performance and people could not fill their cars.

SCCA is already looking into the matter of tracks allowing EVs on track, which ones will and which ones won't.


Norm

 

[DougS550]

As an electrician I can tell you that it's going to get interesting when/if the majority of people own EV's. The transformers in neighborhoods aren't large enough to be able to charge more than a few EV's at the same time along with the original demand. They would need to re-do the whole electrical grid. Transformers, supply conductors, house service, etc. How costly will that be ? Not to mention what the local power company decides to do with rates. They'll have you bent over a barrel with no lube and nothing you can do about it !

That don't care about how much it cost or how much they spend or the debt they put on the tax payers. Remember: They all think money comes from the "Money Fairy", all you have to do is just print more and that will fix everything. What Idiots running our country. Most barely have a High school degree and couldn't add 1+1=2 without getting it wrong. Common Core Math Idiots.

 

[WildHorse]

EV's are 1 lap hail mary machines. They can't go rounds. Race a tesla plaid, then immediately race it again and compare times.

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