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Deatschwerks brushless

AEF42

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Any thoughts, input on this product?

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LethalPerformance

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Any thoughts, input on this product?

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Nice looking setup. Just don't know anyone running one at the moment.

Feel free to reach out if you have any other fueling questions and we'll be glad to assist you.
 

Angrey

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Any thoughts, input on this product?

05A091AD-3C0A-4F3F-9B3C-B1494A7CE18A.png
This is part of my build/fuel system plan. I've decided to use the pwm controller (in conjunction with another pwm source). You should speak with Dakota and DW if you have any questions, they're very helpful.

The power wiring doesn't need to be 4 wire all the way to the pump (the 4th can be direct ground).

The 440's have a 42mm casing (opposed to a typical 39mm case for most 500 type pumps (267,274,285,295, etc) so you should factor that in (it's a little bit fatter). I have no idea if that will work with the OEM hanger provisions but it will NOT work with the current DW hanger (which has provisions for a 46mm case and then an insert for a 39mm case, but I suppose you could fab or source an interim size spacer to make it work or see if DW has created something). I don't think most of the other fuel hats on the market (divison X, etc) will work without some sort of customization. I chose to get the Radium hat for it's pump mounting flexibility (and other provisions at the top with electrical connectors).

The 440 instructions are pretty detailed and they give you most everything you need to modify your OEM hat, but someone would have to verify it will fit in the OEM hat (diameter). The venturi nozzle comes plugged so you can drill it if you want to use it or you can leave it plugged if you want to tap off the main feed or the return line to push the jet syphons.
 

AEF42

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Thanks for the response, are you speaking of Dakota @ Lund?
It sounds like it was made to function in a stock hat considering they “they give you most everything you need to modify your OEM hat”

We just don’t know of any one that’s done this at this point ?
what did you have to do to modify your Radium hat? Are you running 2 of these pumps? Obviously return system. What power level are you setting up for? Fuel?

thanks




This is part of my build/fuel system plan. I've decided to use the pwm controller (in conjunction with another pwm source). You should speak with Dakota and DW if you have any questions, they're very helpful.

The power wiring doesn't need to be 4 wire all the way to the pump (the 4th can be direct ground).

The 440's have a 42mm casing (opposed to a typical 39mm case for most 500 type pumps (267,274,285,295, etc) so you should factor that in (it's a little bit fatter). I have no idea if that will work with the OEM hanger provisions but it will NOT work with the current DW hanger (which has provisions for a 46mm case and then an insert for a 39mm case, but I suppose you could fab or source an interim size spacer to make it work or see if DW has created something). I don't think most of the other fuel hats on the market (divison X, etc) will work without some sort of customization. I chose to get the Radium hat for it's pump mounting flexibility (and other provisions at the top with electrical connectors).

The 440 instructions are pretty detailed and they give you most everything you need to modify your OEM hat, but someone would have to verify it will fit in the OEM hat (diameter). The venturi nozzle comes plugged so you can drill it if you want to use it or you can leave it plugged if you want to tap off the main feed or the return line to push the jet syphons.
[/QUOTE]
 

Angrey

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No, Dakota at DW. Very helpful.

I'm knocking on the door of doing the fuel system, I'm just knee deep in all the motor/driveline stuff.

I guess I should have clarified, they give you all the components to work (bulkhead adapter, hoses, etc) but whether or not it'll actually fit in the OEM hanger I don't know. I'm a couple of weeks or so away from yanking my hanger out and starting to dig into the fuel setup. I can take some photos and check then to see if the fatter cases will fit without modification.

I have plans for xxxx rwhp CAPABLE on E-85 so twin 440's and I don't think I'll have to boost them, but it's always an option later. DW makes some pretty killer stuff. The 440 is capable of being constantly boosted to 18V and intermittently to 22 volts but DW claims if you boost it constant a little higher it won't hurt it a bit. So I'd speak with them, if you go this route it could save you some money if you just want to use one pump and boost it. They could tell you what the output would be if you boosted it to 18 or 20v. A single 440 spun hard would probably have comparable flow to a non-boosted walbro twin setup (and draw about the same current as those two pumps combined). Brushless is a wonderful (but expensive) improvement.
 

engineermike

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FWIW I believe a single pump to be much preferable over twin (or more) pumps. I’ve run multiple pumps before with boost pressure switches triggering the 2nd. The problem is you don’t know if there is a problem with your 2nd pump until it’s too late. A single pump with a problem will generally give you some indication before you get to full boost/rpm.
 

AEF42

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I’m wanting to drop this pump in an 18 Stage 2 whipple car add ID1050s and go E85 safely 700-800whp
If it could replace the DW400 in the stock hat and be a return less fuel system. What are the flaws in this idea?
 

Angrey

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I’m wanting to drop this pump in an 18 Stage 2 whipple car add ID1050s and go E85 safely 700-800whp
If it could replace the DW400 in the stock hat and be a return less fuel system. What are the flaws in this idea?
No flaws, but the 440 has a larger casing. Someone is gonna have to see if the OEM basket can accommodate the fatter pump(s) or what modifications need to be made to allow them to fit. If you're not planning on running a return line, you need to get the PWM controller version.

The other "flaw" is that many of what I would call "maintstream" tuners won't tune the car if you don't follow a tried and true fuel delivery method. I won't speak for them, but you should call the tuner you plan on using prior to this approach (like I did) and see if they'll tune it with what you've done.
 

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sabtaj1

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I’m wanting to drop this pump in an 18 Stage 2 whipple car add ID1050s and go E85 safely 700-800whp
If it could replace the DW400 in the stock hat and be a return less fuel system. What are the flaws in this idea?
I was thinking the same thing.... Brushless is by far better.... But fuel line size could be a factor too. I dunno but very interested
 

AEF42

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Is the GT500 running 2 pumps? I know they tuned and went id1050 on stock fuel system
Not sure if they went E85 as well?
 

AEF42

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No flaws, but the 440 has a larger casing. Someone is gonna have to see if the OEM basket can accommodate the fatter pump(s) or what modifications need to be made to allow them to fit. If you're not planning on running a return line, you need to get the PWM controller version.

The other "flaw" is that many of what I would call "maintstream" tuners won't tune the car if you don't follow a tried and true fuel delivery method. I won't speak for them, but you should call the tuner you plan on using prior to this approach (like I did) and see if they'll tune it with what you've done.

Would this require a BAP?
 

Angrey

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Would this require a BAP?
Not sure I'm understanding your question. A booster is never required, just a method for getting more flow out of a pump or pump(s) rather than upgrading them.

The 440 is particularly capable in this regard as you can boost it all the way to 18v continuous or intermittently to 22 volts. Speaking with DW, that's probably underrated but that's what they've published. That means at desired peak pressure, it's gonna spin harder and give you significantly more flow (and more current draw obviously). You'd have to ask DW what the flow rates are at 18v and 20v and 22v, etc.
 

AEF42

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Not sure I'm understanding your question. A booster is never required, just a method for getting more flow out of a pump or pump(s) rather than upgrading them.

The 440 is particularly capable in this regard as you can boost it all the way to 18v continuous or intermittently to 22 volts. Speaking with DW, that's probably underrated but that's what they've published. That means at desired peak pressure, it's gonna spin harder and give you significantly more flow (and more current draw obviously). You'd have to ask DW what the flow rates are at 18v and 20v and 22v, etc.
I guess my question is will the factory pump controller give more voltage if needed or will it be the standard 13-14 v only?
 

Angrey

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I guess my question is will the factory pump controller give more voltage if needed or will it be the standard 13-14 v only?
The controller will not boost the system voltage (generally 12-14 volts, but around 13.5 v when healthy). The controller will only control how much dwell time is in between the PWM pulses and thus how much effort the pump is putting out at that system voltage. If you want to boost, you'll have to buy a booster.
 

AEF42

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The controller will not boost the system voltage (generally 12-14 volts, but around 13.5 v when healthy). The controller will only control how much dwell time is in between the PWM pulses and thus how much effort the pump is putting out at that system voltage. If you want to boost, you'll have to buy a booster.
Thanks Angrey I appreciate you sharing you’re knowledge. This stuff is way over my head. Lol.
 

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