Cracked R carbon wheel

[MikeR397]

I’ve got track days coming up sat, sun, and Tuesday after being out for 6 weeks When ac compressor bolts sheered off in my block. Excited to get the car back, I scheduled the track days yesterday, Hand washed the car, took the rear wheels off and some new tires to the dealer to get mounted and be ready for the 3 days (rears were heat cycled out)...Dealer just text me one of the rear carbon wheels is cracked outside and inside. It is still holding air, and I didn’t notice it hand drying last night, but obviously the wheel it toast. My rear tires have 40% tread but are heat cycled out, no potholes or impacts that I’m aware of, no bulges on the tire, so I’m pretty damn shocked to hear this.

Thank the baby Jesus I am in year 2 of my 5 year wheel and tire warranty (i paid $1,080 for when I bought the car) that will presumably cover this, and also that I picked up a spare set of wheels I can use for these upcoming three non-refundable track days waiting on a new wheel to come in. Btw, my dealers price on the R rear wheel is just over $7,000 after tax...

Two pics the dealer just sent me. He said the other wheel looks good but I’m going to closely inspect everything, especially the front on same side. This is damn scary to think it could have failed at 140mph at grattan this weekend. Really happy they caught this.

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[key01]

Hmmm,What happens when you accidently drop one of these on its rim? Good you have insurance to cover it.
Gratten is the track with that "toilet bowl", right? I remember from my old SCCA days.

 

[MikeR397]

Hmmm,What happens when you accidently drop one of these on its rim? Good you have insurance to cover it.
Gratten is the track with that "toilet bowl", right? I remember from my old SCCA days.

I’d like to see it in person if possible. I just dropped these off 1.5hrs ago. It’s possible the dealer dropped it or did it mounting a new tire, but they have the latest hunter touchless mountjng machine and claim 2 people mount these wheels together given their value. It doesn’t matter to me I guess, one way or another, I need a new tire and ain’t paying for it. Hopefully no issues with the warranty but I don’t see how their could be.

Yes, grattan has the toilet bowl, lots of blind apex and camber in the corners.

 

[CliffClavin]

Did you get the warranty through the dealer at time of purchase? I'll definitely be looking into this when I pick up my car.

 

[oldbmwfan]

Following. Lots to say here - I have a story I haven't shared with the forum yet as I'm trying to get it resolved through Ford. Also related to Grattan (was there in late July) and a CF wheel (pics coming).

I have a 2017 R and also purchased a 6-year wheel/tire warranty for ~$1500 at the time of vehicle purchase. I heard after that they did not allow that plan to be sold on 18+ Rs, likely because they figured out how $$$$ the wheels are!

Now, I had a bit of a freak failure at Grattan. After a short (~6-lap) session with no issues, I came off the track and parked in the paddock. When I jumped back in the car several minutes later and moved it, there was a massive noise. The CF wheel barrel had literally bubbled inward on my front left tire with a welt the size of a large egg. The swelling of the barrel caused flakes of the ceramic coating to flake off. The raised/ indented portion was hitting the caliper (hence the noise).

At the time, I was amazed. I put the SV501s with street tires back on and finished the track day. It also happens that a friend of mine who was at the track with me works for FP, and he knew the GT500 guys were testing at Gingerman (another Michigan track ~2 hours away). That guy actually called his colleagues, sent pictures of my wheel, drove over to Gingerman, and came back with a CF wheel and a good-condition PSC2 so I could finish the next day of the event on good rubber. I drove home after the event, wrapped up the CF wheel, and shipped it right back to Ford Performance. That is service! (Also helps to be connected).

Pics:
Immediately when it happened, wheel still on car.

Bubble in barrel viewed from outside the spokes.

Bubble in barrel viewed from the back of the wheel. Note there are two areas of damage to the ceramic heat coating, one where it flaked as the underlying structure bubbled up, and one where the raised portion scraped on the caliper for the 30 or so feet that I drove the car.

Now, that was the good part of the story. The rest is not so good.
- Took the wheel/tire with the damage to my dealership. They tried to warranty it (bumper to bumper). Ford rejected it and said "not a manufacturing defect" (the dealer service techs believe it is, and I agree - seems unlikely to be driving damage because the tire was totally unharmed, and I have video showing I didn't go off, bang curbs, etc. while on track).
- Escalated the warranty claim, rejected again
- Opened a case with FCSD, and they said "we can't overrule the warranty department"
- Tried to warranty it under the supplemental wheel/tire warranty, and they said "nope, this is for road hazard and that is not road impact damage"

So now Ford has my wheel/tire hostage and I am down one CF wheel (and one BRAND NEW, 6-lap-used MPSC2 tire) for going on a MONTH. It's absolutely ridiculous. I have TWO warranties that should cover this part, and I'm getting the shaft.

Hope you get yours replace faster! I'll keep this thread updated on mine too, unless this is a massive hijack (OP just tell me and I'll split this into a separate thread).

 

[key01]

OMG. Never in a million years would I expect to see something like that on any type of wheel construction.

 

[Tank]

Following. Lots to say here - I have a story I haven't shared with the forum yet as I'm trying to get it resolved through Ford. Also related to Grattan (was there in late July) and a CF wheel (pics coming).

I have a 2017 R and also purchased a 6-year wheel/tire warranty for ~$1500 at the time of vehicle purchase. I heard after that they did not allow that plan to be sold on 18+ Rs, likely because they figured out how $$$$ the wheels are!

Now, I had a bit of a freak failure at Grattan. After a short (~6-lap) session with no issues, I came off the track and parked in the paddock. When I jumped back in the car several minutes later and moved it, there was a massive noise. The CF wheel barrel had literally bubbled inward on my front left tire with a welt the size of a large egg. The swelling of the barrel caused flakes of the ceramic coating to flake off. The raised/ indented portion was hitting the caliper (hence the noise).

At the time, I was amazed. I put the SV501s with street tires back on and finished the track day. It also happens that a friend of mine who was at the track with me works for FP, and he knew the GT500 guys were testing at Gingerman (another Michigan track ~2 hours away). That guy actually called his colleagues, sent pictures of my wheel, drove over to Gingerman, and came back with a CF wheel and a good-condition PSC2 so I could finish the next day of the event on good rubber. I drove home after the event, wrapped up the CF wheel, and shipped it right back to Ford Performance. That is service! (Also helps to be connected).

Pics:
Immediately when it happened, wheel still on car.

Bubble in barrel viewed from outside the spokes.

Bubble in barrel viewed from the back of the wheel. Note there are two areas of damage to the ceramic heat coating, one where it flaked as the underlying structure bubbled up, and one where the raised portion scraped on the caliper for the 30 or so feet that I drove the car.

Now, that was the good part of the story. The rest is not so good.
- Took the wheel/tire with the damage to my dealership. They tried to warranty it (bumper to bumper). Ford rejected it and said "not a manufacturing defect" (the dealer service techs believe it is, and I agree - seems unlikely to be driving damage because the tire was totally unharmed, and I have video showing I didn't go off, bang curbs, etc. while on track).
- Escalated the warranty claim, rejected again
- Opened a case with FCSD, and they said "we can't overrule the warranty department"
- Tried to warranty it under the supplemental wheel/tire warranty, and they said "nope, this is for road hazard and that is not road impact damage"

So now Ford has my wheel/tire hostage and I am down one CF wheel (and one BRAND NEW, 6-lap-used MPSC2 tire) for going on a MONTH. It's absolutely ridiculous. I have TWO warranties that should cover this part, and I'm getting the shaft.

Hope you get yours replace faster! I'll keep this thread updated on mine too, unless this is a massive hijack (OP just tell me and I'll split this into a separate thread).

Wow, that’s a story....

Ford should step up and make you whole @oldbmwfan .

Good luck, I hope they come to their senses sooner rather than later..

 

[lightrules]

@oldbmwfan , crazy story. i hope Ford makes a way to cover both you guys. Subbed.

 

[obspsd]

That bubble is very interesting.

 

[MikeR397]

Did you get the warranty through the dealer at time of purchase? I'll definitely be looking into this when I pick up my car.

Yes

 

[lightrules]

Did you get the warranty through the dealer at time of purchase? I'll definitely be looking into this when I pick up my car.

i dont think they offer this warranty anymore for the R wheels.

 

[PP0001]

Following. Lots to say here - I have a story I haven't shared with the forum yet as I'm trying to get it resolved through Ford. Also related to Grattan (was there in late July) and a CF wheel (pics coming).

I have a 2017 R and also purchased a 6-year wheel/tire warranty for ~$1500 at the time of vehicle purchase. I heard after that they did not allow that plan to be sold on 18+ Rs, likely because they figured out how $$$$ the wheels are!

Now, I had a bit of a freak failure at Grattan. After a short (~6-lap) session with no issues, I came off the track and parked in the paddock. When I jumped back in the car several minutes later and moved it, there was a massive noise. The CF wheel barrel had literally bubbled inward on my front left tire with a welt the size of a large egg. The swelling of the barrel caused flakes of the ceramic coating to flake off. The raised/ indented portion was hitting the caliper (hence the noise).

At the time, I was amazed. I put the SV501s with street tires back on and finished the track day. It also happens that a friend of mine who was at the track with me works for FP, and he knew the GT500 guys were testing at Gingerman (another Michigan track ~2 hours away). That guy actually called his colleagues, sent pictures of my wheel, drove over to Gingerman, and came back with a CF wheel and a good-condition PSC2 so I could finish the next day of the event on good rubber. I drove home after the event, wrapped up the CF wheel, and shipped it right back to Ford Performance. That is service! (Also helps to be connected).

Pics:
Immediately when it happened, wheel still on car.

Bubble in barrel viewed from outside the spokes.

Bubble in barrel viewed from the back of the wheel. Note there are two areas of damage to the ceramic heat coating, one where it flaked as the underlying structure bubbled up, and one where the raised portion scraped on the caliper for the 30 or so feet that I drove the car.

Now, that was the good part of the story. The rest is not so good.
- Took the wheel/tire with the damage to my dealership. They tried to warranty it (bumper to bumper). Ford rejected it and said "not a manufacturing defect" (the dealer service techs believe it is, and I agree - seems unlikely to be driving damage because the tire was totally unharmed, and I have video showing I didn't go off, bang curbs, etc. while on track).
- Escalated the warranty claim, rejected again
- Opened a case with FCSD, and they said "we can't overrule the warranty department"
- Tried to warranty it under the supplemental wheel/tire warranty, and they said "nope, this is for road hazard and that is not road impact damage"

So now Ford has my wheel/tire hostage and I am down one CF wheel (and one BRAND NEW, 6-lap-used MPSC2 tire) for going on a MONTH. It's absolutely ridiculous. I have TWO warranties that should cover this part, and I'm getting the shaft.

Hope you get yours replace faster! I'll keep this thread updated on mine too, unless this is a massive hijack (OP just tell me and I'll split this into a separate thread).

I absolutely hate to hear situations and stories like this whereby you have made sure that everything is in place such as paid up front warranties and also from what I can tell this incident has no reflection on you being negligent in any way and suggest that the Carbon Revolution wheel may have been faulty right from manufacturing inception.

One question that I have is where does your FP buddy sit with all this as you seem to be well connected in order to at least get a serious audience involved at Ford and/or Ford Performance in Dearborn?

 

[oldbmwfan]

I absolutely hate to hear situations and stories like this whereby you have made sure that everything is in place such as paid up front warranties and also from what I can tell this incident has no reflection on you being negligent in any way and suggest that the Carbon Revolution wheel may have been faulty right from manufacturing inception.

One question that I have is where does your FP buddy sit with all this as you seem to be well connected in order to at least get a serious audience involved at Ford and/or Ford Performance in Dearborn?

It's a fair question. I obviously would prefer to use the primary channels to get this resolved vs. leveraging contacts that others may not have. That said ...

1) On the day this occurred, pics were sent to the FP engineer who spec'd the wheel package with Carbon Revolution. In all of his testing, he has never seen this failure mode and he actually wants my wheel to cut it up. and see what happened. There is apparently a fiberglass or similar layer over the CF and under the ceramic thermal barrier; this may actually be where the failure happened (i.e., the wheel may be structurally still sound, but that bubble is still hitting the caliper and of course the thermal protection is shot).
2) I have a standing offer to get some air cover, but again I'd rather this work the way it's supposed to. I can pull out the stops if I need to
3) I also have the name of a technical lead at Carbon Revolution, so I could get them to appeal to Ford directly.

 

[PP0001]

It's a fair question. I obviously would prefer to use the primary channels to get this resolved vs. leveraging contacts that others may not have. That said ...

1) On the day this occurred, pics were sent to the FP engineer who spec'd the wheel package with Carbon Revolution. In all of his testing, he has never seen this failure mode and he actually wants my wheel to cut it up. and see what happened. There is apparently a fiberglass or similar layer over the CF and under the ceramic thermal barrier; this may actually be where the failure happened (i.e., the wheel may be structurally still sound, but that bubble is still hitting the caliper and of course the thermal protection is shot).
2) I have a standing offer to get some air cover, but again I'd rather this work the way it's supposed to. I can pull out the stops if I need to
3) I also have the name of a technical lead at Carbon Revolution, so I could get them to appeal to Ford directly.

Based on the above you have obviously have everything in order to get your issue resolved in a fair and equitable manner but unfortunately I will suggest that it will take some time in order to get resolved but at the end of the day you will be in good shape.

I went through much the same process but with much less damage to my drivers front wheel than you sustained to your rear wheel and I ended up with a new replacement CF unit when all was said and done.

 

[MikeR397]

@oldbmmwfan, feel free to use This thread however. That bubble is crazy! Your wheel warranty shloid absolute cover it. Leave our discussion of track use always even if it shouldn’t matter.

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