Chapman and Grainger - how do they do it?

[BimmerDriver]

I'm looking at ordering a new GT.

So I thought I'd check with my local dealer, and my salesman (who I've worked with before and is basically an honest person - for a car salesman) said that there's no way that these guys can do 3 or 4% below invoice in today's market, what with Ford cutting incentives, etc.

Anyone that has done business with Chapman or Grainger, or who work for other dealers, have any comments, suggestions, warnings?

Thanks.

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[Strokerswild]

How do they do it? Volume would be my guess.

Granger will get my future Ford business, whenever that happens to be.

 

[mullstyle]

Yeah my local guy laughed at Grangers number. I believe Granger earlier mentioned volume. Let's just say they make $1,000 total. Thats money they wouldn't have otherwise. What we should be asking is why our local dealers don't care about our money.

It should also be mentioned that most dealers are bozos. First they told me 2022 wasn't available for order yet. Didn't know colors, etc. I said oh really well I got this from such and such, didn't mention Granger, and all of a sudden he came up with the info and then said he could do MSRP for a GT. I laughed and hung up. And this is someone I have bought two cars from.

 

[BimmerDriver]

That's the old joke, right? "How can we sell it at a loss? We make it up in volume!"

There's actually some truth to that - when domestic dealers sell a car, they get a holdback. Let's call it 5%. If they meet certain sale thresholds, like say 1000 cars in a month, they get 6% back, not just on the cars over 1000 but on all of them. At least that's my understanding, please correct me if I am wrong.

These days, with the market as it is and sales how they are with reduced production, some of those incentives may be reduced. And of course, there are different incentives for different parts of the country. But in my mind, even before the lockdowns and viruses, 3% under invoice was a good deal.

 

[OutWest]

This has been extensively discussed. If they can't do it, then they would not be in the business today. The question is why other dealers won't do it. I guess it is easier and lazy to do a couple a month with a huge ADM added rather than juggle several customers at a time all the time. In the Mach 1 forum, I believe @Zach@Granger discussed the number of Mustangs they move per year.

 

[GreenS550]

I bought my 2021 M1 from From Zach Westrum at Granger Motors. Everything was exactly as he said. MY guess is that these orders from other states are sales they otherwise would not have. Nothing negative at all. Picked me and my brother up at the airport. Washed with a full tank of gas.

 

[Kermut]

I'm looking at ordering a new GT.

So I thought I'd check with my local dealer, and my salesman (who I've worked with before and is basically an honest person - for a car salesman) said that there's no way that these guys can do 3 or 4% below invoice in today's market, what with Ford cutting incentives, etc.

Anyone that has done business with Chapman or Grainger, or who work for other dealers, have any comments, suggestions, warnings?

Thanks.

As others have alluded to, the difference is about willingness- Granger and Champman are wiling to give meaningful discounts, because they know it's business they would not otherwise capture, and also recognize that sales will increase their standing/incentives with Ford.

As to actually ascertaining what an individual dealer really pays for a car, good luck figuring that out. I'm convinced the "invoice" cost is a another marketing ploy by dealerships to get customers to feel that they are getting a deal if it's sold at that. The actual dealer purchase prices are a closely guarded secret that I've never been able to figure out, because nobody talks about them.

All that being said, if you buy a car near invoice, I think that the dealer isn't making a ton of money on the sale, but who knows.

As to the dealers that aren't willing to currently sell for MSRP or lower...they are going to be the reason that legislation protecting the dealership model is eventually overturned, hopefully sooner rather than later.

 

[shogun32]

Ourisman in manassas does at least as well. They kill pretty much anyone on zvolume though Koons gives them a run for the title.

Dealer cost is about 12-15pct below msrp. So selling at 9pct below is not losing money. It's just that dealers are used to extracting maximal profit per unit. And since the consumer is I'll informed they will swallow whatever malarkey the sales manager spouts.

Grocery stores make less than 3pct and yet there is no shortage of places selling food and doing it profitably to encourage more places to open.

Dealers should be kissing the asses of consumers for letting them make 5pct and more on cars

 

[theruleslawyer]

I’m sure that the allocations for Mach 1’s they can sell when an order falls through doesn’t hurt either. Those are sold at MSRP IIRC.

 

[njlime]

Yeah my local guy laughed at Grangers number. I believe Granger earlier mentioned volume. Let's just say they make $1,000 total. That's money they wouldn't have otherwise. What we should be asking is why our local dealers don't care about our money.

It should also be mentioned that most dealers are bozos. First they told me 2022 wasn't available for order yet. Didn't know colors, etc. I said oh really well I got this from such and such, didn't mention Granger, and all of a sudden he came up with the info and then said he could do MSRP for a GT. I laughed and hung up. And this is someone I have bought two cars from.

+1- First dealer I went to (where I have been servicing 2 cars) told me the GT-CS vert was only available in black. Then they told me convertibles are not available with the B&O radio. I ordered from another local dealer (X Plan) who configured my car in 5 minutes. 4% below invoice is certainly better than X Plan but I wanted to do business locally.

 

[Call_Me_Bruce]

4% below invoice, they are still making money. What they get is more volume ordered and perhaps a little higher on the priority list from Ford for other models as well. If a customer cancels the order, I'm sure Granger/Chapman does not cancel it, as they will have no problem selling it in today's market.

Chapman & Granger are pretty clever about this. They have specifically targeted an enthusiasts website to get orders/customers. They know the users of this forum are car guys/gals and are good customers. My order with Chapman took place via email, about 4 of them them to get everything confirmed. Plus if Chapman or Granger does something underhanded they'll get killed on this forum and potentially lose a bunch of future business.

My local Ford dealer wanted $5k ADM on a base GT. Another local dealer laughed at me when I told them what Chapman/Granger was doing, and would not commit to not slapping me with ADM if I ordered a car through them.

 

[gone_n_60]

While I got my 2020 GT slightly used (4300 miles) for a great price if I were buying new I'd likely go with these guys here. We fuss about how does it work but in the end if you have a Mustang club friendly dealer thats giving you a great deal when nobody else will, why over analyze the how or details and give 'em and order. TBH if a pile of money dropped in my lap and I wanted a Mach 1 too I'd likely order from one of these folks and skip the grief of other dealers.

 

[Zelek]

Granger and Chapman are the two top dealers on this forum I would say. They are setting a great example of how business should be done and takes care of the customer. I wish others would learn from them local to me. It's still worth going out of state to get your new ride.

If I order a Bronco one of these years, it's going to be from one of them.

 

[Kermut]

My local Ford dealer wanted $5k ADM on a base GT. Another local dealer laughed at me when I told them what Chapman/Grainger was doing, and would not commit to not slapping me with ADM if I ordered a car through them.

This is exactly what happened when I checked with my local dealer just prior to placing an order with Granger. It's funny because the salesperson was all, "Oh yea I live in your suburb and would love to make you part of our family" prior to my requesting a price match.

Anyway joke's on you bud, guess who tells everyone at the gas pump and meetups where not to shop.....

 

[aham23]

Ford isnt punishing anyone. They are just making marketing statements.

It takes more work and patience to do what these two do. Most dealers dont care to put in the effort.

Obviously if I back out Granger keeps my deposit and now has a M1 they can sale at MSRP. A car they likely would have been allocated.

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