Whipple vs TVS whine

[Burnin4]

We have real world comparison's, IAT2 is SIGNIFICANTLY different. And while some can post 1 dyno graph of something they are working on. The fact is, it's already available LOL, it comes with every one of our kits. Nearly 150hp more! A year later, other's have to regroup to try and compete.

But, how are they going to compare with IAT's on these phases 2, 3, 4... Maybe just run it closer to the edge of failure to try and make the same power? There will always be supporters of both, but anyone doing the research will realize:

1. Bigger, more efficient supercharger.
2. Front feed minimizes restrictions, allowing higher VE's.
3. Bigger intercooler trumps the undersized GT500 based core.
4. Far greater flowing intake manifold minimizes pressure losses. As flow goes up, restrictions increase in the smaller manifolds.
5. As power goes up, belt issues can arise. Having a custom tensioner, enclosed in a casting is much more troublesome then having a HD tensioner with an adjustable idler that allows the variance of nearly 1" in pulley changes.
6. Optional 10-rib kit, carbon fiber components, dual 11" spal fans and flash tool with wheel/axle ratio changes (IDS doesn't change that).
7. Calibration light years ahead, better drivability, better safety, better manners and greater power.
8. Massive heat exchanger. No need to upgrade, already included. Research the size difference. Better temp control, quicker cool downs, less power loss and more consistent power. A dyno pull doesn't show all the real world temps. Poor heat exchanger and manifold design shows its ugly head more on the road then a chassis dyno.

To be accurate, the only time a TVS makes more torque is when it can't keep up at the higher compressor speeds to continue making power. Just look at the graph of the "maybe" available, falls off on the top. It would be easy to duplicate this, in fact we have in the past, we just cut the throttle a little on the top and we can make all the torque and lack HP. One of our old systems had a poor intake design (my bad :doh and it had similar curves, acted as it had "boost" control to some degree because the kit efficiency would fall off on top, but would make great torque. The difference here, there are no restrictions, therefore you are maximizing both torque and HP. Look at the curves of the two.....

We've tested both manifolds and intercooler setups. Back to back with our supercharger, 65hp at the same boost level (12.5psi). As flow goes up, the greater the difference. Since we had to use that manifold on previous applications, we have a tremendous amount of testing data. Therefore, when we built ours, we already knew of all the issues of that setup.

The fact is, you can be a leader or you can be a follower. While some may be scratching at the drawing board trying to compete, were already working on the next level of upgrades that will further separate us from the pack.

^blah blah blah, I don't mean any offense or disrespect, and I applaud your commitment to the community but it's time for all these 700whp/pump gas whipple setups to post up some results/slips, with mph (&DA/wheel setups). I'm not saying the results aren't there, but there's a lot of hype claiming how much better the whipple is over everything else and nothing to back it up aside from dyno sheets.

My lil ol TVS traps 130+ on pump gas rolling on 20's, with catalytic converters in mid 80's/2200ft DA, first time out on a remote Lund tune. Nothing spectacular, but wait till we update the tune, get some drag wheels, and go back in decent weather, mid 10's all day on pump gas. I just want to see how the big bad whipple will fair under the same conditions/setup.

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[Poppacapp]

^blah blah blah, I don't mean any offense or disrespect, and I applaud your commitment to the community but it's time for all these 700whp/pump gas whipple setups to post up some results/slips, with mph (&DA/wheel setups). I'm not saying the results aren't there, but there's a lot of hype claiming how much better the whipple is over everything else and nothing to back it up aside from dyno sheets.

My lil ol TVS traps 130+ on pump gas rolling on 20's, with catalytic converters in mid 80's/2200ft DA, first time out on a remote Lund tune. Nothing spectacular, but wait till we update the tune, get some drag wheels, and go back in decent weather, mid 10's all day on pump gas. I just want to see how the big bad whipple will fair under the same conditions/setup.

Loved my TVS on my Shelby. Was a very fun car.

BTW, I am planning on coming out to Rockingham on the 14th too. Only thing local to us is the 1/8th mile tracks.. I want to try a 1/4 before getting the mods started. Hollar at me if you go the 14th. In Charlotte area too.(Gastonia)

 

[ctozzi]

I can't even tell I have a blower. TVS with standard airbox.

^agreed, I have yet to even hear my TVS

 

[Stage_3]

The TVS blowers dont make a lot of noise out of the box, there is a nasty 11-14 TVS car that runs at our local track that has a small pulley and it screams. I would certainty put more into your decision than sound however.
Twin screw will generally make a higher peak horsepower number but the TVS will have torque on its side.

That's pretty nasty Kyle. What car is this on? Is it a Roush car?

I hear ya, Phase 2 shouldn't be too far out. Phase 3 will follow.

I can't wait to see the Phase 2 HP and TQ numbers. I hear it's making it's debut at SEMA this year. Getting close!

So,.....is Phase 3 definitely coming out?
I do recall a Roush video where they did a dyno of a Roush car they were testing that put down almost 800 HP at the wheels. I don't recall the TQ numbers.

 

[Burnin4]

If you ever come down to Tampa, I'll put mine against your TVS anyday. I had a chance to buy the tvs kit for a lot less than the whipple kit and I'm really glad that I went with the whipple. Honestly, your living under a rock if you think that the tvs kit out performs the whipple.

Another great story, were you going to post up your timeslips? That's the only language I understand when it comes to HP. I have no doubts that the whipple is a solid blower kit, and I'm sure that it performs very well, but how well? All I'm asking for is some real world results/feedback outside of dynojet#'s so we can decide for ourselves how "superior" the almighty whipple is compared to a TVS running same/similar setups/conditions/tires. I just put it out there that I'm up for finding out, good, bad, or indifferent.

 

[Burnin4]

Loved my TVS on my Shelby. Was a very fun car.

BTW, I am planning on coming out to Rockingham on the 14th too. Only thing local to us is the 1/8th mile tracks.. I want to try a 1/4 before getting the mods started. Hollar at me if you go the 14th. In Charlotte area too.(Gastonia)

I'm definitely going unless it rains. Myself and a dozen+ local mustangs from Boosted Performance's shop will be there, feel free to park beside of us and hangout.

 

[Poppacapp]

Another great story, were you going to post up your timeslips? That's the only language I understand when it comes to HP. I have no doubts that the whipple is a solid blower kit, and I'm sure that it performs very well, but how well? All I'm asking for is some real world results/feedback outside of dynojet#'s so we can decide for ourselves how "superior" the almighty whipple is compared to a TVS running same/similar setups/conditions/tires. I just put it out there that I'm up for finding out, good, bad, or indifferent.

And imagine... the TVS is doing this with .6L less displacement

I'm definitely going unless it rains. Myself and a dozen+ local mustangs from Boosted Performance's shop will be there, feel free to park beside of us and hangout.

Will do. Hope the weather holds out. I am still pretty much stock(catback, couple BMR items on rear). Want to get a 1/4 baseline before winter mods.

 

[Whipple SC]

And imagine... the TVS is doing this with .6L less displacement



Will do. Hope the weather holds out. I am still pretty much stock(catback, couple BMR items on rear). Want to get a 1/4 baseline before winter mods.

Why do the big 3 all use the 2.9L for there high HP needs? I mean, Ford and GM both have 2.3 production units that cost about half of the 2.9L, in stock and tested in every way imaginable? When they want to make HP, its not with a TVS.

As for numbers, read the MM&FF with Watson Engineering, which had the 2.3L TVS kit last year at SEMA, they quickly switched to meet there power goals.

 

[Whipple SC]

^blah blah blah, I don't mean any offense or disrespect, and I applaud your commitment to the community but it's time for all these 700whp/pump gas whipple setups to post up some results/slips, with mph (&DA/wheel setups). I'm not saying the results aren't there, but there's a lot of hype claiming how much better the whipple is over everything else and nothing to back it up aside from dyno sheets.

My lil ol TVS traps 130+ on pump gas rolling on 20's, with catalytic converters in mid 80's/2200ft DA, first time out on a remote Lund tune. Nothing spectacular, but wait till we update the tune, get some drag wheels, and go back in decent weather, mid 10's all day on pump gas. I just want to see how the big bad whipple will fair under the same conditions/setup.

Back it up? Your kidding right? Again, every COPO, Drag Pak and CJ.... They back it up every weekend.

Also, the customers have done a great deal of backing up. The proof is in the customer satisfaction. :first:

And just to be clear, you're convinced all this is smoke in mirrors and that setup is better? :doh:

 

[Poppacapp]

Why do the big 3 all use the 2.9L for there high HP needs? I mean, Ford and GM both have 2.3 production units that cost about half of the 2.9L, in stock and tested in every way imaginable? When they want to make HP, its not with a TVS.

As for numbers, read the MM&FF with Watson Engineering, which had the 2.3L TVS kit last year at SEMA, they quickly switched to meet there power goals.

Well, if they are pushing more than 18psi of boost I would hope they would go with the larger Whipple. Past that, and the TVS runs out of breath.

Not denying the Whipple makes big power. My experience comes from TVS vs 2.9 Whipple on GT500s at or below 18psi performance. The TVS on multiple dynos produced more low end torque than the Whipple, and Whipple came on stronger once it started to wind up. They both made similar power at the same boost levels below 18psi. This is from dyno graphs I saw posted back when I had my GT500.

Overall balls to the wall performance? The bigger supercharger SHOULD win by all means. It can push more air, more efficiently.

 

[Burnin4]

Back it up? Your kidding right? Again, every COPO, Drag Pak and CJ.... They back it up every weekend.

Also, the customers have done a great deal of backing up. The proof is in the customer satisfaction. :first:

And just to be clear, you're convinced all this is smoke in mirrors and that setup is better? :doh:

^dude, we're talking about 15GT's, not race cars. I know Whipple has a long history of building and selling supercharger kits for many different types of cars, hell I had one on my 11 GT500, but I'm looking for the results from all these 700whp+whipple setups. Again, I'm not saying that your kit doesn't produce results but I do think it's odd that only 1 or 2 forum members have posted up dragstrip results to back up their huge dynojet #'s.

With all that having been said, I'm still not convinced that a whipple will significantly outperform a Gen2 2.3 TVS kit with EQUAL boost and conditions. If I'm wrong then prove it. If any whipple'd 15GT wants to meet up at Rockingham Dragway on Saturday November 14th then I'm all game for a comparo, just putting it out there, the forum members deserve to see results and you guys are not providing them.

 

[15RRGT]

If you want whine from a TVS kit then just run an open air filter instead of the enclosed air box.

 

[Stage_3]

I can't even tell I have a blower. TVS with standard airbox.

I have a '13 Roush Stage 3 Phase 1 car with an enclosed airbox and when the temps are in the 50's, I can hear a slight whine while in 4th gear when getting on the go pedal a little. :cheers:

Twin screw will generally make a higher peak horsepower number but the TVS will have torque on its side.

Kyle, why is that? I'm not being facetious, just curious and would like to know why. I think a great torque curve is great to have to along with all that power. (Who wouldn't think that though, right??! :headbonk: lol)

 

[Whipple SC]

^dude, we're talking about 15GT's, not race cars. I know Whipple has a long history of building and selling supercharger kits for many different types of cars, hell I had one on my 11 GT500, but I'm looking for the results from all these 700whp+whipple setups. Again, I'm not saying that your kit doesn't produce results but I do think it's odd that only 1 or 2 forum members have posted up dragstrip results to back up their huge dynojet #'s.

With all that having been said, I'm still not convinced that a whipple will significantly outperform a Gen2 2.3 TVS kit with EQUAL boost and conditions. If I'm wrong then prove it. If any whipple'd 15GT wants to meet up at Rockingham Dragway on Saturday November 14th then I'm all game for a comparo, just putting it out there, the forum members deserve to see results and you guys are not providing them.

So now the dynojet's are incorrect? I'm still not clear on what you feel is incorrect. There have been a few in the 10's with these setups, traction always being the issue. But at that point, you get into the "race car" setup your referring too with suspension mods, better tires/wheels/gears. Where does one draw the line from a fast car to a "race car". You also have to consider, these are 50-state legal, tested and approved, daily drivers. The standard kit is making 675rwhp at nearly the same boost level. Roush customers have to buy pulleys and get custom tunes to get anywhere near 130mph in the 1/4. Even with the free $100 upgrade, there making 100RWHP less with nearly the same boost level. To get comparable power numbers, you have to get new injectors as the 47's are too small. If you want power, your gonna put some ID1000's in there.

Comparing superchargers is one thing, but the "package" is very, very different and they post significant differences.

There are a few car's being converted now that will be posting some results very soon, will be some interesting results.

 

[S550_Magnetic]

I have no problem with hearing my whipple. Damn thing almost got my caught by my wife lol. I didn't tell her that I got a SC and she heard it. But, it sounds great, makes great power too. I can hear it over my catless kooks exhaust.

Dang, your wife didn't notice a $10k dent in your bank account?

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