Idea for covering up a tune...sorta..

[Buldawg76]

BS skills and a dozen doughnuts gets results.

When I was still working on vehicles I never cared for BS but donuts got my attention.

BD

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[K4fxd]

I held a master ASE rating back in the day

I am a retired ASE master tech so do all my own work and am very very picky if not anal about who I let touch my car.

A flash is a flash.

 

[K4fxd]

When I was still working on vehicles I never cared for BS but donuts got my attention.

I had one customer who always left me a bottle of bourbon in the car.
He had a starting problem cold the car started fine once it warmed up it would not start to save your life. I was the 10th tec or so to look at it. I went to the dungeon, where the dealer kept the service manuals, and figured it out to be the hall sensor on the crank. He was so happy it was fixed he asked for me personally and always had a bottle of some kind of good bourbon for me. No Jim Beam crap.

I had several who asked for me but he was the only one to leave an expensive gift. I always made sure his car was fully detailed before it left the shop.

 

[Buldawg76]

I held a master ASE rating back in the day

A flash is a flash.

I agree on a flash is a flash but it seems qualified techs are hard to find these days. I started before any computers in cars in 75 up until 98 when I got job at Harley helping develop the V-rod until the economy tanked in 08 and Harley moved the test facility from Talladega, AL to Yucca Arizona to old ford proving grounds. Then went back to cars and remembered why I got out of it in 98 and just found independent bike shop to work at till I retired.

BD

 

[Buldawg76]

I had one customer who always left me a bottle of bourbon in the car.
He had a starting problem cold the car started fine once it warmed up it would not start to save your life. I was the 10th tec or so to look at it. I went to the dungeon, where the dealer kept the service manuals, and figured it out to be the hall sensor on the crank. He was so happy it was fixed he asked for me personally and always had a bottle of some kind of good bourbon for me. No Jim Beam crap.

I had several who asked for me but he was the only one to leave an expensive gift. I always made sure his car was fully detailed before it left the shop.

I had a couple customers like that as well and I will take the scotch/bourbon over donuts every time. I had a very loyal customer base as well, always tried to treat my customer cars as my own.

That's a quality that is missing in our service depts of today sadly.

BD

 

[K4fxd]

I worked at an independent shop when snap-on came out with their diagnostic computer. I scratched my head and watched many cars wondering what things like cross counts meant.

When I started we rebuilt everything, not replace. I can't count the number of water pumps, alternators, generators and starters I rebuilt. I still have a growler.

 

[Buldawg76]

I worked at an independent shop when snap-on came out with their diagnostic computer. I scratched my head and watched many cars wondering what things like cross counts meant.

When I started we rebuilt everything, not replace. I can't count the number of water pumps, alternators, generators and starters I rebuilt. I still have a growler.

I started in independent shop that the owner had been working on cars since the 40s and taught me a whole lot that are not in manuals or text books. We worked on any vehicle that came in the shop. We also rebuilt everything as well since there were no reman part to buy to install then so really had no choice.

Then went to olds/caddy dealer when he closed his shop and quickly figured out I preferred the electrical, computers, drivability work over the engine/trans rebuild grunt work so started specializing in that and it's what got me the job at Harley in 98 since all the electronics on Harleys was GM/Delphi components and the V-rod was a simple speed density system from the mid 80s. loved that job since we tested on the speedway and got to ride the high bank on bikes in middle of the night on 3rd shift. Got paid very well to play at work every day.

BD

 

[K4fxd]

GM/Delphi components

Sorry that was crap stuff. At least on the big twins. Yea I ended up being the drivability guy since I actually read the service manuals and learned how the computerized systems worked. I left the independent shop and ended up at a multi brand dealer. Then I took a U-turn and ended up in the steel industry.

 

[Buldawg76]

Sorry that was crap stuff. At least on the big twins. Yea I ended up being the drivability guy since I actually read the service manuals and learned how the computerized systems worked. I left the independent shop and ended up at a multi brand dealer. Then I took a U-turn and ended up in the steel industry.

We never had many issues with the few GM/Delphi parts used on Harleys, it was more wiring issues with injector wires work hardening from constant movement of engines and breaking the wires or poor routing assembly procedures at factory. I just liked that Harley wanted 100+ bucks for a TP sensor that you could buy at local parts house for 25 bucks and put on your Harley and be on your way. Same with MAP sensor and CHT sensor, the crank sensor, ECM was the only Harley specific part.

I still much prefer service manuals over PC crap.

BD

 

[2morrow]

One thing to think about is that Ford Performance is considered an aftermarket company.

Yes they do offer CARB compliant parts but it’s still aftermarket.

If there is warranty work needed to be done they could still point to that as a non factory modification.

I was surprised too.

 

[Buldawg76]

One thing to think about is that Ford Performance is considered an aftermarket company.

Yes they do offer CARB compliant parts but it’s still aftermarket.

If there is warranty work needed to be done they could still point to that as a non factory modification.

I was surprised too.

Correct as that is all covered in the link, I posted in post #26 on page 2 of this thread. You must also register the FP parts with FP per the last paragraph in that link to have any warranty coverage.

BD

 

[Cobra Jet]

Flow chart.

Ford installs Ford tune tune> I drive away legit> I get home install XXX tune> a year later engine gets weird> go back to original Ford performance tune or stock> go for warranty work> they say car was tuned> i tell them I had the Ford Tune installed by ford> Don't tell them that between those points it was XXX tune.

^^^^ This does not matter.

it’s the key counts as previously mentioned. There is no way around the key counts.

Put it this way, if you did as your flowchart says:
- At the point of Ford Tune install the car had hypothetically 20k miles on it.
- At the point of your hypothetical “engine goes weird”, the car now has 50k miles on it.
- Ford shop researched/diagnoses “engine weirdness” and finds that the key counts in the PCM is showing only 10 key cycles in 30k miles….

Ford says “nope”, denies warranty claim and you’re stuck with a weird engine and out of pocket costs for the repair.

The key counts can’t be beat….

 

[ice445]

One thing to think about is that Ford Performance is considered an aftermarket company.

Yes they do offer CARB compliant parts but it’s still aftermarket.

If there is warranty work needed to be done they could still point to that as a non factory modification.

I was surprised too.

True, but Ford is surprisingly lenient about covering warranty claims on FP tuned cars, even under the normal 5yr/60k powertrain. As long as that's the only obvious mod. A few people on here have had engines replaced with no questions asked. I would wager it's because Ford wants to keep the reputation of their FP division in good standing.

^^^^ This does not matter.

it’s the key counts as previously mentioned. There is no way around the key counts.

Put it this way, if you did as your flowchart says:
- At the point of Ford Tune install the car had hypothetically 20k miles on it.
- At the point of your hypothetical “engine goes weird”, the car now has 50k miles on it.
- Ford shop researched/diagnoses “engine weirdness” and finds that the key counts in the PCM is showing only 10 key cycles in 30k miles….

Ford says “nope”, denies warranty claim and you’re stuck with a weird engine and out of pocket costs for the repair.

The key counts can’t be beat….

Don't forget all the stored "loss of communication with module x" codes that get stored when you flashed. Only higher end scan tools can even see those. Plus all your emissions monitors will be reset.

Even if youre dedicated enough to sit there pressing the start button on and off for hours, they'll always know.

 

[shogun32]

The key counts can’t be beat….

Some enterprising person with a hex editor ...

 

[WildHorse]

There is no way around the key counts.

Unless :

1. Access the ECM: Gain access to the ECM, which typically involves removing it from the vehicle and connecting it to a specialized programming device or a computer with appropriate software.
2. Modify the software: Locate the software or firmware that controls the key counts within the ECM's programming. This could involve reverse-engineering the software to understand its structure and functionality.
3. Disable or hide key counts: Once you've identified the relevant code responsible for displaying key counts, modify it to either disable the feature or hide the counts from the user interface. This could involve changing the code responsible for displaying the counts or altering the software's logic to prevent it from updating the counts.

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