Supercharger Surge Help!

[MD_]

So im stupid and ignorant for having a discussion on possible solutions? I guess I'm the asshole because I got 1 suggestion of put cardboard in a grille and thats that... whereas there's plenty of folks running FI applications with aftermarket grilles and have never heard of that. So yeah God forbid I would like alternate options or opinions.

To add the Shelby super snake mustang runs a whipple with a more open "aftermarket grille" no cardboard, there's another well written write-up of an 850hp whipple mustang with a cervini grille, no mention of cardboard. But I suppose if you guys were to say that 5.0 coyotes run best on a mix of sugar and gas I should take your word for it too.

Understand you're frustrated man. My advise, swap out the RTR for the stock unit until you guys are able to trouble shoot a way to make the RTR work that also is aesthetically satisfying for your friend.

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[HoustonGT]

Hey guys,

My buddy who owns the same car as me a 2021 Mustang GT PP just got his VMP Odin installed. Making 704whp!!! However... hes having partial throttle surging issues. When he called his tuner, he said it's due to the RTR grille allowing too much air, which I find a little suspicious that a slightly more open grille is causing surge issues? Maybe I'm wrong, but is there a fix for this? He was told to put cardboard in the grille on go back to stock.

I'm also wondering if I will have the same issue putting a gen 5 whipple 3.0 stage 2 on my car as I have the Cervini C series upper and lower grille.

Thanks in advance!

I have a 2020 PP2 and a whipple gen 5 stage 2. I get surging/bucking occasionally in 1st. Plus, I have some throttle hesitation while cruising in 2nd or 3rd at low RPM's. Stock grill, no mods that would contribute to the issue. Whipple has been on for about a month. Sent a data log file to whipple 3 weeks ago and no response back...

 

[w3ab1ak91]

I have a 2020 PP2 and a whipple gen 5 stage 2. I get surging/bucking occasionally in 1st. Plus, I have some throttle hesitation while cruising in 2nd or 3rd at low RPM's. Stock grill, no mods that would contribute to the issue. Whipple has been on for about a month. Sent a data log file to whipple 3 weeks ago and no response back...

I assume you're running the whipple tune then? One of my friends is a Ford master tech who builds engines on the side, he suggested a few things... not sure if any will work but he said with oiled filters to first clean the MAF sensor to ensure no oil got on, try one of those dust covers on the filter if its a cone filter, and last but not least hes saying the tune.

His info is based off of running supercharged fords for years. However, he has not had a 5.0L coyote with a whipple or VMP.

 

[HoustonGT]

I assume you're running the whipple tune then? One of my friends is a Ford master tech who builds engines on the side, he suggested a few things... not sure if any will work but he said with oiled filters to first clean the MAF sensor to ensure no oil got on, try one of those dust covers on the filter if its a cone filter, and last but not least hes saying the tune.

His info is based off of running supercharged fords for years. However, he has not had a 5.0L coyote with a whipple or VMP.

Yep, whipple tune. thanks for the suggestions...

 

[smokescreens]

My 2018 stage 2 whipple does this sometimes as well. I think its a combo of the gigantic throttlebody and my foot bouncing the pedal. Although every now and then i get a strange part throttle break up during the first drive after a number of hours (cold engine) i always let the motor warm up to about 120-140 minimum before i drive though.

 

[Vert]

I would keep the grille and just block off the drivers side at the snorkel.

 

[schmeky]

Is this a PD only thing?

I don't have any issues with my centri with the tune I have. My throttle inputs and drivability are perfect (knock on wood)!

 

[Temovic55]

I assume you're running the whipple tune then? One of my friends is a Ford master tech who builds engines on the side, he suggested a few things... not sure if any will work but he said with oiled filters to first clean the MAF sensor to ensure no oil got on, try one of those dust covers on the filter if its a cone filter, and last but not least hes saying the tune.

His info is based off of running supercharged fords for years. However, he has not had a 5.0L coyote with a whipple or VMP.

Hey w3ab1ak91,

I would never have thought this is a related air flow issue due to grilles design!? ( mine has a cervini C series ) Also, my car is equipped with an odin with custom tune ( locally ) yet I still have drivability issues/stall sometimes ? Talked to Darryl ( not the tuner yet ) and he pointed out on two things, TB ( big suspect ) or ( tune ). Honestly, I don't know what to do as the issue still existing!
The MAF & TB position should do their work adapting with the volume of air especially in a custom tune. So, I think what I would do, install back the VMP tune and see if the TB throws some codes ( since my tuner wasn't clear enough about that ) or take my money back and start all over with Darryl!
Any thoughts, inputs would be much apricated in advance,
Thanks all!

 

[smokescreens]

Is this a PD only thing?

I don't have any issues with my centri with the tune I have. My throttle inputs and drivability are perfect (knock on wood)!

Probably. Given the instant tq we get. I do think im to blame for most of it honestly. Im still getting use to how soft the gas pedal is. My last car it had a lot more resistance. But with as big as the throttle body is on the stage 2 barely cracking the throttle is going to let her eat, lol.

 

[w3ab1ak91]

As my tech explained a car only "sucks" in the air it needs. Maybe the block off will work, maybe its something else. We are going to try cleaning the MAF sensor tomorrow, if that doesn't help were going to try one of those filter hydro covers, and if that fails, we will try the block off. When I get my whipple installed I'll have mine dyno tuned by DGR and see if they can maybe dial in the partial throttle tuning better. I'll update with what we come across.

 

[DonnieO]

So im stupid and ignorant for having a discussion on possible solutions? I guess I'm the asshole because I got 1 suggestion of put cardboard in a grille and thats that... whereas there's plenty of folks running FI applications with aftermarket grilles and have never heard of that. So yeah God forbid I would like alternate options or opinions.

To add the Shelby super snake mustang runs a whipple with a more open "aftermarket grille" no cardboard, there's another well written write-up of an 850hp whipple mustang with a cervini grille, no mention of cardboard. But I suppose if you guys were to say that 5.0 coyotes run best on a mix of sugar and gas I should take your word for it too.

Have a sense of humor. Im just kidding with you.

 

[MD_]

As my tech explained a car only "sucks" in the air it needs. Maybe the block off will work, maybe its something else. We are going to try cleaning the MAF sensor tomorrow, if that doesn't help were going to try one of those filter hydro covers, and if that fails, we will try the block off. When I get my whipple installed I'll have mine dyno tuned by DGR and see if they can maybe dial in the partial throttle tuning better. I'll update with what we come across.

If you're thirsty and try to get a drink from the garden hose, at full tilt, while holding it 1 foot from your face how successful do you think you'll be at just grabbing the water you need?

Your MAF sensor:

 

[CJJon]

As my tech explained a car only "sucks" in the air it needs. Maybe the block off will work, maybe its something else. We are going to try cleaning the MAF sensor tomorrow, if that doesn't help were going to try one of those filter hydro covers, and if that fails, we will try the block off. When I get my whipple installed I'll have mine dyno tuned by DGR and see if they can maybe dial in the partial throttle tuning better. I'll update with what we come across.

Why are you guys resisting trying the most simple fix?

I don't get it.

 

[Bulldog9]

I can easily see how more air forced into the airbox particularly if there's some buffeting or cross winds etc could affect the mass airflow sensor and fueling in these cars as it is so close to the air filter. Cardboard would be a quick fix, but you could also fashion some type of tin deflector that would look good not impede the amount of air flow but would protect the air box from extra pressure while at speed.

For some fun take a blow dryer leaf blower and blow it into the air intake area through the grill while the car is idling and watch what happens to the idle speed. What people are telling you is that this is what is happening while driving.

I was surprised to see how blocked off the grill was in front of the airbox on my 2020 bullitt, and I assumed it was to control the air entering the air box and this thread confirms my thoughts.

A couple questions on the surging. I'm assuming this is when the throttle is held at a constant rpm?

Depending on which drive mode you're in, the gas pedal can be extremely sensitive and as it is also extremely lightly springed it's easy to get a sense of surging or even some extreme jerky response especially if you're running the stock IRS bushings without any supports or bracing.

When I first got the car last year and before I added the Steeda IRS braces went in track drag or sport mode I would occasionally get some snatchiness and turkey jerky reactions in low gears. This was primarily due to the soft bushings on the IRS. Adding the IRS braces made a huge difference. I haven't added the circle brackets that go around the bushings for more stability yet but I imagine that would completely eliminate any sense of the herky jerky in low gears.

 

[svtfever]

Lots of crazy stuff in here. Try the cardboard trick or some variation of it and problem solved. I don’t like it either but not sure there’s any other way to fix it with an open grille

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