Help me understand the oil pump gear debate

[GreenS550]

I never heard of the OPG problem until I bought my S550. Before with my 2011 I read about the "cylinder 8" problem. I never read about this anymore. Can't hardly find info on it.

Now there is the OPG problem, which, according to OPG manufacturers is a serious risk of breakage. So why do these cars not have them?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2018-Shelb...ash=item239aace1ff:g:d10AAOSwny1ajyrE&vxp=mtr

https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars/a15924615/2018-ford-mustang-gt-roush-lebanon-ford/

http://www.lebanonford.com/the-727-hp-mustang.htm

And, there are many others. Roush gives a 3 year warranty if a Ford dealer installs.

By now there would be too many warranty claims. I think this issue is a non-issue.

Please give me your comments. Thanks,

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[Austinj427]

It's my understanding that the problem arises at high horsepower levels and/or high RPM levels.

I don't think these are really a problem for stock/near stock engines.

 

[GreenS550]

The cars I mentioned make from 727 to over 800 crank HP. And, the folks selling these cars know well that a bunch will make it to the dragstrip with either drag radials or slicks.

 

[Cream Puff]

If you're not banging the car off the rev limiter or launching from a 2 step the oil pump debate is massively overblown IMO.

Of course there are a small sample of guys that have relatively mild blower setups or N/A setups that have cooked a set of opg's but there are also 100% completely stock motors that randomly throw a rod.

Mechanical failures are a thing, just ask NASA.

Keep the RPM below 8k N/A.. a little lower if blown, learn to drive without smoking the rev limiter and odds are you'll be fine. If you're nervous about it and are going to have the front of the motor off to install a blower or cams anyways go ahead and do it for cheap insurance.

 

[bluebeastsrt]

When you double the Horsepower of any car. Stock sh!t is gonna break. Make more power. Find the weak link in your drivetrain. It’s been like that since hot rodding started. You can have the part installed when your installing your power adder. Or not and roll the dice. Your crystal ball probably works as good as mine on if you’ll have a catistrophic failure or not.

 

[Bald Menace]

When you double the Horsepower of any car. Stock sh!t is gonna break. Make more power. Find the weak link in your drivetrain. It’s been like that since hot rodding started. You can have the part installed when your installing your power adder. Or not and roll the dice. Your crystal ball probably works as good as mine on if you’ll have a catistrophic failure or not.

the oil pump gear has no idea what hp level the car is making and i don't think the load on the gear changes as hp changes. harmonics from rev limiter would be far more likely.

 

[UAmach1]

Oil pump gears have been breaking on stock and modded Mustangs since at least 1996. Nice to know that 22 years later they are still a weakpoint.

 

[GreenS550]

the oil pump gear has no idea what hp level the car is making and i don't think the load on the gear changes as hp changes. harmonics from rev limiter would be far more likely.

That makes sense. At first glance it would seem the load on the gears and sprocket is the same whether SC or na. It might be the rpms. However it would be harder to pump oil if the pressure on the bearings was greater as in the case of a fi car and therefore the load would be greater on the pump. But I've been told by LMS that it was a bigger problem with the 4.6 sohc.

 

[SoCalTim]

Here’s my take.

If you can sleep at night and not give it a second thought, then there is a good chance you may never have any issues with the stock OPG and crank sprocket.

Me personally, I didn’t want it in the back of my mind when driving the car hard “is it going to go boom?” .

So for peace of mind, I did the OPG and crank sprocket before installing the supercharger kit.

Saying ‘don’t bounce it off the rev limiter’ is easier said than done with a boosted GT. Loss of traction happens with the flick of the pedal, and will easily flash up to the rev limiter whilst scrambling for traction.

There is no hard failure data to make a choice over, just personal preference on how safe you want play your cards.



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[Bald Menace]

Here’s my take.

If you can sleep at night and not give it a second thought, then there is a good chance you may never have any issues with the stock OPG and crank sprocket.

Me personally, I didn’t want it in the back of my mind when driving the car hard “is it going to go boom?” .

So for peace of mind, I did the OPG and crank sprocket before installing the supercharger kit.

Saying ‘don’t bounce it off the rev limiter’ is easier said than done with a boosted GT. Loss of traction happens with the flick of the pedal, and will easily flash up to the rev limiter whilst scrambling for traction.

There is no hard failure data to make a choice over, just personal preference on how safe you want play your cards.



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whats the additional cost to replace the OPG when installing a blower?

 

[GreenS550]

I still go back to my original question. How come these builds from Shelby and Ford dealers and Roush are putting the gears in, yet are warranting the cars? OPG failure must actually be very rare.

 

[GreenS550]

whats the additional cost to replace the OPG when installing a blower?

About $1,600 from 2 dealers. LMS said they have fixed cars with broken opgs and a good many were na, stock. According to my rep at LMS, they have never had an sc install by them that had the gears let go. However they give the disclaimer that they recommend they be replaced.

 

[ahl395]

I still go back to my original question. How come these builds from Shelby and Ford dealers and Roush are putting the gears in, yet are warranting the cars? OPG failure must actually be very rare.

OPG failure is rare.

But it happens often enough for there to be several records of it happening, and for it to be as commonly known as it is.

Are you willing to take that chance?

Here’s my take.

If you can sleep at night and not give it a second thought, then there is a good chance you may never have any issues with the stock OPG and crank sprocket.

Me personally, I didn’t want it in the back of my mind when driving the car hard “is it going to go boom?” .

So for peace of mind, I did the OPG and crank sprocket before installing the supercharger kit.

Saying ‘don’t bounce it off the rev limiter’ is easier said than done with a boosted GT. Loss of traction happens with the flick of the pedal, and will easily flash up to the rev limiter whilst scrambling for traction.

There is no hard failure data to make a choice over, just personal preference on how safe you want play your cards.



.

I agree with this.

 

[Cream Puff]

I still go back to my original question. How come these builds from Shelby and Ford dealers and Roush are putting the gears in, yet are warranting the cars? OPG failure must actually be very rare.

cost/benefit to shelby/ford/roush. if one in 500 or 1000 cars kills an opg its still cheaper to give that guy a new motor under warranty than it is to spend extra money upgrading the opg's in the other 499 cars.

 

[BmacIL]

If you're doing a power adder, do it. Very cheap insurance on the $5-8k you just spent.

If you're staying NA, you're likely completely fine as long as you're not revving beyond 7,500-7,800 and banging off the limiter, and/or 2 stepping it at much higher than what the stock launch control (manual cars) allows. Supposedly the OPG is good to 8k RPM NA (or power levels where cylinder pressures aren't dramatically higher like a boosted car).

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