To avoid ADM I hope Ford does this

[ohtobbad]

I don't feel for the poor dealers, they get theirs, The front end manager is over 200k, top sales guys make 150k + That said, they have never gouged me on anything, I know of.
I don't expect them to on this car, I will likely have to pay full POP.
I will say this the GT500 was a MSRP and no deal car when they had them, they were going to give me a deal if I were to have bought one. But I buy a few trucks a year and I send them at least 20+ new customers every year

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[minicobra]

My whole point of my post was that we sell 99.9% of our vehicles well below MSRP everyday. Why shouldn't the needle swing the other way once in a great awhile. It's a 2-way street. If MSRP is something holy, then let's make it MSRP on everything, every time. Customers shouldn't get gouged, but neither should dealers.

I see your point, and understand completely. What I don't understand is that 10 people can come in to get the exact same car, and they will all pay a different price. People who have poor or no negotiating skills are basically getting gouged. Why does it have to be like this? Can you imagine if you had to do that at Best Buy, Target, or the Apple store. The auto industry is one of the few to do this. You mentioned something earlier about everyone paying MSRP, I personally think that would be great, everyone gets the same deal, when something goes on sale through the manufacturer, everyone gets the sale price, and no ADM's over MSRP. This would save a lot of wasted time and grief for the customer and the dealer. The auto industry would have to agree on this as a whole, and I can't every see that happening.

 

[w3rkn]

W3krn,

Let's look at it this way;

They must make money to stay in business.

But what is the better business model, gouging the crap out of someone who stays angry for years (and tells everyone who'll listen) making $10+ thousand extra on one unit?

Or having a reputation for treating their customers right and selling 50 units for a reasonable mark up, say invoice + $1K on regular cars and MSRP on SVT products?

As I said above, you can shear sheep over and over, but you can cut them only once.

If they sell at MSRP they make money.

Greedy peeps just want to make moAr money. Instead of making that up the honest way, with good Service and thus repeat Service.



There are many Dealers that people don't go to because of word of mouth. I know People that will travel across town, because of bad service from a local dealer. You are blind if you don't think it happens, or that people don't abide.

 

[Trackaholic]

I see your point, and understand completely. What I don't understand is that 10 people can come in to get the exact same car, and they will all pay a different price. People who have poor or no negotiating skills are basically getting gouged. Why does it have to be like this? Can you imagine if you had to do that at Best Buy, Target, or the Apple store. The auto industry is one of the few to do this. You mentioned something earlier about everyone paying MSRP, I personally think that would be great, everyone gets the same deal, when something goes on sale through the manufacturer, everyone gets the sale price, and no ADM's over MSRP. This would save a lot of wasted time and grief for the customer and the dealer. The auto industry would have to agree on this as a whole, and I can't every see that happening.

It sounds like you may be putting too much energy in worrying about the deals the "other guy" is getting. You can already adhere to your dream...just pay MSRP. If some one else wants to try and pay less, why would you want to stop them?

-T

 

[Five Oh Brian]

Brian....The Seattle-Tacoma ADM's on GT500's were averaging $15k. Being a loyal, repeat Superduty buyer wouldn't change that on even an ordered car. So be it, a Minnesota dealer was happy to sell at MSRP, without me buying a $60K pickup every 24 months. This sours me on Ford products in a big way.....

PS, I know of 2 local GSM's who make in the neighborhood of $300k. Most surgeon's are no longer in that tax bracket.

So, let me get this straight. You're avatar shows that you own a 2014 GT500. You're saying that you bought it in Minnesota at MSRP and that the Seattle-Tacoma dealers averaged $15K ADM's? I'm a Seattle-Tacoma area dealer (only about 30 miles away from Fox Island, by the way) and we sold all of our 2014 GT500's for MSRP or less. That pricing was available to anyone, not just repeat customers. Sounds like you didn't shop your own back yard very well before going all the way to Minnesota.

And those 2 local GSM's you know that make $300K? I'm assuming they oversee multiple dealers (big dealer groups), not just one store (like me). I'd love to make $300K; that would be like winning the lottery. I can't even imagine making that much money!

 

[Five Oh Brian]

There is something called holdback, which is like a rebate to the dealer on all sales, not to mention sweetheart flooring packages a volume rewards.

I already addressed this a few posts up, but as a reminder....

Holdback is 3% of MSRP and manufacturers (not just Ford) pay this to dealers to offset the expense of having hundreds of vehicles on the lot for sale. We don't own the vehicles on our lot - a bank does and we pay interest monthly to the bank to "floor" our vehicles. Holdback is designed to cover that expense and is not a "profit" line, although I bet you believe otherwise. We do get some extra monies back from Ford on some vehicles occasionally. Ford sometimes offers "dealer cash" if we sell particular models they are emphasizing.

 

[Five Oh Brian]

I see your point, and understand completely. What I don't understand is that 10 people can come in to get the exact same car, and they will all pay a different price. People who have poor or no negotiating skills are basically getting gouged. Why does it have to be like this?

Interesting that you should bring this up. I happen to work at a Ford dealership that adopted "one-price" 20+ years ago. We do not negotiate price - not even a penny. We simply discount each car (new & used) upfront and post that sale price on the windshield of each car. Any customer walking on the lot gets that exact price. Nobody pays more, nobody pays less, and everyone can get that great low price. It levels the playing field for the consumer. The rub for the dealership is that to be competitive, we end up selling our vehicles for a lower margin than a traditional dealership that can rip a bunch of customers to make up for the occasional loser. But, we sleep better at night knowing that don't gouge anybody. We see a growing number of dealerships adopting the "one-price" model every year. In fact, another Ford store about 40 miles away from ours just went "one-price" a few months ago, so there's a few of us doing it here in Western Washington. Honda has a growing number of their stores going "one-price" as well. Eventually, I see it becoming the norm everywhere, but it might still take a decade or two to become universal.

 

[Five Oh Brian]

There are many Dealers that people don't go to because of word of mouth. I know People that will travel across town, because of bad service from a local dealer. You are blind if you don't think it happens, or that people don't abide.

Social media is making word of mouth much easier to spread. Plenty of websites allow consumers to read real reviews from real customers about dealers. For example, check out dealerrater.com for real reviews on all auto dealers, all brands, everywhere in the USA. You can narrow it down by brand and geographic location if you want to read up on dealers in your own area, for instance. They show reviews for the sales and service side of each dealership. And, of course, you can also get reviews at other places like google and yelp, but dealerrater.com puts them all in one place making it easier to compare dealers side by side.

 

[CannMann21]

...

 

[2112]

So, let me get this straight. You're avatar shows that you own a 2014 GT500. You're saying that you bought it in Minnesota at MSRP and that the Seattle-Tacoma dealers averaged $15K ADM's? I'm a Seattle-Tacoma area dealer (only about 30 miles away from Fox Island, by the way) and we sold all of our 2014 GT500's for MSRP or less. That pricing was available to anyone, not just repeat customers. Sounds like you didn't shop your own back yard very well before going all the way to Minnesota.

And those 2 local GSM's you know that make $300K? I'm assuming they overlook multiple dealers (big dealer groups), not just one store (like me). I'd love to make $300K; that would be like winning the lottery. I can't even imagine making that much money!

I don't know what dealer you are at. I asked Titus-will or order one for me at MSRP. Answer was NO. I contacted every dealer from Olympia to Everett that had a car that was not triple black and every single one of the had an ADM, the lowest was $5K.

I don't know who the GSM's were. Buddy with a strictly used lot in Puyallup tried to hire them and was told they had to match their current income.

 

[2112]

Interesting that you should bring this up. I happen to work at a Ford dealership that adopted "one-price" 20+ years ago. We do not negotiate price - not even a penny. We simply discount each car (new & used) upfront and post that sale price on the windshield of each car. Any customer walking on the lot gets that exact price. Nobody pays more, nobody pays less, and everyone can get that great low price. It levels the playing field for the consumer. The rub for the dealership is that to be competitive, we end up selling our vehicles for a lower margin than a traditional dealership that can rip a bunch of customers to make up for the occasional loser. But, we sleep better at night knowing that don't gouge anybody. We see a growing number of dealerships adopting the "one-price" model every year. In fact, another Ford store about 40 miles away from ours just went "one-price" a few months ago, so there's a few of us doing it here in Western Washington. Honda has a growing number of their stores going "one-price" as well. Eventually, I see it becoming the norm everywhere, but it might still take a decade or two to become universal.

And yet you plan an ADM for this car.

 

[Someday]

Brian, My experience tells me that you can't win this argument that's been going on here but, for what's it's worth I believe many of us heard what you said and it would be a pleasure to deal with someone that uses your philosophy on pricing.

Not saying you would always get the sale but, it would cut out a lot of the BS,,,,

 

[2112]

Heck, I am local. ADM? No thanks, I'll get right on my computer instead.

And I won't even bother shopping my next Superduty there either.

 

[Five Oh Brian]

And yet you plan an ADM for this car.

Says who? Have you read anywhere where I've mentioned that we'll have an ADM on GT350's?

I'm not going to set our dealership's GT350 pricing until Ford announces allocations and pricing details. It might be 6 months or more before that info is released, so I'm not making a decision on our pricing stance until then.

 

[Five Oh Brian]

Brian, My experience tells me that you can't win this argument that's been going on here but, for what's it's worth I believe many of us heard what you said and it would be a pleasure to deal with someone that uses your philosophy on pricing.

Not saying you would always get the sale but, it would cut out a lot of the BS,,,,

Thanks. You're right, we don't always win people over with our one-price philosophy and we aren't always the absolute lowest price out there. But, we're never the highest price out there and nobody gets gouged.

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