1. Higgs Boson

    Higgs Boson Detonation Denotation

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    kind of makes you think something is amiss on the thermostat ratings. honestly, to me that seems like a more plausible explanation.....

    the 160 is really stock and the 170 is really a 150, lol.
     
  2. beefcake

    beefcake Well-Known Member
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    the 160 def opens sooner, that has been shown,
     
  3. Higgs Boson

    Higgs Boson Detonation Denotation

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    shown in what test? my 160 runs 210 CHT and 195-199 ECT.

    the post above shows the 170 running 10 degrees colder.

    it isn't going to hurt me to swap and test....
     
  4. Livernois Motorsports

    Livernois Motorsports Well-Known Member
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    Hey Mark,

    Here is a quick low-level piece of info on how tstats actually operate. Take a tstat of 160°, 170°, 180° and 195°. Let's just assume that the OEM temp is 195° which is the most common here in North America. Add 20° to each unit, you add this because this variance is the standard operating temp variance for most OEMs and their suppliers. All OEM suppliers must have a +/- tolerance of 2°-3°. 195°+20° +/-3° that engine is supposed to run at 212°-218° which is the boiling point of straight water. No systems use 100% water, there is always a glycol mixture. In the above example your 50:50 mixture would flourish. You need to alter the water:glycol ratio further as you replace your tstat. Optimally, you would lower this mix to 45/55 or 40/60 on a 160° unit to ensure that the other 34 parts of your powerplant that are affected by this modification are all operating at their peak capabilities. The reason that your 170° "testing" yields lower temps is because you are closer to that optimal water:glycol mixture. That is easy to explain using scientific data.

    All of your results are going to be varied by the mixture of water:glycol. An incorrect mixture of water/glycol will result in incorrect engine operating temps. As I am sure by now you can see.

    With the pot test your your boiling points is going to be affected by the tstat's environment. So if you have 2 tstats of equal temps and put one in an open pot of water to boil, and one in a pressure cooker which will open faster? The one in the closed environment will. As there are no exterior forces acting upon its environment. The thing to remember is that pressure and its by-product friction all directly correlate to additional heat. Your test proves that our unit opens sooner thus providing more potential for cooling. My above explanation shows why you're recorded temps are warmer.

    BTW, your ambient temps will have very little to do with performance of your tstat. Thermostats are not designed for a specific location. They are made to be sent everywhere from Arizona to Michigan. The difference in performance that you would see in the different climates would be negligible.

    At the end of the day what is going to make your 160° tstat work better than your tstat regardless of it's manufactured temp is your tuning and your water to glycol ratio. If either one is off kilter so will your end result. This is exactly why we offer our MyCal tuner w/ our custom tuning along with our EvenFlo tstat. It is all about experience and capabilities.
     
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  5. Higgs Boson

    Higgs Boson Detonation Denotation

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    The thermostat will function the same in different locations of course, but your radiator is affected and that is ultimately what has the biggest impact on the cooling system (if it is inadequate).
     
  6. Livernois Motorsports

    Livernois Motorsports Well-Known Member
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    You are saying that the constant in your equation just became a variable. The actual variable is the pressure inside of that "circuit". This is where you would have variance, and that variance is not unquantifiable. The variance is +/- 2°-3°.
     
  7. ifly680g

    ifly680g Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the info, although if I go to a 40/60 mixture of Glycol to water that would only yield protection down to -12 according to the chart on the Motorcraft Orange coolant bottle. I am in Northern Indiana and will be driving the car year round so I am sticking with the 50/50 mix recommended by Ford as we get temps -20 or less on occasion.

    My tests were not scientific in nature just what I have experienced in my car with the Tune that I have. I never intended to dis any product just showing what I have experienced.

    Mark
     
  8. Higgs Boson

    Higgs Boson Detonation Denotation

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    Say what?
     
  9. Livernois Motorsports

    Livernois Motorsports Well-Known Member
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    Flip that equation around.

    A mix of water and antifreeze EXCEEDING the 50\50 ratio (say 60\40) increases the freeze point protection down to ABOUT -58°.

    We are in Michigan man, trust me we get just as cold if not colder here.

    No dis taken either. We just wanted to add accurate info out there :thumbsup:
     
  10. ifly680g

    ifly680g Well-Known Member

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    Thanks, I was not sure if the Glycol in the equation was first or second.
     
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  11. Livernois Motorsports

    Livernois Motorsports Well-Known Member
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    No worries [MENTION=17103]ifly680g[/MENTION]

    Like I always say man, we are here to help the community as a whole. No hard feelings or anything like that at all!
     
  12. zaquhree

    zaquhree Well-Known Member

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    I just bought the 160* too...fml
     
  13. Livernois Motorsports

    Livernois Motorsports Well-Known Member
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    Why fml? I just through great lengths to explain the reason why those results occurred. Did you not read through the entire thread?

    Originally Posted by Livernois Motorsports

    Hey Mark,

    Here is a quick low-level piece of info on how tstats actually operate. Take a tstat of 160°, 170°, 180° and 195°. Let's just assume that the OEM temp is 195° which is the most common here in North America. Add 20° to each unit, you add this because this variance is the standard operating temp variance for most OEMs and their suppliers. All OEM suppliers must have a +/- tolerance of 2°-3°. 195°+20° +/-3° that engine is supposed to run at 212°-218° which is the boiling point of straight water. No systems use 100% water, there is always a glycol mixture. In the above example your 50:50 mixture would flourish. You need to alter the water:glycol ratio further as you replace your tstat. Optimally, you would lower this mix to 45/55 or 40/60 on a 160° unit to ensure that the other 34 parts of your powerplant that are affected by this modification are all operating at their peak capabilities. The reason that your 170° "testing" yields lower temps is because you are closer to that optimal water:glycol mixture. That is easy to explain using scientific data.

    All of your results are going to be varied by the mixture of water:glycol. An incorrect mixture of water/glycol will result in incorrect engine operating temps. As I am sure by now you can see.

    With the pot test your your boiling points is going to be affected by the tstat's environment. So if you have 2 tstats of equal temps and put one in an open pot of water to boil, and one in a pressure cooker which will open faster? The one in the closed environment will. As there are no exterior forces acting upon its environment. The thing to remember is that pressure and its by-product friction all directly correlate to additional heat. Your test proves that our unit opens sooner thus providing more potential for cooling. My above explanation shows why you're recorded temps are warmer.

    BTW, your ambient temps will have very little to do with performance of your tstat. Thermostats are not designed for a specific location. They are made to be sent everywhere from Arizona to Michigan. The difference in performance that you would see in the different climates would be negligible.

    At the end of the day what is going to make your 160° tstat work better than your tstat regardless of it's manufactured temp is your tuning and your water to glycol ratio. If either one is off kilter so will your end result. This is exactly why we offer our MyCal tuner w/ our custom tuning along with our EvenFlo tstat. It is all about experience and capabilities.


    Originally Posted by ifly680g

    Thanks for the info, although if I go to a 40/60 mixture of Glycol to water that would only yield protection down to -12 according to the chart on the Motorcraft Orange coolant bottle. I am in Northern Indiana and will be driving the car year round so I am sticking with the 50/50 mix recommended by Ford as we get temps -20 or less on occasion.

    My tests were not scientific in nature just what I have experienced in my car with the Tune that I have. I never intended to dis any product just showing what I have experienced.

    Mark

    Originally Posted by Livernois Motorsports

    Flip that equation around.

    A mix of water and antifreeze EXCEEDING the 50\50 ratio (say 60\40) increases the freeze point protection down to ABOUT -58°.

    We are in Michigan man, trust me we get just as cold if not colder here.

    No dis taken either. We just wanted to add accurate info out there
     
  14. evo8904

    evo8904 I'm a member???

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    He may have saw the actual results that members like myself have posted. I have a reische 170 degree theromstat. Even yesterday when it was a 85 degree day in Tampa my cylinder head temps were averaging 185 degrees. I haven't seen anyone with a 160 degree thermostat have the same results.


     
  15. phrenetiK

    phrenetiK IF YOU QUOTE PICS I H8 U

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    welp....wondering if its worth trying to drain the whole system to make a precise 40 to 60 water to glycol mixture with the 160 i havent installed yet or return it to beefcake and buy the 170...
     
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