The Big Turbo Upgrade Thread

[MAPerformance]

Maps car has different valve springs so yes there available. I will be passing on the turbo upgrade since I was told at the time my car got done don't worry everything will work you will not to upgrade anything.

We have valvesprings in our head for our built engine that hasn't made it in the car yet.

The head is a major limiting factor for this engine, the cams aren't aggressive at all. Played with cam timing for two full days last week and only seeing a swing of +/- 5-7hp leads me to believe that these cams are out of their efficiency range. This is why big turbo's are being used to produce minimal power. For example an 8374 that FFTEC used on their turbo kit should produce 500whp+ @24psi. I have personally seen this turbo first hand produce 700whp @ 30psi on a more efficient engine (4b11t EVO X). The low power output for these big turbo's aren't the fault of the tuner, it is simply the head.

Lot's of testing and results coming in the next couple of weeks/months with the entire engine. Will make sure we keep everyone updated.

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[dragonacc]

We have valvesprings in our head for our built engine that hasn't made it in the car yet.

The head is a major limiting factor for this engine, the cams aren't aggressive at all. Played with cam timing for two full days last week and only seeing a swing of +/- 5-7hp leads me to believe that these cams are out of their efficiency range. This is why big turbo's are being used to produce minimal power. For example an 8374 that FFTEC used on their turbo kit should produce 500whp+ @24psi. I have personally seen this turbo first hand produce 700whp @ 30psi on a more efficient engine (4b11t EVO X). The low power output for these big turbo's aren't the fault of the tuner, it is simply the head.

Lot's of testing and results coming in the next couple of weeks/months with the entire engine. Will make sure we keep everyone updated.

Did you already put bigger cams in as well?

 

[l2frankie]

Wonder how the car would be with aggreesive cams.

 

[Shanghai Dan]

We have valvesprings in our head for our built engine that hasn't made it in the car yet.

The head is a major limiting factor for this engine, the cams aren't aggressive at all. Played with cam timing for two full days last week and only seeing a swing of +/- 5-7hp leads me to believe that these cams are out of their efficiency range. This is why big turbo's are being used to produce minimal power. For example an 8374 that FFTEC used on their turbo kit should produce 500whp+ @24psi. I have personally seen this turbo first hand produce 700whp @ 30psi on a more efficient engine (4b11t EVO X). The low power output for these big turbo's aren't the fault of the tuner, it is simply the head.

Lot's of testing and results coming in the next couple of weeks/months with the entire engine. Will make sure we keep everyone updated.

Given the turbo used, and the goal of the car (make it "feel" like a stout engine) meaning it makes gobs of torque down low, I bet there was some serious compromises in terms of higher RPM output/horsepower. A lot of times you have to trade the two off (low end torque and high end HP) when doing a head/cam setup. And I bet that's why the heads excel at the low end and don't do very well at the high end.

Probably need shorter and larger ports/runners, and more aggressive ramps on the lobes.

 

[MAPerformance]

Given the turbo used, and the goal of the car (make it "feel" like a stout engine) meaning it makes gobs of torque down low, I bet there was some serious compromises in terms of higher RPM output/horsepower. A lot of times you have to trade the two off (low end torque and high end HP) when doing a head/cam setup. And I bet that's why the heads excel at the low end and don't do very well at the high end.

Probably need shorter and larger ports/runners, and more aggressive ramps on the lobes.

Well, it's not just the camshafts the head itself is poorly designed for flow. There is major restrictions on the exhaust ports. It basically goes from about 36mm to 30mm with a "wall" just past the valveseats. A full port job will bring out some tremendous gains but unfortunately without cams I'm sure the gains will be had sub-5000rpms.

We have not done anything with the camshafts yet, we are going to see where porting the head is going to leave us with power, then we will see if cams are going to be 100% necessary for our goals.

Right now we are focusing on stock engine performance, and have a goal of 400/400 on pump gas which we are just 10hp short of at this time.

 

[Herr_Poopschitz]

Wonder how the car would be with aggreesive cams.

...or at least more optimized.

I normally like working on every intricate detail on toys...was hoping this engine would produce more power w/ less work for a dd.

 

[MAPerformance]

...or at least more optimized.

I normally like working on every intricate detail on toys...was hoping this engine would produce more power w/ less work for a dd.

They are optimized technically. ECOboost. They didn't market these as turn key race cars haha. addle::ford:

 

[Herr_Poopschitz]

Well, it's not just the camshafts the head itself is poorly designed for flow. There is major restrictions on the exhaust ports. It basically goes from about 36mm to 30mm with a "wall" just past the valveseats.

Pics?

I'm half tempted to source a head just to play w/...

 

[Herr_Poopschitz]

EcoBOOST.

No racecar, just more emphasis on the important part as above...

Maybe an ST version will come along in the next few years like this...

 

[MAPerformance]

Pics?

I'm half tempted to source a head just to play w/...

Buy a new one from the dealer for like a dollar. LOL

 

[MAPerformance]

No racecar, just more emphasis on the important part as above...

Maybe an ST version will come along in the next few years like this...

Economy with a BOOST in performance over your standard four cylinder. I think that is what they were going for haha. Personally, I just see everything as potential.

 

[Shanghai Dan]

Yeah, that was my thinking. The head is optimized for making torque down low (long runners, lots of backpressure in the exhaust, etc). Having a cam optimized for that as well seems logical.

You'd have to do both, probably some significant rework on the intake manifold as well to shorten and fatten the runners up - and do the same on the exhaust side too. And a ton of porting.

But given the size of the head, there's probably a lot of meat that can be ground away for the improvements for more sheer horsepower!

 

[MAPerformance]

Yeah, that was my thinking. The head is optimized for making torque down low (long runners, lots of backpressure in the exhaust, etc). Having a cam optimized for that as well seems logical.

You'd have to do both, probably some significant rework on the intake manifold as well to shorten and fatten the runners up - and do the same on the exhaust side too. And a ton of porting.

But given the size of the head, there's probably a lot of meat that can be ground away for the improvements for more sheer horsepower!

LOTS of meat, the main focus for us will be the exhaust side. I think the most power potential is going to be in those runners.

 

[Frogger]

How much hp and tq do you all think this car can handle without internals upgraded, but with upgraded DP, CAI, tune and IC?

 

[dragonacc]

How much hp and tq do you all think this car can handle without internals upgraded, but with upgraded DP, CAI, tune and IC?

There have been a couple tuners suggesting to stay below 400 wtq. That being said MAP mentioned previously that they are planning to find the limit with their car so we'll have another data point soon enough.

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