Supercharge the GT350?

[V00D00]

What is your source for the 40-50 pounds? When I look up the Procharger for the 5.0 the shipping weight is 120 pounds. Even if the cardboard packaging weighs 20 pounds, that leaves around 100 pounds for the supercharger, intercooler, tubing, and brackets.

Even if the packaging is 40 pounds, that puts an additional 80 pounds on the front axle and higher up where it has a lot of leverage. That means a supercharged GT350 will be slower in the corners, probably by a signifcant amount.

Then you have the heat soak issues. Chevy wanted to use a large displacement naturally aspirated motor in the new Z06 but couldn't get it to pass emissions, so their second choice was supercharging. But now the Z06 makes one lap and then starts pulling power, as confirmed by Randy Pobst in this month's MT HTH vs the GTR.

Blower/intercooler/manifold/brackets, not weight 100-120 lbs. i have CNC manifold and gigantic intercooler, total system is 65 lbs. removal of airbox and oem manifold-15lbs, net +50lbs total weight. no one cares when your adding 150rwhp

again, heatsoak, because its.. air 2 water.. i said air to air

So 999 out of a 1000 don't need a blower either using your logic.;)

nope, thats what makes mine even more ..... "mine"
and with plenty more oomph should me and another be traveling in the same direction at the same time on the same stretch of road.. waiting for the 3rd honk ;)

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[MizzouRT]

Blower/intercooler/manifold/brackets, not weight 100-120 lbs. i have CNC manifold and gigantic intercooler, total system is 65 lbs. removal of airbox and oem manifold-15lbs, net +50lbs total weight. no one cares when your adding 150rwhp

So what is your source for the 65 pounds? The centrifugal ProCharger has a shipping weight of 120 pounds, so that means the net weight has to be close to 100 pounds. The packaging is going to be light weight cardboard, so most of that weight is the kit. The bigger the cooler the better it will run but the more it will weigh.

Yes, you can take weight away with other mods like a CNC intake, but those same mods can also be made to a N/A motor.

The advantage of a supercharged GT350 is it will be faster than a stock GT350 at the drag strip and quicker around a road course than a GT500. The downside is the supercharged GT350 will be slower than a GT350 around the road course and slower than a GT500 with the same $$$ invested in mods at the drag strip.

 

[Sered]

The downside is the supercharged GT350 will be slower than a GT350 around the road course

I'd love to know how you arrived at that conclusion :lol:

 

[MizzouRT]

I'd love to know how you arrived at that conclusion :lol:

Why do you think the C6 Z06, Z/28 and GT350 are naturally aspirated? And why do you think Chevy wanted a naturally aspirated engine in the C7 Z06 until they ran into problems passing emissions? We already know the new Z06 is a one-lap wonder on a road course.

Specifically:

1. Naturally aspirated engine will always be more linear than FI, especially vs a centrifugal blower or turbos that have to spool up. That translates into more precise power application in the corners that is a key component to good lap times.

2. Big power is nice on the straights but can be difficult to put down coming out of the corners. That problem is exacerbated by the nonlinear power put down.

3. Adding 100 pounds on the front axle and raising the center of gravity will hurt the handling significantly.

4. Superchargers need as much front area for cooling as possible, and still face heat soak. The GT350 front fascia is designed for a n/a engine and aero, not to provide a big billboard-sized grill to delay the inevitable heat soak. Just compare the new Z06 vs the Hellcat. The Z06 is very aerodynamic and has a relatively small front area, but that limits airflow for cooling. The Challenger Hellcat has all the aerodynamics of a brick, but it does have a huge front area for giant coolers. That lets the Hellcat run 20 minutes before heat soak sets in vs 90 seconds for the Z06. Making big power for 90 seconds is fine on a drag strip but not very helpful on a road course.

 

[Sered]

Why do you think the C6 Z06, Z/28 and GT350 are naturally aspirated? And why do you think Chevy wanted a naturally aspirated engine in the C7 Z06 until they ran into problems passing emissions? We already know the new Z06 is a one-lap wonder on a road course.

Because GM's Engineers, or at least the ones who make the decisions, are morons for using a PD blower for a road course car.

1. Naturally aspirated engine will always be more linear than FI, especially vs a centrifugal blower or turbos that have to spool up. That translates into more precise power application in the corners that is a key component to good lap times.

Bullshit. Go look at a supercharged E92 M3 powerband and then find me a N/A motor more linear than that. Here's an evolve kit for example, runs a Rotrex blower with a FMIC. I use the Evolve kit here as example because it runs a air/air. There's a lot of ESS and VF kits running air/water on a Vortech V3si with more linearity than this.

2. Big power is nice on the straights but can be difficult to put down coming out of the corners. That problem is exacerbated by the nonlinear power put down.

Read above. Centri blowers make this a non-point.

3. Adding 100 pounds on the front axle and raising the center of gravity will hurt the handling significantly.

Have you ever held a blower before? They don't weigh 100lbs, neither does all the associated hardware. A proper centri unit with a FMIC using a composite intake mani won't weigh anymore than 50lbs (assuming the company name isn't VF who makes giant metal slabs of intake manifolds, then you might have an argument). And hurting handling significantly? Yeah, no. It will hurt it some, I'll grant that; but 'significantly'? Maybe we have 'significantly' different understandings of what the word means. You'd have 'significantly' worse handling with an extra passenger.

4. Superchargers need as much front area for cooling as possible, and still face heat soak. The GT350 front fascia is designed for a n/a engine and aero, not to provide a big billboard-sized grill to delay the inevitable heat soak. Just compare the new Z06 vs the Hellcat. The Z06 is very aerodynamic and has a relatively small front area, but that limits airflow for cooling. The Challenger Hellcat has all the aerodynamics of a brick, but it does have a huge front area for giant coolers. That lets the Hellcat run 20 minutes before heat soak sets in vs 90 seconds for the Z06. Making big power for 90 seconds is fine on a drag strip but not very helpful on a road course.

You think N/A cars don't need lots of cooling or something? Have you ever tracked a car before? There's nothing on the GT350 front-end (or base S550 for that matter) that makes air/air coolers out of the question either. It's GMs fault for going with such a terrible cooling solution and a notoriously-bad blower setup for a road course.

I stand by my original statement; all you've done is talk about PD-blower air/liquid cars.

 

[V00D00]

Im getting good laughs at the thought that a blower itself is 100lbs.. Tends to make me think some people have no idea what they are talking about

he keeps bringing up points that Ive already made, that a PD blower and air-water are not what the engine needs, and keeps using the PD A2W setups as his basis.

 

[Waldorf]

Compression Ratio

From an past Article at SAE.org: Compression ratio of the port-injected, Coyote-based 5.2-L is 12:1 and max cylinder pressure is 97 bar (1406 psi), an engineer said.

http://articles.sae.org/13709/

Carry on, guys! That's what a free market is all about.

That is all...

 

[V00D00]

From an past Article at SAE.org: Compression ratio of the port-injected, Coyote-based 5.2-L is 12:1 and max cylinder pressure is 97 bar (1406 psi), an engineer said.

http://articles.sae.org/13709/http://

Carry on, guys! That's what a free market is all about.

That is all...

Link doesnt work.

12.1 CR and a few PSI sounds exciting Easy powa!

 

[Waldorf]

Link doesnt work.

12.1 CR and a few PSI sounds exciting Easy powa!

Sorry 'bout that... fixed the link.... I think! Wouldn't want to try mucho boost with that.

That is all...

 

[V00D00]

Sorry 'bout that... fixed the link.... I think! Wouldn't want to try mucho boost with that.

That is all...

yea, maybe like 8 psi ;)

 

[ProChargerTECH]

Remember, the past.....

People said you couldn't put boost into an LS1
People said you couldn't put boost into an LS7 with high compression
Heck people said boost on a 10:1 motor was crazy talk. (now thats the "normal")

We have proved them wrong year after year.

Just saying.

 

[Voo Doo]

Rhetoric

WTAF ??? Voodoo.. Your car, your money, your fun! End of story! Don't feel you have to justify yourself to anybody but yourself! That's all that matters

I finally got thru all 8 pages of a certain member's rhetoric !! Don't you guys have a beer to drink or a car to wax??

As stated, it's a car! It won't be of any value unless it sits in a garage and only after you are all dead!! Voodoo, I will follow the build thread and look fwd to the stories! As for anyone looking for spare parts...I would say you don't even make the short list. Let the guy have fun!

 

[R 350 gt Donson]

WTAF ??? Voodoo.. Your car, your money, your fun! End of story! Don't feel you have to justify yourself to anybody but yourself! That's all that matters

I finally got thru all 8 pages of a certain member's rhetoric !! Don't you guys have a beer to drink or a car to wax??

As stated, it's a car! It won't be of any value unless it sits in a garage and only after you are all dead!! Voodoo, I will follow the build thread and look fwd to the stories! As for anyone looking for spare parts...I would say you don't even make the short list. Let the guy have fun!

If your right and it is HIS money. What I mean is most of the people on here will finance this car (yes?) yes.. and if you boost this car you will most likely void the warranty. Yes? therefore no one should boost this car and "F" the engine up unless you own it. Or do you think because you made 5 payments you can do what the "F" you want to with the car? If so great I would hate to be your banker. Now where's my beer !

 

[wproctor411]

Remember, the past.....

People said you couldn't put boost into an LS1
People said you couldn't put boost into an LS7 with high compression
Heck people said boost on a 10:1 motor was crazy talk. (now thats the "normal")

We have proved them wrong year after year.

Just saying.

I've been at this since the mid 90's when they told us we needed 8.5:1 to run 7psi...oh how much better have the computer and sensor systems become! The tuning over the last 10 years has made leaps and bounds, these young guys are lucky, all they will know is high power and good mpg...

 

[wproctor411]

People will add boost to every car, utv, tractor,and boat, end of argument or any reason to for that matter. Money is king in this game, and when the right guy with money mods a car, you get a turbo GT350, and we get too enjoy his/her experience without going broke.

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