So when will someone make a gear drive

[RacingRoger]

Look at what people ACTUALLY buy in large sales numbers. THAT is what drives the market because THAT is where the profits are.

....and that's why (in this country, at least) why the only "car" Ford makes is the Mustang. Too bad -- I'm a car guy. I miss my big Lincoln land yachts.

Back on subject, has anyone seen a driveshaft setup between cams & driveshaft? At least that would eliminate multiple gears, and I assume run quiet.

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[sk47]

More like most people don't care about 500HP, and wouldn't pay for a car that has 500 when one thats 180 is massively cheaper. They care about getting from A-B quietly and comfortable with 0 effort in a reliable cost effective way. That why a freaking Honda Civic is a massively better sales than the Mustang, why automatics not only outsell manuals but now also out-perform them. Thats why the MACH-E sold better than the Coupe last month. Companies put the R&D where the profits are.

Look at what people ACTUALLY buy in large sales numbers. THAT is what drives the market because THAT is where the profits are.

This isnt about "the coming generation" its about people having to think more with their wallets due to the economy being fucked up for decades than thinking about what is fun.

Since 1990 if Minimum Wage(currently 7.25) kept up with inflation it would be over $11. If it kept up with housing prices it would be about $22-25 and if it kept up with corporate profits Min wage would be about $85.

This isn't about "oil ending the world" it's also VERY much about not being able to even afford oil/gas, and rebates/incentives and lower electric prices make Hybrids and Electric cars appeal MUCH more than something with 500HP due to long term costs. The average car now costs about 40K, and the average loan is about 7yrs. When spending 40K on a car buying the one that costs a lot less to fuel and maintain and has a 7-10yr warranty is just logical to your bank account.

Hello; Had to think about this post for a while. Appears you are saying the move to EV's is ordinary market driven choice by consumers. If such was indeed the case most of us would have little issue with more EV's being sold. Those that need/want an EV can have one and those that want/need an ICE could also have one. Over time if EV's proved in everyday use to be the overall better deal then they might push out the ICE. That would be an organic sort of how the best vehicle wins on merit. Likely there would be a mix of ICE and EV's in use for a very long time.

Such is not the case. EV's are not proven to be the better vehicle in real world use. Some folks can fit an EV into their lifestyle while a very large number of folks cannot make them work.
EV's are not proven to be less expensive overall and over time. Still some very big questions to answer on cost to operate/own.
EV's are not yet proven to be all that clean compared to ICE when all aspects are considered. I suppose we are to pretend only the end use counts. That we are not to look at how the electricity which charges them is made.

This thread is about gear drive for timing an engine and not using a chain. Not something likely to ever be on a production engine sold to the general public. The noise by itself likely being the bigger drawback. Thing is some enthusiasts would use the gears if available and live with the extra noise. It does not have to be an either-or situation.

The either-or part is missing in the current EV agenda. After a near future date the sale of ICE is to be illegal in some places. That is not an open market best car wins situation.

Then those rebates which take money out of an ICE persons pocket to help someone else buy an EV. At the same time policies are raising the cost of ICE fuel and the ICE buyer does not get any rebates out of someone else's pocket. Sweet for the EV fan.

Here is a way i look at it currently. An EV would only fit my lifestyle in limited ways in terms of use. I would not be able to have an EV only. I would need an ICE pickup as well. Having a small EV for run around short trips and an ICE pickup could work if the EV was cheap enough to be practical. EV's are not cheap even with the rebates. I have no problems driving to get groceries in a glorified golf cart if it indeed can save me some money.

Bottom line is the EV push is being sold as a way to save the world (climate change) and that might tip the scales if true. Thing is the EV is not all that clean when all aspects are included. I can post a link to a Volvo study which illustrates this point.

 

[RacingRoger]

Melding electric vehicles & gear drive whine, we have this little nugget:



1400 HP = impressive.
That whiney sound = not so much.
Maybe if they used a chain...

 

[2022 Mach 1]

....and that's why (in this country, at least) why the only "car" Ford makes is the Mustang. Too bad -- I'm a car guy. I miss my big Lincoln land yachts.

Back on subject, has anyone seen a driveshaft setup between cams & driveshaft? At least that would eliminate multiple gears, and I assume run quiet.

Motorcycles such as Ducati have used that design in the past.

 

[shogun32]

Motorcycles such as Ducati have used that design in the past.

a LONG time ago - like 50 years. But when the dry clutch is making such a clatter, who cares about valve-train noise.

 

[2022 Mach 1]

a LONG time ago - like 50 years. But when the dry clutch is making such a clatter, who cares about valve-train noise.

Ducati used the as of 10 years ago...

https://www.asphaltandrubber.com/news/ducati-superbike-1199-geardriven-cams/

 

[shogun32]

Ducati used the as of 10 years ago...

https://www.asphaltandrubber.com/news/ducati-superbike-1199-geardriven-cams/

I was responding to previous poster's "has anyone seen a driveshaft setup between cams & driveshaft?" which is what you quoted. If you were responding to "who uses gear-driven cams" then you needed to quote differently.
/pedant

 

[K4fxd]

Melding electric vehicles & gear drive whine, we have this little nugget:

Sounds like my grand son's RC car.

 

[2morrow]

The packaging of that will suck.

 

[dx2]

I do not think timing belts are oiled, but timing chains will be.

The smaller Ford ecoboost engine (1.0 / 1.5 L ) have an oiled timing belt. same oil as the engine uses, so mayor pain in case the oil was not properly changed or out of spec as the belt can decompose in that case being a liability.

 

[sk47]

The smaller Ford ecoboost engine (1.0 / 1.5 L ) have an oiled timing belt. same oil as the engine uses, so mayor pain in case the oil was not properly changed or out of spec as the belt can decompose in that case being a liability.

Hello; did not know this. Thanks.

 

[dx2]

Hello; did not know this. Thanks.

You're welcome and thank you as well. So far I learned a lot on this forum.

 

[stars_fan]

a LONG time ago - like 50 years. But when the dry clutch is making such a clatter, who cares about valve-train noise.

I have a wet clutch in my streetfighter v4. The desmo engine doesn’t have excessive valve train noise.

 

[Strokerswild]

I have a wet clutch in my streetfighter v4. The desmo engine doesn’t have excessive valve train noise.

I died a little inside when Ducs went away from the dry clutches. I miss my M900.

 

[sk47]

Hello; Had to think about this post for a while. Appears you are saying the move to EV's is ordinary market driven choice by consumers. If such was indeed the case most of us would have little issue with more EV's being sold. Those that need/want an EV can have one and those that want/need an ICE could also have one. Over time if EV's proved in everyday use to be the overall better deal then they might push out the ICE. That would be an organic sort of how the best vehicle wins on merit. Likely there would be a mix of ICE and EV's in use for a very long time.

Such is not the case. EV's are not proven to be the better vehicle in real world use. Some folks can fit an EV into their lifestyle while a very large number of folks cannot make them work.
EV's are not proven to be less expensive overall and over time. Still some very big questions to answer on cost to operate/own.
EV's are not yet proven to be all that clean compared to ICE when all aspects are considered. I suppose we are to pretend only the end use counts. That we are not to look at how the electricity which charges them is made.

This thread is about gear drive for timing an engine and not using a chain. Not something likely to ever be on a production engine sold to the general public. The noise by itself likely being the bigger drawback. Thing is some enthusiasts would use the gears if available and live with the extra noise. It does not have to be an either-or situation.

The either-or part is missing in the current EV agenda. After a near future date the sale of ICE is to be illegal in some places. That is not an open market best car wins situation.

Then those rebates which take money out of an ICE persons pocket to help someone else buy an EV. At the same time policies are raising the cost of ICE fuel and the ICE buyer does not get any rebates out of someone else's pocket. Sweet for the EV fan.

Here is a way i look at it currently. An EV would only fit my lifestyle in limited ways in terms of use. I would not be able to have an EV only. I would need an ICE pickup as well. Having a small EV for run around short trips and an ICE pickup could work if the EV was cheap enough to be practical. EV's are not cheap even with the rebates. I have no problems driving to get groceries in a glorified golf cart if it indeed can save me some money.

Bottom line is the EV push is being sold as a way to save the world (climate change) and that might tip the scales if true. Thing is the EV is not all that clean when all aspects are included. I can post a link to a Volvo study which illustrates this point.

Hello; How is this for an irony. The most recent new law has rebates for EV's included. Something around $7000 rebate. The bill still had wet ink when Ford and GM raised the cost of their EV's by nearly $7000.
This may go the way of college tuition/costs after the government started standing behind the student loans.

This might put a crimp in the finances of someone hoping to upgrade to an all-gear timing set.

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