Should these be backlit?

[ay1820]

There aren't. Which is why Ford can afford to charge whatever they want. But that doesn't mean the Mustang is cheap. It's extremely expensive for what it is, it's just that the market is willing to pay the price for lack of better options.
That's why removing a glove box light or a shifter backlight to save a few cents is preposterous to say the least. You're charging premium prices for a car built to Eighties standards, then remove a light bulb to cut costs? Really?

And that's why we still have a V8 Mustang to buy. If Ford wasn't making a reasonably good profit on these relatively low volume cars they would ditch them in a heartbeat. Bottom line, this is the market price. Yes you can have a more premium car for the same money (and with pretty good performance too), but not with a V8. If you want a V8, this is about the lowest cost option you will find.

Could Ford sell it for less and still make some profit? Maybe, but it would probably not be worth it to them to do so.

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[Vlad Soare]

Yes you can have a more premium car for the same money (and with pretty good performance too), but not with a V8. If you want a V8, this is about the lowest cost option you will find.

Yeah, but that's like putting a Spirit of Ecstasy on the hood of a Taurus, then charging $150K for it because the only other car that has something like that is a Rolls Royce, which costs $300K. So it would seem cheap by comparison. If you wanted a car with an ornamental sculpture on its hood, that would be the lowest cost option you would find.
The Mustang is a fine car, and I love mine to bits, but cheap it isn't. It's very expensive. They are charging $50K for a car that's worth $20K at best, on the grounds that it has a V8 (which in itself is worth $10K). It just doesn't add up.

 

[Charlemagne]

$20k, lol? You're comparing it to Dacia?

 

[monte87]

My 2021 doesn't have the shifter and or glove box lights. Ford cheaped out!
Anthony

P.S. And the wiring is non existant as well.

 

[Vlad Soare]

$20k, lol? You're comparing it to Dacia?

You may laugh, but as far as build quality goes, they could learn a thing or two from Dacia. The poor paint job of a Mustang could be found at Dacia in the Nineties; it's noticeably better today. Also, Dacias don't come from the factory with an incorrect amount of oil in the transmission. Or with incorrectly aligned body panels. They are comparable in regard to squeaks and rattles though.
So, a comparison with modern Dacias isn't as far-fetched as it may seem.

 

[Charlemagne]

I must be lucky with good paint job (now protected by PPF) and good panel fit. Only one headlight is shifted by 3-4 mm. These things don't really cost anything, they're quality of work, not quality of materials, R&D, longevity etc. I think those are pretty good for non-Premium brand and power is great too. American brands are known for bit lesser quality of certain things because their customers prefer more usability than perfection, maybe also because there's less competition among American brands, people are more proud on their own products and tend to give them preference.

Similar with Tesla. Their Model 3 really has no competition for that price, be it in range or power or tech.

 

[Vlad Soare]

All I'm saying is that the V8 engine alone isn't a valid excuse to charge premium prices.
I can't seem to find a price comparison between various Jaguar F-Types right now, but if memory serves the difference between the V6 and the V8 was something like 7%, or thereabouts. Maybe 10% at most. Jaguar buyers pay a lot for a premium car, plus a little bit extra for the V8. We, on the other hand, pay a lot for the V8 and consider it cheap. It isn't though. It's not like V8s are made of myrrh.

 

[ay1820]

All I'm saying is that the V8 engine alone isn't a valid excuse to charge premium prices.

All I'm saying is that there isn't a better V8 option at this price point. It seems like you are arguing that Ford should be charging less, but Ford is simply charging what the market will bear. And if the market dried up at this price point, the Mustang will go away.

You are right that Ford could do a MUCH better job at quality at this price point (at any price point for that matter). When done right, basic quality does NOT have to be expensive, but it does need to be designed in right from the beginning. Ford lost its way here, and that is not limited to the Mustang.

 

[Vlad Soare]

All I'm saying is that there isn't a better V8 option at this price point. I

Indeed there isn't. Which is why Ford can afford to charge as much as the market will bear. My point is that it's not the V8 itself that makes the car expensive, but rather Ford taking advantage of a favourable market situation (i.e. no other V8s available at resonable prices).

It seems like you are arguing that Ford should be charging less,

Either charge less, or build it better for the price. There's no excuse for removing a light bulb to save three and a half cents from a car that's already too expensive for its quality to begin with. If you're going to charge more than it's worth just because the market will bear it, then at least have the decency not to insult us by cutting costs so obviously and shamelessly. Come on, a light bulb? In a $35K car that you're selling for $50K? Really?

 

[DougS550]

The thing I worry about isn't so much the glove box and gear shifter plate lights being removed, I worry about the things Ford removed, cheaper down ETC in places we cannot readily see.

 

[Charlemagne]

The trend actually shifted, they are adding things now. Like the popular carbon trap

 

[Rhyanski]

The trend actually shifted, they are adding things now. Like the popular carbon trap

You meant the carbon crap I guess....

 

[Charlemagne]

You meant the carbon crap I guess....

Well you never know, for example the GPF filters on EU models have awesome side effect of always clean exhaust tips

 

[ay1820]

Indeed there isn't. Which is why Ford can afford to charge as much as the market will bear. My point is that it's not the V8 itself that makes the car expensive, but rather Ford taking advantage of a favourable market situation (i.e. no other V8s available at resonable prices).

I actually more or less agree with that. Like I said, Ford has the opportunity to amortize much of the cost of the Coyote over not only the Mustang but the F150 line as well. That's why Ford has committed to another "generation" of V8 Mustangs.

I also agree that Ford is taking advantage of the demand to make as much profit as they can. That is actually the job of Ford's management team and they have every incentive to deliver on it. Like I said, the market determines the price. If people were not willing to pay, then the car would not sell. But I doubt they would lower the price, they would just drop the line. The ONLY way for a company like Ford to be able to sell a relatively low volume car like the Mustang is for that car to be margin accretive. If it became margin diluting shareholders would not be happy.

Either charge less, or build it better for the price. There's no excuse for removing a light bulb to save three and a half cents from a car that's already too expensive for its quality to begin with. If you're going to charge more than it's worth just because the market will bear it, then at least have the decency not to insult us by cutting costs so obviously and shamelessly. Come on, a light bulb? In a $35K car that you're selling for $50K? Really?

I totally agree that Ford is cheaping out. That was the point of my post that started this whole discussion. My other point was that they can get away with it because there is no other option for a V8 RWD car at this price point. I am not defending Ford, but I am being pragmatic.

If you want a V8 RWD car, the Mustang is one of the most affordable options left. You can say that it is not a good value and you would not be wrong, but that doesn't change that the fact that there aren't any better options out there.

 

[murick]

Compared to BMWs and Volvos (two "premium-ish" brands that I have owned), there is just no comparison, especially in the small details.

There is no comparison even to "puny" Škoda (VW group)

There aren't. Which is why Ford can afford to charge whatever they want. But that doesn't mean the Mustang is cheap. It's extremely expensive for what it is, it's just that the market is willing to pay the price for lack of better options.

My sentiments exactly. Unfortunately I kind of fell in love with the Mustang concept (NA V8 with more than 400 HP) and cannot really see the same joy or fun in turbocharged 4 or 6-cylinder, even though I know the manufacturing quality would be much better. Also there is a direct relation between the price and the engine power. Cars with >400 HP are 50% more expensive here, plus I would certainly be more shy to add mods or change components on BMW M4 or such.
Anyway, Ford knows very well, what they can and do sell and asks for the price we are willing to pay. There is no magic V8 voodoo in it.

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