Quicker throttle response

[kz]

Since you know soo much, explain to me how Sport mode and Track mode work vs how the Pedalmax works and what the difference is. On the manual trans that is.

Sport / track are simple throttle maps that have been published here many times. How pedal max works I have no clue but it clearly isn't getting the signal to ECU faster - anybody saying so had to be sleeping at school...

Only option would be if ECU is looking for a _rate_ of change of throttle position - which is possible. Still doesn't explain how this device would impact it...

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[4V Mayhem]

So nobody is able to explain how pedal max makes throttle response quicker (physics isn't on your side guys which SergeyMelnik tried to point out), neither anybody provided any kind of measurements or any proof this is the case. And of course if I had spent few hundreds on it, I would be singing praises and calling others idiots just to not look like an idiot myself.

Sport / track are simple throttle maps that have been published here many times. How pedal max works I have no clue but it clearly isn't getting the signal to ECU faster - anybody saying so had to be sleeping at school...

Only option would be if ECU is looking for a _rate_ of change of throttle position - which is possible. Still doesn't explain how this device would impact it...

Ok...so it isn't getting the signal to the ECU faster...according to you. Ok. Thanks for explaining that. That doesn't mean it doesn't work or that it doesn't do what it claims. If the argument is about whether or not it gets a signal tot he ECU faster, then I can understand you and Sergey debating. But if you both are trying to say that it does absolutely nothing then you both are completely wrong. Nobody needs to be an electronic expert or have a masters degree in electronic or engineering to know if something works or not. And nobody needs a full explanation or breakdown analysis of exactly how it works to know that it does work. Whether it gets the signal faster or sends a stronger signal or gives different input...nobody cares. It doesn't harm anything, it won't void your warranty, and it improves throttle feel by a large margin.

 

[tomnelsonii]

Look, all we are saying is don't knock it until you've actually tried it. Some of us like the PedalMax and the feel it gives at the accelerator. Others may not?

So, I'll leave the rest the discussion alone and simplify things...

I much prefer my car with the PedalMax installed. Driving the car is much more fun with the PedalMax. I'm fine if all it does is open the throttle farther for the same amount of input at the pedal. At least the car doesn't feel like a turd anymore.

In the end, we all have Mustangs and share a common interest. I'm going for a drive...

:ford:

 

[kz]

Ok...so it isn't getting the signal to the ECU faster...according to you. Ok. Thanks for explaining that. That doesn't mean it doesn't work or that it doesn't do what it claims. If the argument is about whether or not it gets a signal tot he ECU faster, then I can understand you and Sergey debating. But if you both are trying to say that it does absolutely nothing then you both are completely wrong. Nobody needs to be an electronic expert or have a masters degree in electronic or engineering to know if something works or not. And nobody needs a full explanation or breakdown analysis of exactly how it works to know that it does work. Whether it gets the signal faster or sends a stronger signal or gives different input...nobody cares. It doesn't harm anything, it won't void your warranty, and it improves throttle feel by a large margin.

It clearly does something - I believe SergeyMelnik is saying it amplifies pedal signal so ECU thinks it is pushed further than it really is. Others are saying it is doing something else and can't really define it ("it will take off quicker") but say it's awesome.
Until somebody measures response or at least 0-60 times in a repeatable way, all this is a moot discussion.
Hopefully everybody agrees that once pedal is down to the floor, throttle is fully open in both cases. If not, we have a serious problem ;-)

 

[daltron]

It clearly does something - I believe SergeyMelnik is saying it amplifies pedal signal so ECU thinks it is pushed further than it really is. Others are saying it is doing something else and can't really define it ("it will take off quicker") but say it's awesome.
Until somebody measures response or at least 0-60 times in a repeatable way, all this is a moot discussion.
Hopefully everybody agrees that once pedal is down to the floor, throttle is fully open in both cases. If not, we have a serious problem ;-)

It is not a performance mod. It is a drivability mod. Can't say that enough. I'll say again, if anyone is in SoCal AND a known member here, I am more than willing to let them borrow mine. The increased throttle body response is hard to articulate on a forum. I would put mine back on and try to demonstrate it but I have no desire to fit my big body back under the dash.

 

[SergeyMelnik]

Since you know soo much, explain to me how Sport mode and Track mode work vs how the Pedalmax works and what the difference is. On the manual trans that is.

 

[kz]

It is not a performance mod. It is a drivability mod. Can't say that enough. I'll say again, if anyone is in SoCal AND a known member here, I am more than willing to let them borrow mine. The increased throttle body response is hard to articulate on a forum. I would put mine back on and try to demonstrate it but I have no desire to fit my big body back under the dash.

That's exactly why I wrote measurements are needed. Driveability is subjective and I have no doubt that people like it (which is also why i wrote that it clearly does something). But when discussion moves towards words "faster" or "quicker" I call bullshit.

 

[SergeyMelnik]

Since you know soo much, explain to me how Sport mode and Track mode work vs how the Pedalmax works and what the difference is. On the manual trans that is.

As you can see from the image above the only thing that switching drive modes does to the pedal is change the inut vs output. In track mode at 85 percent pedal press you get an output of 100 percent giving you a deadspot at the end of the pedal just like the pedalmax. Normal mode gives you a 1to1 ratio just like throttle by cable. Whether the ecu eases up on torque management after it receives the pedal signal in track mode I dont know. But we do know the pedalmax doesnt alter the ecu so it still does what it wants to after the signal gets there.
Personally if I had drive modes I would ask my tuner to give me me 1to1 ratio in all modes and disable all torque management at the software level.

 

[4V Mayhem]

As you can see from the image above the only thing that switching drive modes does to the pedal is change the inut vs output. In track mode at 85 percent pedal press you get an output of 100 percent giving you a deadspot at the end of the pedal just like the pedalmax. Normal mode gives you a 1to1 ratio just like throttle by cable. Whether the ecu eases up on torque management after it receives the pedal signal in track mode I dont know. But we do know the pedalmax doesnt alter the ecu so it still does what it wants to after the signal gets there.
Personally if I had drive modes I would ask my tuner to give me me 1to1 ratio in all modes and disable all torque management at the software level.

End of the day, the result is the same. If the Pedalmax doesn't do exactly what the different modes do, it still has the same effect. And you cannot argue that effect. Like I said, if you guys are arguing about the exact science of how it does it's thing, then go ahead...most of us don't care anyway. But if you're trying to say that the Pedalmax doesn't do anything simply because it may or may not (according to you) do exactly what the different modes do, then you are wrong.

Personally if I had drive modes I would ask my tuner to give me me 1to1 ratio in all modes and disable all torque management at the software level.

Plus, not everyone wants to void their warranty with a tune. Even at that, there are those who will use a canned tune but might not fully trust a custom tuner. I've said it before, the Pedalmax and devices like it are perfect for someone with small bolt-on mods who don't want to do anything extensive, void their warranty, or spend a crazy amount of money modding. If you're doing just a CAI and catback, then this is perfect. If you plan to do cams, headers, forced induction, etc...then skip this altogether.

 

[4V Mayhem]

It is not a performance mod. It is a drivability mod. Can't say that enough. I'll say again, if anyone is in SoCal AND a known member here, I am more than willing to let them borrow mine. The increased throttle body response is hard to articulate on a forum. I would put mine back on and try to demonstrate it but I have no desire to fit my big body back under the dash.

This is exactly my point. That you won't notice much on the track because you're at WOT for 85% of the 1/4 mile or 1/8th mile. The little amount of time you spend pressing the accelerator will have an insignificant impact. But around a circle track or when canyon carving or even just in every day light to light traffic it'll make your car much more fun to drive.

 

[SergeyMelnik]

It is not a performance mod. It is a drivability mod. Can't say that enough. I'll say again, if anyone is in SoCal AND a known member here, I am more than willing to let them borrow mine. The increased throttle body response is hard to articulate on a forum. I would put mine back on and try to demonstrate it but I have no desire to fit my big body back under the dash.

The pedal does not connect to the throttle body. It connects to the ecu which then connects to the throttle body. Sprintpedalboostermax has no effect on throttle body response.

Oh and I just checked the price of these things. This whole time i thought they were 100 bucks but they charge 300? This is the literal definition of snake oil. This is the same thing as buying a 30 dollar ebay chip and hooking it up to your maf to trick the ecu reading. Then you find out its a 30 cent resister. Except this is worse because they could sell this product for 15 dollars and still make a profit and they lie in their videos.

If they made this product for your steering and it made 100 percent steering output be only 50 percent steering input would that increase steering output response?

 

[4V Mayhem]

The pedal does not connect to the throttle body. It connects to the ecu which then connects to the throttle body. Sprintpedalboostermax has no effect on throttle body response.

Oh and I just checked the price of these things. This whole time i thought they were 100 bucks but they charge 300? This is the literal definition of snake oil. This is the same thing as buying a 30 dollar ebay chip and hooking it up to your maf to trick the ecu reading. Then you find out its a 30 cent resister. Except this is worse because they could sell this product for 15 dollars and still make a profit and they lie in their videos.

If they made this product for your steering and it made 100 percent steering output be only 50 percent steering input would that increase steering output response?

Snake oil is selling something that doesn't work or that does something that is ultimately harmful. Those resistors are snake oil because they fool the ECU into thinking the temp is cooler out so the ECU responds to that input. Meanwhile it is 98 degrees out and the ECU cannot adjust properly because it doesn't know. This is completely different. 1 because it works, 2 because it is not harmful to the ECU or the engine.

 

[Kong76]

And this is where the false assumption lies. Once you understand that pedal itself causes zero lag you can understand how the pedalmax works.
So youre telling me that if you install this pedalmax between the pedal and ecu, it will take the pedal signal and get it to the ecu faster? Can you please explain how this works?

If you are going to quote me atleast stay on the subject line I posted and address that. In a drive by wire system with a brush resistor contact patch that then sends the signal to a solenoid yes it does have a delay. Anytime a signal has to be sent anywhere and make communication with something else that then has to relate that to another point creates a delay. You stated once you push the pedal on our factory drive by wire system it is an instant response. False! The only "instant" response you will get is drive by cable throttle system.

The only thing I will agree with you on is that it is very over priced.

 

[SergeyMelnik]

4V Mayhem;1456073]End of the day, the result is the same. If the Pedalmax doesn't do exactly what the different modes do, it still has the same effect. And you cannot argue that effect. Like I said, if you guys are arguing about the exact science of how it does it's thing, then go ahead...most of us don't care anyway. But if you're trying to say that the Pedalmax doesn't do anything simply because it may or may not (according to you) do exactly what the different modes do, then you are wrong.

Yes the output is increased in the pedalmax just like in the drive modes and no one is arguing that. And no one is arguing the exact science because its already been explained and yes I believe most people do care when theyre spending 300 bucks on a scam product. "But if you're trying to say that the Pedalmax doesn't do anything simply because it may or may not (according to you) do exactly what the different modes do, then you are wrong." What does this even mean? Ive clearly explained how this product works and gave you a pic of the factory throttle tables which clearly show what Ive been saying. The pedalmax can do what track mode does only at the pedal and thats it. But we know track moded changes much more than just throttle input vs output. So no it doesnt do "exactly" what the pedalmax does and you are the one whos "wrong".

Plus, not everyone wants to void their warranty with a tune. Even at that, there are those who will use a canned tune but might not fully trust a custom tuner. I've said it before, the Pedalmax and devices like it are perfect for someone with small bolt-on mods who don't want to do anything extensive, void their warranty, or spend a crazy amount of money modding. If you're doing just a CAI and catback, then this is perfect. If you plan to do cams, headers, forced induction, etc...then skip this altogether.

Ive said it before and I will say it again the pedalmax and the re badged clones in my opinion are perfect for absolutely no one regardless of what mods you have. This product could be 30 bucks with the addition of some sort of block or mechanism that can attach to your stock gas pedal to stop it once you reach 100 percent ouput with the pedalmax so as to get rid of the deadspot. But it doesnt come with that, and its a scam at 300. Why not go with an aftermarket adjustable gas pedal that will do the same exact thing for much less money? And why on earth would you recommend it to people with boltons but not for people with forced induction? Wouldnt you want to get rid of all throttle lag regardless of the amount of power the car has?

 

[SergeyMelnik]

Snake oil is selling something that doesn't work or that does something that is ultimately harmful. Those resistors are snake oil because they fool the ECU into thinking the temp is cooler out so the ECU responds to that input. Meanwhile it is 98 degrees out and the ECU cannot adjust properly because it doesn't know. This is completely different. 1 because it works, 2 because it is not harmful to the ECU or the engine.

Snake oil was used as potions to cure ailments. Pedalbooster is used as a potion to cure throttle lag. Sure it does something at the sacrifice of a few other things but it isnt doing what they claim it is doing with their lie videos and their pre drawn "graphs" therefore in my eyes its the definition of snake oil. If you dont want it to be snake oil I can call it something else. Cobra oil, an even bigger rip off than snake oil with a much more convincing presentation.

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