Official Performance Pack Level 2

[Nanashii]

Interesting, other than the Race Red car which Ford used for the press pictures, we haven't seen the front splitter in any of the pictures posted on this forum.

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[UAmach1]

Interesting, other than the Race Red car which Ford used for the press pictures, we haven't seen the front splitter in any of the pictures posted on this forum.

It was on the rumored "prototype" mach1 images that were floating around a while ago. It was really the PP2 in testing.

 

[Competition Orange]

I'm actually seriously disappointed with Ford on this. By the time you get hosed with mandatory options you don't want, and have to pay more for the options you do want, it is not a good deal at all compared to a 1SS Camaro with 1LE package.

Ford still doesn't have pricing on the order site in Canada, no mention of PP2 at all, so it's hard to get apples to apples. But even to just get PP1 you now have to take 301A, which I don't want. I can order a 1SS Camaro 1LE and it specs out $4K cheaper than a PP1 Mustang with comparable options, such as magneride and the variable exhaust which the 1LE includes. No idea what the PP2 is going to be since it's not even on their website, but it's sure to be another couple thousand more.

And for those that think the PP2 will take a 1SS 1LE, I don't think so, especially if the contest is on a road course and lasts longer than 20 minutes. The 1LE comes with auxillary oil coolers on engine, trans and diff standard equipment on any V8 powered Camaro, don't think they'll be going into limp mode after 20 minutes of track use. Chevalay is quoting 3675 lbs for a 1SS 1LE, that should give it superiority on the drag strip as well.

I just hate the look of the Camaro, and the interior sucks. But for price, performance, mechanical equipment and with the reduced weight of their platform it is a simple choice for a car that's going to see the track a lot.

I like my car a lot, and I'm not seriously thinking of trading up, but if I did decide to buy new I'd have a hard time going with the Mustang again. Never owned a Chevalay of any kind, but there's a first time for everything, especially when Ford misses some real big opportunities. Then there's the whole "where is Ford going" thing with the new CEO and all. Not a great time in Fordville I'm afraid.

The sky isn't falling. The GT PP2 will be the most capable non specialty Mustang to date. IMO, the Camaro beats it in only 1 category (maybe 2) and that's the coolers (second is guaranteed warranty on tracked vehicles). BUT going with the 1LE means you're trading the above for a car with universally acknowledged visibility problems, a significantly smaller cabin, and for me personally, a significant downgrade in interior and an exterior that only a mother could love. I get that aesthetics are a personal choice, but my opinion stands.

Considering I don't even fit in the 6th gens, a helmet is out of the question. I'd also gladly take the Coyote (especially the new 18+ engine) high revving characteristics, but have to add some coolers. Most people, even those that track their car, won't need the coolers.

With that said, I'd much prefer Ford to have included the coolers, or made them a factory option for say, $1,500 on the PP2.

If you are cross shopping a Camaro and using raw numbers to do it, you are doing it all wrong. Go drive that coffin around in traffic for a bit...

But then again, it sounds like your are a professional racer and are more concerned about racing equipment that comes stock, and stock racing. So Chevy is the perfect choice for such people.


Otherwise Ford Performance Racing Catalog means nothing, because those don't come with the car. And you want everything stock, because it is the cheapest.

:shrug:

I agree, but the coolers should have been standard on the PP2. At a minimum the oil and diff coolers.

Price/time is also an issue, you can get a SS 1LE for about the same price as a 301A+PP2 and have coolers on it for the track. You can also get a 1LE today, but you'll have to wait a few more months to get your PP2 even if you order it now.

I actually find it amazing so many people are willing to spend the 40-50k on a new GT PP2 when a lightly used 16/17 GT350 can be had for the same price. Hell even 5k more would be absolutely worth the upgrade for resale alone.

 

[Swamp-Yankee]

I’ll be curious to see what Ford does with PP2 in MY19. If the GT350 goes away to make space in the Mustang lineup for the GT500, then there might be some chance that the GT350’s transmission and differential coolers will become part of an expanded feature list for PP Level 2.

 

[TomcatDriver]

The sky isn't falling. The GT PP2 will be the most capable non specialty Mustang to date. IMO, the Camaro beats it in only 1 category (maybe 2) and that's the coolers (second is guaranteed warranty on tracked vehicles). BUT going with the 1LE means you're trading the above for a car with universally acknowledged visibility problems, a significantly smaller cabin, and for me personally, a significant downgrade in interior and an exterior that only a mother could love. I get that aesthetics are a personal choice, but my opinion stands.

Considering I don't even fit in the 6th gens, a helmet is out of the question. I'd also gladly take the Coyote (especially the new 18+ engine) high revving characteristics, but have to add some coolers. Most people, even those that track their car, won't need the coolers.

With that said, I'd much prefer Ford to have included the coolers, or made them a factory option for say, $1,500 on the PP2.



I agree, but the coolers should have been standard on the PP2. At a minimum the oil and diff coolers.



I actually find it amazing so many people are willing to spend the 40-50k on a new GT PP2 when a lightly used 16/17 GT350 can be had for the same price. Hell even 5k more would be absolutely worth the upgrade for resale alone.

PP2 starts around $44K, so if by $40-50K you mean more like $50K, sure, there are lots to be had for $50K. There are very few below $45K and those are with daily-driver mileage. I would say yes, if you are planning on optioning your PP2 up into the $50K range, go look for a used GT350.

If you can find one that truly has been babied, the extra $5K is certainly worth it.

 

[UAmach1]

The sky isn't falling. The GT PP2 will be the most capable non specialty Mustang to date. IMO, the Camaro beats it in only 1 category (maybe 2) and that's the coolers (second is guaranteed warranty on tracked vehicles). BUT going with the 1LE means you're trading the above for a car with universally acknowledged visibility problems, a significantly smaller cabin, and for me personally, a significant downgrade in interior and an exterior that only a mother could love. I get that aesthetics are a personal choice, but my opinion stands.

Considering I don't even fit in the 6th gens, a helmet is out of the question. I'd also gladly take the Coyote (especially the new 18+ engine) high revving characteristics, but have to add some coolers. Most people, even those that track their car, won't need the coolers.

With that said, I'd much prefer Ford to have included the coolers, or made them a factory option for say, $1,500 on the PP2.



I agree, but the coolers should have been standard on the PP2. At a minimum the oil and diff coolers.



I actually find it amazing so many people are willing to spend the 40-50k on a new GT PP2 when a lightly used 16/17 GT350 can be had for the same price. Hell even 5k more would be absolutely worth the upgrade for resale alone.

My reason is quality/long term costs. I don;t plan to just let the car sit in the garage. I plan to drive it every day no matter weather.

The GT350 are known to use more oil and have not been as race or road tested as the 5.0 has. Also long term maintenance costs. A GT will be much cheaper to get parts for than a car that's been only made for 3 years with a very limited run engine. Modification costs will also be lower as there is a larger market.

 

[Competition Orange]

I’ll be curious to see what Ford does with PP2 in MY19. If the GT350 goes away to make space in the Mustang lineup for the GT500, then there might be some chance that the GT350’s transmission and differential coolers will become part of an expanded feature list for PP Level 2.

That'd be awesome, but I wouldn't hold your breath!

PP2 starts around $44K, so if by $40-50K you mean more like $50K, sure, there are lots to be had for $50K. There are very few below $45K and those are with daily-driver mileage. I would say yes, if you are planning on optioning your PP2 up into the $50K range, go look for a used GT350.

If you can find one that truly has been babied, the extra $5K is certainly worth it.

Figure normal incentives on the PP2 after the first wave of die hards order theirs. 40-50k is where I see these selling based on base cars with incentives to high optioned cars with very few incentives.

Regarding the GT350, cheapest one I've found is 43k for a track pack with 30k miles. Regularly finding 16 track packs for 47-48k with 5-10k miles. 17s seem to be around 48-55. Keep in mind these are asking prices, selling should be slightly lower. Also by the time the pp2 cars become available, you're into the spring and I bet we see most 16s in the 40s regardless of condition/mileage.

I know after experiencing the resale on my car purchased at $4,250 off with zero % financing, I would pay significantly more for a used GT350 vs a new "regular" GT (PP2 will follow regular GT resale, IMO).

New vs used, I hate this argument, but the GT350 is worth the compare IMO.

My reason is quality/long term costs. I don;t plan to just let the car sit in the garage. I plan to drive it every day no matter weather.

The GT350 are known to use more oil and have not been as race or road tested as the 5.0 has. Also long term maintenance costs. A GT will be much cheaper to get parts for than a car that's been only made for 3 years with a very limited run engine. Modification costs will also be lower as there is a larger market.

All of that is moot when resale is realized after a couple years on the GT. Long term analysis will always favor the GT350. Burning oil isn't a big deal, 5.0s will do it too, and if you track the car, it'll do it more. Also, you won't have to modify the GT350 much.

 

[UAmach1]

That'd be awesome, but I wouldn't hold your breath!



Figure normal incentives on the PP2 after the first wave of die hards order theirs. 40-50k is where I see these selling based on base cars with incentives to high optioned cars with very few incentives.

Regarding the GT350, cheapest one I've found is 43k for a track pack with 30k miles. Regularly finding 16 track packs for 47-48k with 5-10k miles. 17s seem to be around 48-55. Keep in mind these are asking prices, selling should be slightly lower. Also by the time the pp2 cars become available, you're into the spring and I bet we see most 16s in the 40s regardless of condition/mileage.

I know after experiencing the resale on my car purchased at $4,250 off with zero % financing, I would pay significantly more for a used GT350 vs a new "regular" GT (PP2 will follow regular GT resale, IMO).

New vs used, I hate this argument, but the GT350 is worth the compare IMO.



All of that is moot when resale is realized after a couple years on the GT. Long term analysis will always favor the GT350. Burning oil isn't a big deal, 5.0s will do it too, and if you track the car, it'll do it more. Also, you won't have to modify the GT350 much.

I wasn't aware I had shared my goals with you.

I also with how many 15+ GT owners there are here I see less threads worried about oil usage and possibly having engines replaced than I do in the GT350 section.

Couple of years? I'm not some ***** that sells cars because I get bored with them. I don't get rid of a car unless it's no longer moving.

If a 5.2 breaks after warranty it will be a lot more pricey to fix than a 5.0. Same with bumpers and front fenders. Any head work I want. Hell they still don't make cams for the 5.2 yet. Welcome to reality. A car that is a short run will ALWAYS be more expensive to fix, modify and upkeep. Resale means 0 to me if I have to spend more than that difference just to keep it running and do what I want with it.

 

[Competition Orange]

LOL, K.

 

[TomcatDriver]

I really hate the resale argument. What if you're a person that....wait for it.....actually keeps their cars and aren't chasing rainbows every few years? At this point if my base PP2 is here before April 2nd I'll be getting it for $5,000 off with the $1,500 rebate and my $3,500 off negotiated price which comes out to $44k OTD. Someone just posted they have a lead on a ruby red GT350 in the Sacramento area for msrp which would still be $68k OTD for me lol.

These used GT350's for $50k-$55k are tempting but why are these people selling these low mile (<5,000) after a year or less of ownership? Is the car not all they were hoping it'd be? Is their problems with it they don't want to disclose?

This is nothing new. Pick any car you like, and there are people out there selling their 1 year old beauty with less than 10K miles. Who knows why, some people like having the latest and greatest. That being said, sounds like you got a good deal.

 

[bootlegger]

I really hate the resale argument. What if you're a person that....wait for it.....actually keeps their cars and aren't chasing rainbows every few years? At this point if my base PP2 is here before April 2nd I'll be getting it for $5,000 off with the $1,500 rebate and my $3,500 off negotiated price which comes out to $44k OTD. Someone just posted they have a lead on a ruby red GT350 in the Sacramento area for msrp which would still be $68k OTD for me lol.

These used GT350's for $50k-$55k are tempting but why are these people selling these low mile (<5,000) after a year or less of ownership? Is the car not all they were hoping it'd be? Is their problems with it they don't want to disclose? Hell there have been multiple owners who's GT350's were sucking down a quart of oil anywhere between 150-1,000 miles then saying they rather sell the car than deal with this. Well oh great pass the problem to the next sucker.

There's a AG 2016 tech pack in the classifieds for $42k!! Honestly though I want the engine with more low end torque, having a gutless V8 does not sound fun.

Now, can we not turn the PP2 thread into another GT350 guys defending their cars percieved resale value?

And about someone who asked of PP2's are built but waiting to be shipped because of the weather? No PP2's are most likely going to be on the GT350r's schedule where they're scheduled to start being built March 1st. Ford crammed a bunch of R's in October then put it on hiatus till March. My order has been accepted and hoping to get a VIN # and build date any Thursday now.

I personally wouldn't want a 350GT, even if I could get it for the same OTD price as my car (about $41k). It most likely wouldn't come with a warranty, an used sports cars have always been a gamble for me. For my needs, PP1 or PP2 were the way to go.

 

[bootlegger]

I'm happy with my deal, thanks. I'm a person that plans to keep this car a long time so resale doesn't concern me. I'm driving my POS Mach 1 after 14 years.



How's that new 5.0 run? One thing GT350 guys always say is we don't know how special a GT350 is until you've driven it. The same can be said about about the Gen III Coyote, if you haven't driven it you can't knock it for being a plain GT. Hell, an R owner test drove a '18 then sold his R and ordered a PP2.

My buddies 401A premium 10 speed auto was delivered today so I'll have an opinion how sweet the thing is tomorrow.

I am learning how to drive it and keep it behaving. I found that the tires are worthless below 45F. I haven't been able to drive it for over a week.
One key thing I will mention, is how beautiful the engine is at high rpms. I am used to the old 4.6L, which offered little above 5500rpm. This car pushes hard to redline, and shifting quickly up there breaks the tires loose. I am also still very impressed by the capabilities of the magneride system. It really is the best of everything. Smooth and soft on bumps, then completely solid on hard turns.

 

[Tangodelta21]

And about someone who asked of PP2's are built but waiting to be shipped because of the weather? No PP2's are most likely going to be on the GT350r's schedule where they're scheduled to start being built March 1st. Ford crammed a bunch of R's in October then put it on hiatus till March. My order has been accepted and hoping to get a VIN # and build date any Thursday now.

It looks like we’re in the same boat on waiting to see what Ford does about the production dates. I ordered mine a few days before yours and all I’ve gotten is crickets. I didn’t get crickets out of the dealership that I ordered thru though. Once they found out what the car is they’ve tried to back pedal on the agreed price. I’m around 42–43 with cloth Recaro’s and active exhaust.

How far in advance will Ford attach a VIN to the order? I want to make sure the car I ordered is coming to me the way I ordered it and the dealership isn’t playing games. They’ve already tried to run me off of the deal so they could hang a premium on it like they did with the 350’s and Raptors.

 

[Grintch]

I think the confusion is Ford versus the dealership.

Ford makes the same (dealer invoice) no matter the ADM or amount sold above the invoice to the dealer.

The dealer makes the profit on whatever it sells the car for above the invoice from Ford.

Right. Plus remember that Ford has to develop, test, and certify the GT350/R. An expensive business.

Personally I think Ford would make more money selling more GT350s, and spreading it's development costs over more cars.

I think the dealers would make more up to a certain extent, though less per car, with more Shelby's too.

Hat's off to Chevy, who seem to be willing to make more of their premium 1LE, ZL1, and 1LE ZL1s. Most of my local dealer have them all, and multiple standard 1LE & ZL1's. While I never saw a local Ford dealer with more than 1 Shelby at a time, and NEVER saw a R.

 

[Grintch]

https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/showthread.php?t=96551

From the 2018 Ford Mustang brochure:

GT Performance Package Level II​

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2: GT Performance Package content,
plus MagneRide Damping System, unique track-inspired springs and sway
bar, 19" x 10.5" front and 19" x 11" rear Dark Tarnish Stainless-painted
aluminum wheels with 305/30R19 summer-only tires,3 unique track inspired tuning, and unique front splitter and rear spoiler (manual only).


No mention of Recaros being part of the package.​

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