Another Predator Engine Pic

[machsmith]

AWD isn't the only way to hook up a lot of power. Weight transfer management and slip control...

AWD helps a ton for straights. nothing like pulling and pushing at the same time. plus it keeps you in a straight line much better off the line.
maybe this is the next route with the new one, maybe not. maybe just additional electric power. it's exciting to see changes none the less. last GT500 was a tire burning first gear lockout machine. I have a feeling it will be 10x better even if it came with 662. hopefully weight increase isn't substantial

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[Nameless]

AWD helps a ton for straights. nothing like pulling and pushing at the same time. plus it keeps you in a straight line much better off the line.
maybe this is the next route with the new one, maybe not. maybe just additional electric power. it's exciting to see changes none the less. last GT500 was a tire burning first gear lockout machine. I have a feeling it will be 10x better even if it came with 662. hopefully weight increase isn't substantial

Definitely first gear needs to be torque limited....

at the top end, HP does matter. and you do use it. first couple gears, not so much, you do have to manage throttle, but after that it's pretty much full throttle, full HP.

Yes, it SHOULD be able to handle the hellcat with grip even tho there is a new wide body hellcat now, I believe they are only running 305s?? what helps the hellcat is that there is a lot of weight in that ass end. when drag radials are applied it's way quicker. the MP4S, should help this GT500 a lot.

305's in all four corners.... but wearing P-zero's with no grip at all.

 

[BmacIL]

Weight transfer helps for sure - at least in a straight line. I'm not sure what slip control is, sounds like a way of reducing power more so than actually hooking it up.

Most tires achieve peak forward traction at ~10% slip. It varies based on compound and construction, but thereabouts. Launch control on almost every fast supercar reduces and modulates torque output, so if you think that's always a bad thing for acceleration, it's not. Keeping the tire at its peak via active suspension tuning and torque curve management will make it a rocketship. AWD machines just have it a lot easier.

 

[Hack]

Most tires achieve peak forward traction at ~10% slip. It varies based on compound and construction, but thereabouts. Launch control on almost every fast supercar reduces and modulates torque output, so if you think that's always a bad thing for acceleration, it's not. Keeping the tire at its peak via active suspension tuning and torque curve management will make it a rocketship. AWD machines just have it a lot easier.

Interesting info. Thanks. And it makes sense that if the ECU can handle it you would maximize acceleration by allowing a precise amount of slip.

 

[ttime500]

Most tires achieve peak forward traction at ~10% slip. It varies based on compound and construction, but thereabouts. Launch control on almost every fast supercar reduces and modulates torque output, so if you think that's always a bad thing for acceleration, it's not. Keeping the tire at its peak via active suspension tuning and torque curve management will make it a rocketship. AWD machines just have it a lot easier.

The hard part is them actually spending the engineering and tunning time to perfect it. The Z06 has LC it’s ok but most can beat it. Obviously tires/compound matter a ton, biggest mistake they made on the HC. How much advantage can a DCT have over a standard TC auto or in this case the A10?? Also do you think it’ll come standard with MP4S or MPSC2 tires?

 

[BmacIL]

The hard part is them actually spending the engineering and tunning time to perfect it. The Z06 has LC it’s ok but most can beat it. Obviously tires/compound matter a ton, biggest mistake they made on the HC. How much advantage can a DCT have over a standard TC auto or in this case the A10?? Also do you think it’ll come standard with MP4S or MPSC2 tires?

SC2 almost certainly.

 

[ttime500]

SC2 almost certainly.

I figured that. Do you know if there’s a large advantage for a DCT over an A10 specifically with launching?

 

[jacknifetoaswan]

I figured that. Do you know if there’s a large advantage for a DCT over an A10 specifically with launching?

Usually, a DCT removes a torque converter, so there's a spinning mass advantage, as well as an overall weight advantage. Acura has a DCT with a TC, so it would remain to be seen what Ford went with.

JR

 

[machsmith]

Are you talking about mile top speed runs or something? I would think with that amount of HP at 60 or 70 mph you are still in potential wheel spinning territory.

Not really, it pretty much was planted after 60, and thats in a 3900lb 760HP car. We're not talking 1000HP+ here, 750 to 800 is a sweet spot in a 4100lb car, I would think.
With the 720 or whatever we're supposedly getting and the DCT, I think it will hero run at 10.5, but that may take some DR's. Speculation.
With whats all being said, it sounds more like a track car...and a heavy one at that.

 

[Hack]

I figured that. Do you know if there’s a large advantage for a DCT over an A10 specifically with launching?

Great question. I don't know the answer but it's fun to think about before hearing the actual information.

In a low power setup the torque converter allows more low RPM slippage prior to locking up - helping get the engine up into the power band. I would think that there is some variation in how a torque converter transmits power though. A torque converter might not be the best way to control launching in various different conditions. I'm not sure whether modern torque converters have controls on them to change lockup based on a computer signal or not.

My assumption would be that when regulated by a computer a clutch can more easily control the amount of slippage while the computer also regulates the engine power output.

I'm interested to hear from the experts here.

 

[ttime500]

Great question. I don't know the answer but it's fun to think about before hearing the actual information.

In a low power setup the torque converter allows more low RPM slippage prior to locking up - helping get the engine up into the power band. I would think that there is some variation in how a torque converter transmits power though. A torque converter might not be the best way to control launching in various different conditions. I'm not sure whether modern torque converters have controls on them to change lockup based on a computer signal or not.

My assumption would be that when regulated by a computer a clutch can more easily control the amount of slippage while the computer also regulates the engine power output.

I'm interested to hear from the experts here.

I’ve been wondering the same. I was thinking in line with you, a Dct is essentially a computer controlled manual trans so I think it can perfect the slippage like you said, giving a very good consistent launch. All the guys I’ve spoke to with DCT say they launch amazing but none of them had close to this kind of power!!! Definitely interested in what experts have to say as well.

 

[BmacIL]

McLaren P1 and 720S, LaFerrari, F12 all have similar outputs and have DCTs. All also have fabulous launch control setups.

 

[machsmith]

I seen on another forum how GM ordered 30,000 of the tremec DCT's as well, but the trans axle, same spec otherwise. They are jamming that one into their ME, and I think they are getting some of the longitudinal for the Z28 as well.
Would be interesting to find out how many Ford ordered.

 

[Go Time]

Reveal of the 18 was last January. IIRC order banks opened in June? I'd expect an actual reveal in the March-April time frame, maybe May.

That's about right. Customers will be driving this car in late summer / early Fall.

 

[tdzee]

I figured that. Do you know if there’s a large advantage for a DCT over an A10 specifically with launching?

This is the key question. For launch, I think the auto has an advantage. I have driven 3 different DCT cars, incl GTR, 430 Scud and a VW diesel. They all struggled at launch. It boils down to how they programmed the electric clutch slippage with power application. It is just never as good as a human can do it. As an engineer, I know that can be optimized, but there are numerous dynamic variables in play and it is a hard thing to capture in SW.

Once moving, the DCT has the advantage as it changes gears awesomely fast and provides rev matching (which is almost more important than the fast shifts).

Can't wait to learn more. Cumon Ford. :cheers:

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