Alignment issue?

[GTP]

It is easy to change my front camber back and forth on track day.
Wish it was the same for the rear. If so, I'd dial-out some rear camber. My last set of A/S street tires really wore the inside shoulders and it was NOT due to excessive toe-in.

However, I end up rotating tires fairly often.

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[Buldawg76]

@Buldawg76 ...wow, you're a better man than I am. Call it OCD or whatever label you want, no way I could live with nor accept that. Funny part is I don't disagree with your statements and can't aargue you're wrong, but I couldn't do it.

Two rebuttals would be this...you have adjustable camber arms in the rear. There's no reason to leave the camber in the rear like that. I would even argue having that much cross-camber difference in the rear (and most likely in the front as well) is downright visible to the naked eye. That alone would drive me insane and require addressing.

I will disagree on having adjustable camber in the rear without adding either adjustable camber arms or the small tab kit that attachs to the diff housing. the only rear adjustment is toe. At least on my ecos rear suspension. GT350 may indeed have adjustable rear camber since its made for track use.

Believe me I am an anal perfectionist and retired certified master tech that has aligned more cars then i can remember on old hunter light beam machines as well as the new laser machines and unless you track a car and need the utmost precision in handling it is just not that critical that it be dead nuts as far as tire wear is concerned.

BD

 

[Buldawg76]

I just ordered one of these off eBay for $12. Clip it to the rotor with the wheel on. Should be accurate enough to check if it agrees with the alignment shop. If not, I'd suspect the shop!

The issue with using one of those attached to the rotor is there is no way to load the suspension, so it is at ride height with vehicle weight on all four wheels so the setting you dial in will change once the wheels are put back on and the car is lowered on the ground. Even if you support under the control arms it is not the same as with wheels on the ground, yes it will be close but if we are talking OCD then it's not perfect.

BD

 

[GTP]

Uh .. it is only 2" square and it will slip between the wheel spokes and clip onto the rotor. IOW wheels are still on.

 

[galaxy]

@Buldawg76 ...ahhhh, dind't notice (and dind't know) about the EB. I figured all 550's used that saem basic design and components in the rear subframe. Yes, 350, and regular GT's have adjustable camber in the rear.

 

[WD Pro]

I will disagree on having adjustable camber in the rear without adding either adjustable camber arms or the small tab kit that attachs to the diff housing. the only rear adjustment is toe. At least on my ecos rear suspension. GT350 may indeed have adjustable rear camber since its made for track use.

Believe me I am an anal perfectionist and retired certified master tech that has aligned more cars then i can remember on old hunter light beam machines as well as the new laser machines and unless you track a car and need the utmost precision in handling it is just not that critical that it be dead nuts as far as tire wear is concerned.

BD

I don't believe this is 350 (or GT) specific ?

There absolutely is and it takes about 15 seconds of looking at toe link to figure out how. Camber adjustment is at the upper mount of the camber link (deeper in the subframe) - undo the bolt and shift the link towards either side. Ford's shop manual shows this clearly that any show should have access to.
I'm bored so see the pics from the manual. Dude has to be literally blind to not spot toe adjustment...

WD

 

[Buldawg76]

I don't believe this is 350 (or GT) specific ?



WD

Ok, the pic on the left is for adjusting toe in the rear and the right pic shows a slot that I was not aware of being in the attaching bracket and will check my service manual to see if it states it can be used to adjust camber. The problem with the slot is there is no provision to keep the adjustment from moving under load other than bolt clamping torque which I can see it moving under heavy loads while corning and hitting bumps in the road.

BD

 

[Buldawg76]

Check my manual and I stand corrected on the rear camber adjustment as it is adjustable using the slot in the inner camber arm bracket and is torqued to 85 ft/lbs.

But the only means of adjusting the front is to remove the strut to knuckle bolts and grind a slot in the upper mounting hole of the strut to accommodate movement of the knuckle in the strut. Plus, the strut to knuckle bolts are one time use only bolts so every time you would change the camber adjustment you need to replace the bolts due to being a TTY bolts.

Kind if defeats the purpose of adjusting rear camber when the front is fixed IMO.

 

[Dana Pants]

Ford says to throw away almost every fastener at service. On paper, the front bolts aren’t in the TTY region based on their size, grade, torque spec, and how it “feels” tightening them.

 

[Buldawg76]

Uh .. it is only 2" square and it will slip between the wheel spokes and clip onto the rotor. IOW wheels are still on.

Ok was not aware it could be installed with wheels on so would be useful tool to have.

You have a link for it.

BD

 

[Buldawg76]

Ford says to throw away almost every fastener at service. On paper, the front bolts aren’t in the TTY region based on their size, grade, torque spec, and how it “feels” tightening them.

I have reused bolts many times in past years also before they started going with TTY fasteners when you just torqued to a spec with no added torque angle spec. Bolts like main/rod and head bolts were reused for years with no issues for sure, but now they are torque to yield with added torque angles, so the bolts stretch to produce the desired clamp loads. This stretch weakens the bolts threaded region and is why it is classified as TTY.

I would hate to reuse a fastener that the manufacture states are one time use only and have a front strut bolt break causing an accident resulting in someone's death that you could be sued for due to reuse of a TTY fastener. Not worth the risk IMO.

BD

 

[GTP]

Ok was not aware it could be installed with wheels on so would be useful tool to have.

You have a link for it.

BD

Magnetic Digital Angle Gauge

Woodworkers like these because they clip to their saw blade for a more accurate measurement. You'll find one at Rockler for ~$30.

But I like eBay personally. Cheaper, comes to my porch, and it helps the smaller businesses.

I chose this particular one based on price, but also because the housing is metal which I think will help accuracy. Should be readable when clipped to the 12:00 position of the rotor.

I plan to lay my 2' level on the floor, then put this gauge on top and press the Zero button. Then clip it to the rotor. I'm not looking for anything more precise than the stated accuracy of this gauge. I'll be more particular about toe when I use my new string setup.

 

[GTP]

Check my manual and I stand corrected on the rear camber adjustment as it is adjustable using the slot in the inner camber arm bracket and is torqued to 85 ft/lbs.

But the only means of adjusting the front is to remove the strut to knuckle bolts and grind a slot in the upper mounting hole of the strut to accommodate movement of the knuckle in the strut. Plus, the strut to knuckle bolts are one time use only bolts so every time you would change the camber adjustment you need to replace the bolts due to being a TTY bolts.

Three methods for adjustable front camber are camber plates, camber bolts, and slotting the strut. Combinations can also be used.

Please research the bolts and slot options before going down that path.

Camber bolts are used at the track by some and frowned on by others. Their torque spec is 125# versus 185# OEM. IOW, they are a smaller shank and there is a small chance they could snap under high track loads. It has been reported that they can also rotate causing the tire to rub against the strut.

Slotting virtually eliminates the spline feature of the strut and bolt, plus the risk of shifting as noted above.

Camber plates don't have these issues. For track use, they are limited to ~2.8° by either the 3 slots length (my case) or the strut top hole diameter (for more aggressive plates). But they will work well if you want to "stand up" your wheels more vertically.

 

[Dana Pants]

I have reused bolts many times in past years also before they started going with TTY fasteners when you just torqued to a spec with no added torque angle spec. Bolts like main/rod and head bolts were reused for years with no issues for sure, but now they are torque to yield with added torque angles, so the bolts stretch to produce the desired clamp loads. This stretch weakens the bolts threaded region and is why it is classified as TTY.

I would hate to reuse a fastener that the manufacture states are one time use only and have a front strut bolt break causing an accident resulting in someone's death that you could be sued for due to reuse of a TTY fastener. Not worth the risk IMO.

BD

Read the manual. There is no angle torque on those strut bolts.

 

[Buldawg76]

Magnetic Digital Angle Gauge

Woodworkers like these because they clip to their saw blade for a more accurate measurement. You'll find one at Rockler for ~$30.

But I like eBay personally. Cheaper, comes to my porch, and it helps the smaller businesses.

I chose this particular one based on price, but also because the housing is metal which I think will help accuracy. Should be readable when clipped to the 12:00 position of the rotor.

I plan to lay my 2' level on the floor, then put this gauge on top and press the Zero button. Then clip it to the rotor. I'm not looking for anything more precise than the stated accuracy of this gauge. I'll be more particular about toe when I use my new string setup.

Thanks for the link as I also like eBay for ease of purchase and shipping to door. I agree the accuracy is more than enough for our needs of attaching to a rotor for measurements.

I would also be interested in the string setup if you have a link to it as well.

BD

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