MAPerformance: Ultimate R&D Thread | Air, Fuel, & Turbo Upgrades

[RubyRedBoost]

I know I am

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[greg hazlett]

Adam, are you able to offer pricing on both and let people choose BB vs JB? For those with budget vs those with deep pockets?

Asked a knowledgeable turbo friend about the differences and here is what he said:

BB will spool a tad faster
BB is more reliable as it can support higher shaft rpm, generates less heat and requires less oil to lube.

Journal bearing is a metal on metal sleeve that "floats" on a pressurized oil film that has more heat and supports less rpm as it starts to deform, needing more oil to lube and cool.

In his opinion BB has a longer service life.

It will probable come down to what the cost difference between BB/journal.

 

[MAPerformance]

Asked a knowledgeable turbo friend about the differences and here is what he said:

BB will spool a tad faster
BB is more reliable as it can support higher shaft rpm, generates less heat and requires less oil to lube.

Journal bearing is a metal on metal sleeve that "floats" on a pressurized oil film that has more heat and supports less rpm as it starts to deform, needing more oil to lube and cool.

In his opinion BB has a longer service life.

It will probable come down to what the cost difference between BB/journal.

I prefer BB myself, but for the price difference (usually around $500.00) the benefit's don't outweigh the cost. For me however the cost doesn't outweigh piece of mind when you think "I bought the better turbo". I usually just buy BB for that reason.

JB works just fine, and will produce the same power. It also can be serviced by many dealers in the USA unlike BB that has to be sent back to PTE for rebuild/service work.

I have actually had less JB turbo's go bad on me than BB odd enough.

 

[Sup3rPat]

Hope the intercooler is still on track to ship this week... It's really warming up here!

 

[MAPerformance]

Hope the intercooler is still on track to ship this week... It's really warming up here!

That it is, all cores are prepped and the final operation of machining on the end tanks is being finished today!

 

[FreddyG]

Asked a knowledgeable turbo friend about the differences and here is what he said:

BB will spool a tad faster
BB is more reliable as it can support higher shaft rpm, generates less heat and requires less oil to lube.

Journal bearing is a metal on metal sleeve that "floats" on a pressurized oil film that has more heat and supports less rpm as it starts to deform, needing more oil to lube and cool.

In his opinion BB has a longer service life.

It will probable come down to what the cost difference between BB/journal.

I agree with most of what you said, but you'll see most, if not all OEM's using journal bearing turbos on their cars. I understand that most of it is a cost thing, in that the extra cost of adding ball bearings to a shaft would cut into their profit margin, but they still use the JB shafted turbos.

How many over the road diesels are out there with hundreds of thousands of miles on them that are on JB turbos? I believe that if you're good on your maintenance, and let the turbo wind down after spirited driving (a cool down timer helps too) then a JB turbo is fine. A good synthetic oil that doesn't break down as easily and also handles heat better doesn't hurt either.

If you want state of the art turbo design, a bit quicker spool or you have a bigger budget, then get a ball bearing shaft. Neither one is a bad choice.

Just my .02 and you get what you pay for! :cheers:

 

[mbreinin]

Using water to cool a turbo is designed to prevent bearing coke.

 

[Sup3rPat]

I need my fix *scratches neck* Any update on shipping of the intercoolers or turbo kit? I know, I got it bad... bit by the mod bug

 

[greg hazlett]

Using water to cool a turbo is designed to prevent bearing coke.

Not following this one....?

 

[MAPerformance]

Not following this one....?

There are watercooled turbo's on the market (PTE is not). The watercooled factor is to promoted thrust collar and bushing/bearing health. Unfortunately some cars coolant and oil temperature are the same and it doesn't help that much, or any at all. When the turbo is pushed it generate heats that will have its way with water or oil regardless. I like running water cooled turbo's on Subaru's and Honda's because their coolant system is pretty efficient and it definitely aides in bearing health.

 

[FreddyG]

Using water to cool a turbo is designed to prevent bearing coke.

Providing that your center housing allows you to do so. Not all turbos do (Garrett's have that option, but some other's don't as MAP has stated).

You can also prevent coking by staying out of boost a couple of minutes before shutting the car off. This lets the turbo/oil cool down, or you can put on a turbo timer. It accomplishes the same thing. :cheers:
Sorry to go off topic MAP......Now back to our Regularly scheduled programming!

 

[MAPerformance]

Alright guys, I'm doing the final set of tuning today. Going for the HP record on stock block. As far as I know the highest horsepower is 420whp right now on a pretty big turbo. So far we are at 408/400, graph below. I have already sold 2 of these kits, so if you are interested pre-order fast. ETA right now is 2-4 weeks, with the influx of orders I will make sure to give you a good ETA at the time of placing your order.

Pre-order is open now, please email me at [email protected] to purchase!

Price is $3,449.99 shipped and will include the following.

MAP Manifold (Turbo Kit Specific)
MAP Downpipe (Turbo Kit Specific)
MAP 3.5" Intake (Turbo Kit Specific)
MAP Passenger side hot pipe (Turbo Kit Specific)
MAP Oil Feed and Drain Line
MAP Coolant Bypass Line
Turbosmart Vee Port BOV
Turbosmart CompGate-40mm Wastegate
Precision 5858 Journal Bearing Turbo with SP Cover
PTP Turbo Blanket
DEI Heat Wrap
Tune file for Cobb Accessport

+500.00 for Ball Bearing Turbo
+500.00 if you don't have an Accessport

The tune file that comes with the kit will be for 93oct and is rated for 390hp/380tq @ 24psi. Once you get the turbo kit installed you will be required to send me multiple datalogs to fine tune the kit for your vehicle as not all cars are the same. Anyone without 93oct in their area will be covered, will product about 375hp/370tq depending on fuel quality.

We are finishing up the welding on the intercoolers today and tomorrow, and should start shipping all the kits out Monday/Tuesday. Once we are done with those, we will be building turbo kits. Once I have a brand new turbo kit ready I will post up pictures and get a product listing on our website!

The dynograph below isn't final, it just gives you an idea of the powerband that the car is producing with our kit. Remember, the kit you receive will come out of the box setup to run 390hp/380tq which is good middle ground to have good power with reliability.

 

[Surtur]

great now i have to change my pants...thanks a lot.

 

[boosted_orange]

great now i have to change my pants...thanks a lot.

I feel ya on that one...Lol

 

[bluestang50]

Awesome work Adam!

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