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Joe Gonsalves

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Like it or not, the ship has sailed. We can sit here and complain all day but change it's going to come any time soon. We have 2 choices, acceptance or boycott. If we boycott then Ford will possibly walk away from the Mustang as Chevy did with the Camaro. I for one don't want to see that happen. I'm not trading in my car just yet. Maybe in a year or 2 when Ford comes to it's senses I would.
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Strokerswild

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Like it or not, the ship has sailed. We can sit here and complain all day but change it's going to come any time soon. We have 2 choices, acceptance or boycott. If we boycott then Ford will possibly walk away from the Mustang as Chevy did with the Camaro. I for one don't want to see that happen. I'm not trading in my car just yet. Maybe in a year or 2 when Ford comes to it's senses I would.
It's boycott for me, I guess. S650 in general is a big swing and a miss, and most of it is styling. If I don't like a vehicle's looks, I'm not buying. Cost is secondary. That said, I'm not sure I'd buy the Dork Horse Superchaj if it was priced where the normal Dork Horse is. I just don't WANT the thing, and that's the crux.
 

Evolvd

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The target is probably people like me. Disposable income, mid fifties Gen X. I bounce around between manufacturers without a thought. Aston to Zagonda. All of my close car guy friends are that way too. None of us really pay attention to who makes the car. We focus on whether or not the driving experience is good or bad.

Edit: Thinking about why I'm this way. Probably because I grew up relatively poor. We drove shite, always, so dad wasn't leaving an impression about what manufacturer was good or bad. My group of friends (mostly the same to this day) worked on whatever piece of crap we owned.
This….all of this.
 

13GetThere

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Using the Dark Horse name is fine, I don’t think you need to totally rely on nostalgic names if the car performs. That said, I do think Dark Horse SC is a dumb name. They could’ve picked something better, whether it’s a new name or a nostalgic name.
I can't argue with this, even though the SC denotes a package name like HP after the Mach One name or PP2 after GT; they are packages within the group of models. However, I think there are 3 or 4 levels of the SC so it does get a little confusing, But what do I care, I can't afford the lowest level of SC.
Just babbling.
 

MAGS1

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Honestly, the Mustang needs a true competitor to come back into the fold. The Vette is not a true competitor, it’s a totally different car. Camaro, Challenger. Something needs to come back and push Ford. And I say that as someone who actually likes the S650 (I’m the rare bird here apparently). But, it could be better in certain areas and a true competitor would help with that. The Mustang is the only game in town with a 2+2 coupe and a big burly V8. They know it so they can kinda do whatever they want.

Total sales are pretty much inline with the last couple years of S550, which is probably about what they projected, so the way they see it, S650 is pretty much tracking their projections. We’ll see what the rest of this year looks like, but I’m seeing plenty of S650 GT’s and Eco’s around and starting to see a few DH’s out and about now that the weather is getting better.
 

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MAGS1

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I can't argue with this, even though the SC denotes a package name like HP after the Mach One name or PP2 after GT; they are packages within the group of models. However, I think there are 3 or 4 levels of the SC so it does get a little confusing, But what do I care, I can't afford the lowest level of SC.
Just babbling.
And I think (I don’t know cuz I’m not Ford) the SC is actually supposed to be a different model from the regular DH (GT500 replacement). So they really should’ve just picked a new name altogether. But, they’re trying to build the DH brand, so I get it from their end as well.
 

13GetThere

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And I think (I don’t know cuz I’m not Ford) the SC is actually supposed to be a different model from the regular DH (GT500 replacement). So they really should’ve just picked a new name altogether. But, they’re trying to build the DH brand, so I get it from their end as well.
After thinking about it for a few minutes you're right. If they wanted to keep the Dark Horse name out front, it should have been named the Dark Horse Boss or Cobra.
 

Evolvd

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And I think (I don’t know cuz I’m not Ford) the SC is actually supposed to be a different model from the regular DH (GT500 replacement). So they really should’ve just picked a new name altogether. But, they’re trying to build the DH brand, so I get it from their end as well.
The latest issue of Mustang Times goes into a bit of detail on what the DHSC has compared to the base DH.

Predator 5.2
Tremec 7 speed DCT
Carbon Fiber drive shaft
Updated steering rack, tie rods, and rear suspension geometry
Variable Traction Control
Revised underbody venting
Forged aluminum suspension components replace steel versions from the DH

And the Track pack adds more like CF wheels, ducktail spoiler (aids in downforce combined with wing), and more.

So just looking at the DH with a handling pack starts at $77.6K so add the Predator and DCT (which run about $30K for long block purchases) and you’re easily at the starting price of a DHSC.
 

MAGS1

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The latest issue of Mustang Times goes into a bit of detail on what the DHSC has compared to the base DH.

Predator 5.2
Tremec 7 speed DCT
Carbon Fiber drive shaft
Updated steering rack, tie rods, and rear suspension geometry
Variable Traction Control
Revised underbody venting
Forged aluminum suspension components replace steel versions from the DH

And the Track pack adds more like CF wheels, ducktail spoiler (aids in downforce combined with wing), and more.

So just looking at the DH with a handling pack starts at $77.6K so add the Predator and DCT (which run about $30K for long block purchases) and you’re easily at the starting price of a DHSC.
Good summary and the costs do line up. I guess some would argue the price of the DH HP is too high (therefore pushing the DH SC price too high). The price is what it is, but having driven a DH HP, it’s a really good car. The Trofeo’s are better than the Cup2’s IMO, at least from a grip standpoint. Tire life/wear I don’t know but they probably don’t last any longer than the Cup2’s do, probably wear a little quicker
 

Cobra99

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The latest issue of Mustang Times goes into a bit of detail on what the DHSC has compared to the base DH.

Predator 5.2
Tremec 7 speed DCT
Carbon Fiber drive shaft
Updated steering rack, tie rods, and rear suspension geometry
Variable Traction Control
Revised underbody venting
Forged aluminum suspension components replace steel versions from the DH

And the Track pack adds more like CF wheels, ducktail spoiler (aids in downforce combined with wing), and more.

So just looking at the DH with a handling pack starts at $77.6K so add the Predator and DCT (which run about $30K for long block purchases) and you’re easily at the starting price of a DHSC.
I think it a little bit deeper then this. You have to discount the cost of the driveline of the DH. There is some R&D built into this but it minimal as most of this was done for the GT500. like some have mentioned Ford has realized there is a cost buyers are willing to pay and they want that chuck instead of ADM from dealers
 

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saleen367

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Honestly, the Mustang needs a true competitor to come back into the fold. The Vette is not a true competitor, it’s a totally different car. Camaro, Challenger. Something needs to come back and push Ford. And I say that as someone who actually likes the S650 (I’m the rare bird here apparently). But, it could be better in certain areas and a true competitor would help with that. The Mustang is the only game in town with a 2+2 coupe and a big burly V8. They know it so they can kinda do whatever they want.

Total sales are pretty much inline with the last couple years of S550, which is probably about what they projected, so the way they see it, S650 is pretty much tracking their projections. We’ll see what the rest of this year looks like, but I’m seeing plenty of S650 GT’s and Eco’s around and starting to see a few DH’s out and about now that the weather is getting better.
Stellantis has a pending `Cuda trademark as well as a rumored new Hellcat engine that will be available at some point. They are already running a supercharged 354-cu.-in. HEMI V8 in NHRA Factory Stock. That should be an indicator something is in the works.
 

geep81

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Stellantis has a pending `Cuda trademark as well as a rumored new Hellcat engine that will be available at some point.
As far as I know they have no plans for a manual on the new Challenger. Won't be a real competitor to the Mustang without that option.

The new Dodge is also extremely expensive without a V8 already, can't imagine what they will charge for a V8 version. A 52k Sixpack or a 47k V8 GT?? 5k is a big difference imo. It'll be even bigger with a V8 for the Dodge.
 

9secondko

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Like it or not, the ship has sailed. We can sit here and complain all day but change it's going to come any time soon. We have 2 choices, acceptance or boycott. If we boycott then Ford will possibly walk away from the Mustang as Chevy did with the Camaro. I for one don't want to see that happen. I'm not trading in my car just yet. Maybe in a year or 2 when Ford comes to it's senses I would.
if Ford walked away from Mustang after people stopped buying, it would be surprising and also foolish. Chevy walked away because they did everything they could and just couldn't compete with the mustang sales.

ford giving us an old car at very expensive prices is just too much. they know what they are doing. Perhaps they want to get rid of the Mustang and so they are just cashing in on its ashes now. But I doubt it. The S650 generation exists to get Ford through uncertain times that started in earnest with the nonsensical COVID responses. That was followed with equally nonsensical electric mandates that there is no infrastructure for and will not be for a loooooong time - especially with the AI boom competing for resources. Ford's board and leadership has been adjusted to flow with where they thought the puck was going to be. Anticipated government changes and in-your-face consumer backlash left them in a tough spot of not knowing exactly how to move forward without risking catastrophe.

thus S650 - basically S550 with a few bandaids and a new hairdo. This generation exists to get by without much investment. That's why they are charging as much as they can while removing features and giving us old tech. yes, the Dark Horse should just be this generations GT. Yes the GTD should just be this generations GT500. But Ford is testing the waters with how far they can push customers and sell high while providing the bare minimum. 2027 GTD orders are being cancelled due to the MUCH CHEAPER and actually all-new and actually factory made ZR1 whooping its butt and telling it to say "thank you sir. may I have another." This generation of Mustang is the worst selling ever. It's for a reason. People just aren't that gullible. While we watch Ford flail with experiments like calling an SUV or grinding a legendary model into branding scheme fairy dust, many who love the Mustang figured we would sit this era out, save our pennines for the next gen that actually knows what it's doing and actually provides ROI. Right now it's like Ford is a charity case that its customers donate to under this cult-like pretense that we should "just be happy For is 'giving' us anything at all.

ford needs to do better. A LOT better. It's not the customers' fault they don't want to pay BMW money for an old Ford with a new model year sticker. If Chevy can invest in an extremely niche C8 and make it one of the absolute best performers on the entire planet and in history, then yes, ford can invest in the better-selling mustang and make it the best sport car/pony car it could possibly be. We aren't asking for the Mustang to be the Corvette. But we asking for Ford to swing for the fences with the actual CAR, not just the PRICE TAG.

If For can't tell the difference between customers not being suckers versus a concept that shouldn't exist, then Ford should probably just close its doors and let the pros handle things. You want to get interesting. Go research Ford's board members - especially those involved in the Mustang. It's quite revealing.

Sure they don't want to listen to those of us who love the Mustang and Ford. but they have to listen to cash flow. Spend wisely. The Jaguar CEO thought it would be funny to take the brand somewhere no one asked for. where is that guy now? Some genius young marketing person at Bud Light learned you don't force your opinions down your customers throats. They didn't shut down Bud Light. they got rid of that young lady and got some competent people who listened. They're in a much better place today. We didn't ask for our car to be diluted into branding fairy dust - and what happened to that SUV? It's been on the decline with a recent 54-70% downturn year over year. It's a Nice little loss leader. How's that working out for ya? They can stop making that if they want to stop making something. At least the mustang, as old-tech as it is, is profitable, albeit due to exorbitant prices.

Just make a better car next generation and the customers will be there for it. We kinda sort of forgive you for this generation. It's understandable. We even get the use of new names and eschewing the use of legendary names since that carries the weight of high expectations which this generation cannot truly provide (and we know you can't publicly say such things and expect customers to buy the car). But the pricing is stupid. I think the DHSC really hit hard. We sat through the GTD, lamenting the ridiculous price tag, but hoping it would be justified with unreal performance. LOL. then we heard the GT500 replacement was coming up. If it wasn't going touch the GTD or Z06 performance as revamped old GT500, at least it could be reasonably priced. LOL. so we get it. The gen is what it is. some are OK with it. Others are biding our time for something more equitable for our hard earned cash.

But for the love of God, please let the next generation Mustang actually be something to write home about.
 
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MAGS1

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Stellantis has a pending `Cuda trademark as well as a rumored new Hellcat engine that will be available at some point. They are already running a supercharged 354-cu.-in. HEMI V8 in NHRA Factory Stock. That should be an indicator something is in the works.
I’ll be curious to see what Dodge actually does. I’ve heard some of the Hellcat revival reports as well. To Geep’s point, what will a V8 Challenger cost? Will it only be the supercharged Hellcat or will it have a NA version (RT and/or Scatpack)?

There’s been on and off rumors of the Camaro coming back too. But, in what form? GM is still making a big EV push, so would they even bring back a V8 version at this point? I’d hope so, I came close to buying a Camaro over a Mustang a couple different times. The Alpha chassis is really good. The actual ability to see out of the car is what killed it for me. Otherwise, I probably wouldn’t be in this forum right now 🤣
 

TonyNJ

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We sat through the GTD, lamenting the ridiculous price tag, but hoping it would be justified with unreal performance. LOL. then we heard the GT500 replacement was coming up. If it wasn't going touch the GTD or Z06 performance as revamped old GT500, at least it could be reasonably priced.
Out of your insanely long diatribe, this part hits the mark pretty well. However, the "old GT500" is already pretty close to touching the GTD and so will the DH SC. But you nailed it with the price comment. Don't give us what we pretty much already have, and beat us up on the price.
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