AUTOXER - 2015 GT Autocross Build

[mavisky]

Just switched to the Stones and love them. We had a few peoole out this week in Atlanta but still finished 4th overall raw and in PAX.

See if you can find a local tuner. We rode in my car for about an hour tweaking throttle maps and then applied it to all modes so it is always linear no matter what.

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[LightningGT350R]

Just switched to the Stones and love them. We had a few peoole out this week in Atlanta but still finished 4th overall raw and in PAX.

See if you can find a local tuner. We rode in my car for about an hour tweaking throttle maps and then applied it to all modes so it is always linear no matter what.

I think I found someone local to retune the car, but like I said, it will be a winter project as the tuner isn't doing much right now as he is installing a new dyno at his house.

I do like driving the Stones much more than the Yokes, but I'm taking the Yokes to Nats next week. They work well there especially in wet conditions. And even more so than the Stones, they are ready to go on run one. And with just 3 runs per day, I need to feel confident they will work on that 1st run. I will be taking my PS4S's as well. Wednesday looks wet.

I ran the Stones at a local event last Sunday and was 3rd in PAX for the 1st run group (12th overall - 972) behind a multi-national champ and a multi-nats trophy winner. More importantly to me, I won CAMC over two fast guys, one that has been beating me all season so far and was 2nd in CAMT last year at Nats. Normally I am about a second behind him so while I only won by about a tenth, it was a great way to get ready for Nats!

 

[LightningGT350R]

Time for a season end wrap up.

As I mentioned above, I had just done the last local event before Solo Nats. If nothing else it was a bit of an ego boost as I won CAMC which ran first at that event and beat the guy who had won every event he has run with his CAMC Mustang for the past 2 years. It was close, but a win is a win. Since he was also running Nats the following week I know he felt a bit of pressure, enough that he ended up buying new tires for the event. I know that feeling and I also have spent money on new tires due to my results a week before a big event. BTW, I was on my pretty new RE71RS's for this local. I love them on the surface we run on for these events.

I was able to get into the challenge event that ran during the Pro Solo Finale. Unfortunately I don't have any video from that event and to be honest I'm not sure I'd want to show it if I did. I didn't drive well. The format is that everyone got 4 runs in the morning to determine who would make the shootout. And this was a mix of all classes. The largest were the CAM classes but for the shootout all of CAM was mixed together so it was going to be tough to get in. My 1st run was pretty good (2nd in CAMC) but then I started hitting cones. And sliding the car and hitting a cone before the finish of my last run did me in. I considered this event as my TnT runs for Nationals, but I certainly would have liked to get into the shootout. Anyway it rained after the lunch break which made things very interesting. The guy I beat at the last local has proven to be amazing in wet conditions and he didn't disappoint, taking the win for the 18 cars in the CAM division. On full tread Yokes I'll add.

So on to Nats competition. Day one CAMC was on the east course and we were the first cars out. The course more or less walked how it drove. It flowed very well with no super slow corners. The weird slalom after the start wasn't great, but overall I really liked the course. And the weather. Dry and cool. Maybe 70 degrees at the start of 1st runs. I had purchased Vivek Goel's online autocross course several years ago but never made it through the whole thing, which was really dumb. Lots of great info in there. I made a point of going through the mental prep part of the course last week. I really like some of his key points. One in particular stuck in my head. "Focus on the task, not the results". More or less, you can only control your runs - not how they relate to the competition. I told myself that I wasn't going to listen to the results or dwell on what live timing showed. I would just look at my video and Solostorm data between runs and determine what I planned to work on for the next run.

My 1st run was respectable and good enough that I was able to build on it. The video clearly showed where I was coasting and giving up time. I really tried to push in those two areas which lead to me hitting a cone, but the scratch time put me in the trophies (no one would be catching Dave Schotz for the #1 spot) so I again used the video to see where and how I hit the cone and made a plan for run 3. Solostorm showed where I had given up some time from run 1 by being too wide in a couple of spots so I planned to fix that as well. In 2020 I lost a trophy on day 2 and Nats because I had hit a cone on my 2nd run and was way too conservative on run 3 trying not to hit one. Since then I remind myself of that day and the fact that I didn't come to Nats to drive conservative. I was able to clean up the run and pick up time again leaving my in 5th spot (34 drivers) and about 4 tenths out of 2nd. Solostorm showed I blew two corners, the right hander at about 50 seconds into the video (link below) that cost about 4 tenths but I was still happy with my run. The car was really good with two exceptions. First, the left hander before the first slalom (20 sec into the video) was very slick for me and I had lift oversteer on every run. Being I only had rebound adjustment available I added two click to the rear. It helped the issue be more controllable at least - or maybe I just anticipated it better. Second, I just ran the car too low on fuel. After the showcase left the car stumbled on runs 2 and pretty bad on 3. Lesson learned. Even autocross speeds can cause fuel starvation if you take weight savings too far.

Day 2 was dry for our morning course walks but the time first runs came the rain started. It never got too intense but more then enough to make the course very slick. I did soften the shock by 10 clicks in the rear and 8 in the front and dropped tire pressures by a pound before 1st runs. My first run (57.4) kept me in the trophies so I was hopeful that I could keep pace with the pointy end of the class. My buddy who won the shoutout ran a 55.6 which didn't surprise me at all. I knew he would jump up in a big way with the wet conditions. For run two times were dropping quickly so I knew the course was getting drier. It was still sprinkling, but the cars kept the line somewhat dry. I set the shock back to almost day 1 settings but kept run one tire pressures. I hit a cone on run two (53.7) but the scratch time would have put me up to 3rd. I hit the last cone on the right before the finish which many people we struggling with. I knew I had just clipped it but needed to be sure not to repeat that. Again, I didn't travel to Lincoln to drive conservative, but I knew if I coned the last run I'd be mid-pack. Again. So I tried to be aggressive where I thought I could add speed safely. It wasn't enough to get back into the top 5 (Schotz ran a 49.9 BTW - won the class by almost 4 seconds!) but I stayed in the trophies in 9th. Goal accomplished.

Below Schotz the times were pretty close. A half second improvement over the two days would have gotten me 5th and 7 tenths would have scored 2nd. So I was happy with my performance. My buddy Brandon made it up to 6th which was incredible. He was the driver car on day two not named Schotz. I hung out with friends, met a lot of new drivers and saw a bunch of really nice cars. I wish the weather would have stayed dry on day two, but that's Lincoln. There always seems to be rain to some degree.

Sorry for the weird camera angle on this video. I had to move the camera to avoid wiper contact.

 

[Grintch]

But I thought that all you needed to win CAM-C was a stock mustang plus a Stop the Hop kit?

 

[LightningGT350R]

But I thought that all you needed to win CAM-C was a stock mustang plus a Stop the Hop kit?

Honestly you probably don't even need the kit to end up in the top 10. The leader in FStreet would be in 3rd in CAMC. But if you want to beat Schotz you'd better bring a lot.

 

[Dallas J]

Are you running Solo Storm?

Just some constructive feedback, something Im seeing in a few corners is a line that dives into the corner which maximizes entry speed but delays throttle on exit. I probably have thousands of SS logs now and one thing that seems to always be fastest is who gets to throttle earliest.

YMMV, but watching some of your lines I think it would be worth testing with data and actively driving lines 2 different ways.

 

[NightmareMoon]

Honestly you probably don't even need the kit to end up in the top 10. The leader in FStreet would be in 3rd in CAMC. But if you want to beat Schotz you'd better bring a lot.

Well, day 1 yes FS would be 3rd in CAMC but FS has yet to run the west course, so we’ll see where their times end up for the event. FS should be faster if its dry, conditions matter and all that.

Your car looked great in person, sorry we didnt get to chat much. Good runs on Day 1 too. Day 2 was crazy with the conditions changing a bit on each run.

 

[mavisky]

Honestly you probably don't even need the kit to end up in the top 10. The leader in FStreet would be in 3rd in CAMC. But if you want to beat Schotz you'd better bring a lot.

Every time I see those results it makes me question half of what I'm doing to the car, or makes me 2nd guess my feeble attempts at being a driver. Even at our last event

 

[LightningGT350R]

Well, day 1 yes FS would be 3rd in CAMC but FS has yet to run the west course, so we’ll see where their times end up for the event. FS should be faster if its dry, conditions matter and all that.

Your car looked great in person, sorry we didnt get to chat much. Good runs on Day 1 too. Day 2 was crazy with the conditions changing a bit on each run.

Agreed, it's not apples to apples when the run days are different, but in general, CAMC doesn't out-PAX FS very often. There are some great drivers in both classes, but for CAMC we are PAXed harder due to one driver that dominates the class. And hey, he's an UNBELIEVABLE driver. One could also argue that no one has built a car to the class limits. Schotz's car is crazy nice, but I'm guessing even he is well over 3480.

It was nice to meet you and you did incredible, especially day two. I think it helped to run later on that day (although you crushed it and ran before me), especially those who had a co-driver.

 

[NightmareMoon]

Every time I see those results it makes me question half of what I'm doing to the car, or makes me 2nd guess my feeble attempts at being a driver. Even at our last event

High spring rates and wide tires just dont do that much for the overall times. Suspension is all tradeoffs. The FS guys can do some pretty nice shock setups too.

The aero helps though I think . Now if I could just figure out where to drop about 350lbs of weight :/

 

[NightmareMoon]

Agreed, it's not apples to apples when the run days are different, but in general, CAMC doesn't out-PAX FS very often. There are some great drivers in both classes, but for CAMC we are PAXed harder due to one driver that dominates the class. And hey, he's an UNBELIEVABLE driver. One could also argue that no one has built a car to the class limits. Schotz's car is crazy nice, but I'm guessing even he is well over 3480.

I’m ok with getting out PAXed by FS but I really hate getting raw timed.

It was nice to meet you and you did incredible, especially day two. I think it helped to run later on that day (although you crushed it and ran before me), especially those who had a co-driver.

Someone said Schotz was getting close to min weight but I dont have the numbers. The SCCA does though and if someone asked really nicely they might let you peek at them. Maybe.

Im ok getting out PAXed by FS as long as I dont get raw timed by them

 

[LightningGT350R]

Every time I see those results it makes me question half of what I'm doing to the car, or makes me 2nd guess my feeble attempts at being a driver. Even at our last event

It really does play with your head. I get raw timed by James Darden in his FS Camaro at pretty much every local event. I think I beat him on the east course by .4 so, yeah, all of the aero bits, stripped interior, bigger wheels/tires,.... And I'm 4 tenths quicker. My friend Brandon ran James's car at a local and commented how great it drove. Stock shocks, 285 RE71RS's and all. I guess that E-Diff is pretty magical with the autocross tune installed. I still can't believe the SCCA allowed that in street class. And as much as I hate to admit it, the LS motor's torque is a good thing for autocross.

 

[Dallas J]

This topic sorta goes back to my opinion on a car that focuses on corner exit rather than peak corner speed. Even if the peak corner speed build was technically faster (I still doubt that), its always going to be harder to drive.

If you havent driven an FS car, they are soft and rolly, but also very forgiving compared to a high rate CAM build. So a lot of the issue beating FS is driver-mod just not able to wring out the benefits in the mods.

And of course theres driver mod. Certainly the top of FS is a high caliber of driver.

 

[NightmareMoon]

This topic sorta goes back to my opinion on a car that focuses on corner exit rather than peak corner speed. Even if the peak corner speed build was technically faster (I still doubt that), its always going to be harder to drive.

If you havent driven an FS car, they are soft and rolly, but also very forgiving compared to a high rate CAM build. So a lot of the issue beating FS is driver-mod just not able to wring out the benefits in the mods.

And of course theres driver mod. Certainly the top of FS is a high caliber of driver.

Most autox is mid corner speed, its rare to see courses which let you put the hammer down in very many places (this years nats was a little remarkable in that it did) but you’re right, it takes a lot of work to wring out faster times from stiffer suspensions. You gain in slaloms and fast transitions but can loose in easy sweeper corner grip unless your build is really dialed.

I think it took me 6 months to recover in local PAX results after initially doing 11” CAM wheels, springs, a second swaybar, and camber plates.

I’m gonna say the best way to get a car to put power down isnt by dialing the suspension to do that with understeer in those components, its tire selection, differential setup, and rear aero (on faster sections). Oversteer at slow speed to be nimble and achieve rotation, then put power down through soft sidewalled tires like the Yoke or with a trick diff (like the camaro ediff).

Understeer at lower speeds is yuck, but I agree you want to be able to put the power down agressively. Sounds like a contradiction but it only is if you limit yourself to tuning with sways and springs.

 

[kz]

And of course theres driver mod. Certainly the top of FS is a high caliber of driver.

Mike - national champion (DS + many high positions in FS), Chad - won CAM-C eyar before Nightmaremoon, Evan - GS National Champ from last year, Sam - don't even have to mention. That's FS top 4 from '25 Nats.

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