on3 to 3.2 KB car

[Travis@boostworks]

.

Finally close to getting the KB car sorted.
It’s been a long road and I had started to wish I had traded the car(with the on3) while I had a chance.
After the runs at the strip I swapped to the 3.5 pulley and started doing street logs (all the tracks are closed).
Initially fuel looked great..... But started seeing a whole bunch of knock.

Went back to bigger(4inch) pulley and no knock... adding timing as before.

The car seemed to be missing at high rpm so we switched the plugs form NGK to the colder brisk R12's and tried the smaller pulley again

Still knocking but then started running lean. Turns out 2of 3 of the walbro pumps were dead so I replaced all 3 with the upgraded 274'S.

The fuel looked good again after the swap but still knock!
Since the roads were too cold to do anymore street logs so we decided to get the car on the dyno and reduce sensitivity of knock sensors as it seemed the knock is false.

Car ran like crap even though no longer knocking and not making any power.

It looked like it was running on only 7 cylinders!!

Damn,,,,, time for another compression test???

I went ahead and paid the balance of the engine build I had put on layaway during the last 10% off sale at MMR (another sleeved 5.2 to match the GT350 heads in the car.


…… then dyno operator noticed the wiring to the coil that seemed to be missing appeared to have been repaired and badly.

He taped it up and it ran better so he recommended we try replacing that ignition wire and see.
This is what he found when he removed the coil

My Tech at Ford was great as usual and he secured me a couple of coils(just in case)

Dyno operator another great guy ( and new father) replaced the plug and Voila!

Ran great(no more miss) and making the power I expected on back to back runs

No more knock and adding timing as before---- yippee.

it was making about 80-90 rwhp over the bigger pulley which I close to what I expected.
Boost readings are however 2-3 psi over what is expected for the combo(3.5 upper/20% lower)
Tuner added a little more timing to see if we could get more power.... and the knock came back!
went back to previous tune ,,,,,, no knock but broke up ---going lean.
looks like another pump(s) dropping off line again.
Car was low on fuel though so hoping that may be the issue ,so will try another hit tomorrow with added fuel before I start looking at the pumps again.
This car is killing me.

And we had great weather today so I had hoped to get my last drive in before putting her away for the winter.

Which Walbro pumps are you running? Car is making some serious power. That 3.2 is a beast

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[Obsol3te]

Lund.

Swap to Ken Bjonnes man. Im thinking about making the swap to Ken come spring

 

[Dominant1]

If had the cash i'd have a 18 gt-500, a hellcat challenger, and a zl1.. the best of the best!

 

[Brent Davis]

Nice numbers man. How much boost with the larger pulley on top end?

 

[olaosunt]

Which Walbro pumps are you running? Car is making some serious power. That 3.2 is a beast[/QUOTE
Thanks Travis.
Just need to work out some gremlins and I am sure it will fly !(at least run 9's lol)
The pumps have been the 465's.
I think the ones that came with the JPC were the older version ,F267's.
I replaced all 3(after 2 died) with the newer F274's.

 

[olaosunt]

Nice numbers man. How much boost with the larger pulley on top end?

With the 4 inch upper and 7.88 lower my mechanical gauge reads 15-16 on the street but it read higher on the dyno.

I had him video the gauge on the last dyno pull and it read close to the dyno -22psi.
I was expecting 19-20 psi ,so not really sure why it making much more .
I have 1 7/8 long tubes and no cats but the exhaust is mostl 2.5 back .
Heads are GT 350 (did not upgrade the springs) with stock cams .I am sure the intake valves on the heads are shrouded by the smaller bore 5.0 Pistons so I wonder if that is the restriction.
I am building a sleeved 5.2 block which I hope will solve that issue .Hopefully I can take the block in out intact .

 

[olaosunt]

If had the cash i'd have a 18 gt-500, a hellcat challenger, and a zl1.. the best of the best!

?
Please explain.

 

[Phoenix]

Swap to Ken Bjonnes man. Im thinking about making the swap to Ken come spring

may i ask why?

 

[olaosunt]

I suspect the false knock I have been dealing with is ignition related.
My Ford Tech said he had seen a bunch of failed coil packs especially in the F150.
If you are having spark issues I would suggest you check them. As you can see as soon we replaced the one the car immediately ran so much better.
I am still getting a misfire at times which corresponds to the knock I see on the log ,so going look at the remaining and replace them(should be warranty)
After that car should be ready to put away for the winter
I dug up the 4 inch pulley dyno for 4 inch vs 3.5 comparison-about 90 uncorrected hp gain.

Car should be ready to put away for the winter

 

[olaosunt]

Worst case scenario -I may just disable the knock sensors and run 21-22 *(current tune will add to 23*)
Pulls like a freight train when it does.

My only other concern is the high boost I am seeing for the pulley combo.(18/19 with 4 inch and 22/23 with 3.5-20% lower) which should be 14/15 and 18/19.
I wonder if it could be back pressure related as I did not upgrade the springs in the GT350 heads.
I am sure my exhaust does not help as even though I have cat less long tubes the rest is mostly 2.5.Definitely runs better with the cutouts(pre muffler) open.

If it is the heads, I get a "do over" next year as I will upgrade the valve springs when I swap the sleeved 5.2.I may also need to look at a a true 3 inch cat back
I will also likely swap to a Magnum or Tr6060 at the time of the swap.

Goal is to try and run 9's with current set up, but planning on some additional suspension mods/weight reduction(may delete rear seat)and swapping the rear brakes so I can run 15 wheels in the rear if needed.(I have 17 inch Hoosier slicks but will have the option of 15's MT DOT slicks)

 

[olaosunt]

So.....since I am going to be upgrading the valve springs on the heads ,also considering cams.
Currently using the stock cams which require the use of MMR modified GT rocker arms .
I like the idea of the ford racing GT 350 spec cams so engine will have the same specs as the 5.2 alluminator XS , but this would mean having to use the GT 350 rocker arms.
I think those cams have a higher lift and duration than the Stock GT cams but would there be any gains in a supercharged application since they were meant for NA engine ?

The alternative would be MMR or COMP blower specific cams .
That would save me having to swap out the modified rocker arms to the OEM GT 350 ones .They cost another $399(cheapest I have seen) but the GT 350 spec cams are about $100-$200 cheaper than the blower specific cams about the price difference of the cams.

When the current engine was being put together I spoke to Lund about the COMP cams but he was not enthusiastic .He was concerned about tuning with cam phasers?
I know beefcake has them(the COMP)in his car and thinks they are worth it .

I am sure they are for a max effort race car but this car will see plenty of the street so not so sure .

Any and all opinions welcome .
I hope this to be the last "engine mod" I do in this car so want to do all I can when it is apart .


....MMR is doing another 10% off sale...(they get me every time) so figure good time to buy myself a Christmas gift I want .
Lol

 

[olaosunt]

Hope this is the final chapter before I put her away for winter.
After swapping to brand new coils- we took out some timing and there was no knock with pump E85 that tested more like E81(35).
I just had a 54 gallon tank of Renegade E85 delivered to my home so I was eager to "test"it out .
I finally figured out how to drain the tank so added 6 gallons of the "good stuff" and persuaded Lund to add a 'little bit more timing " for the final pull.

Looked like there was some belt slip but gained another 30 hp(may be not worth the risk of the additional timing ?) .No knock and logs looked good.

For some reason it make more(and makes me feel better, lol!) when I graph for speed.

Numbers are STD so SAE will be lower but hope this is enough to run mid to high 140's with me shifting,....and a 9 second slip.

I will find out soon enough.

I think this blower/motor combination is maxed out though as already seeing boost peak at 22 psi on the dyno.(I thought the 3.5 upper/7.88 lower combo would make 19-20)

May be it will make more when I swap in the 5.2

 

[Obsol3te]

Ridiculous man, glad things are working out for ya

 

[olaosunt]

Thanks bro.

I really need a catch can though as engine has quite a bit of blow by with these boost levels.
I snagged an E85 sensor,gauge (got it cheap at amazon) I wanted to install but my tech says the blow by will ruin the sensor without one,
Any ideas?
No one seems to make one for the KB.

 

[Obsol3te]

I dont see why you couldn't make one work. Just re-use the factory connections to the PCV on the valve covers and go with another companys catch can. I was running one on the N/A motor, but I just pulled the blower the other day and the discharge manifold is still dry as can be.
I'm not pushing anywhere close to the boost you are though.

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