Why doesn't Ford offer the premium package on V6?

[Joe_S550]

People realize that carbon build up even happens in the GT and V6 right?:headbonk:
The concern with the ecoboost isn't really the fact that it is direct injected but more so because there is a turbo on the engine which means standard methods of cleaning such as sea-foam are no longer approved because chunks of carbon build up can get into the turbo causing damage. Reliability wise keep in mind this engine should still be very reliable just take care of it and keep up with maintenance it goes a long way.

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[BmacIL]

People realize that carbon build up even happens in the GT and V6 right?:headbonk:
The concern with the ecoboost isn't really the fact that it is direct injected but more so because there is a turbo on the engine which means standard methods of cleaning such as sea-foam are no longer approved because chunks of carbon build up can get into the turbo causing damage. Reliability wise keep in mind this engine should still be very reliable just take care of it and keep up with maintenance it goes a long way.

Only if you use crap fuel. You'll have a very light layer on the back of the valves, but nothing of any significant thickness. In a DI engine, some of the atomized fuel will get pushed back into the intake ports as the piston is approaching TDC and the valve isn't closed yet. This fuel will coke up and gradually build up there as there is no air/fuel mixture being forced past the intake valve like in a PFI engine. Good quality fuel contains detergents that will clean a lot of it up.

 

[DANA44]

People realize that carbon build up even happens in the GT and V6 right?:headbonk:
The concern with the ecoboost isn't really the fact that it is direct injected but more so because there is a turbo on the engine which means standard methods of cleaning such as sea-foam are no longer approved because chunks of carbon build up can get into the turbo causing damage. Reliability wise keep in mind this engine should still be very reliable just take care of it and keep up with maintenance it goes a long way.

The GT and V6 both have the back side of the intake valves washed with detergent gasoline. DI engines do not . The intake area is more susceptible to carbon build up on a direct injected engine.

 

[Joe_S550]

build up of carbon deposits regardless of fuel still happens. yes you can use top tier fuels to prevent such build up from occurring but the fact of the matter is it happens.

the issue that I was touching on was the reason why you cant seafoam it

 

[DANA44]

In 30 plus years never had a problem with carbon build up . But I am expecting it with my 2.0 TSI.

 

[Rogues Gambit]

If I had to make a decision between the V6 and Ecoboost, I would choose the V6. I don't like the turbo lag. I like smooth naturally aspirated engines unless it's done right. Now, that they don't offer premium, I would be looking at the GT. I don't get why an interior package has to effect the type of engine you choose.

Ditto, would of gotten a V6 Premium vert with PP if they made one

 

[Rogues Gambit]

Originally Posted by BmacIL View Post
The counterpoint to this is exactly what was mentioned earlier in the thread: the engines are not inherently unreliable. The way they are being used, often not befitting of a turbocharged engine, creates problems. LSPI is the big one. The Ford engine calibration and transmission calibration engineers have an extremely difficult time balancing something like this. One one hand, you have targets for accelerative capability in top gear before the transmission kicks down. On the other hand, you have the need to keep the engine out of a region where LSPI can occur. The engineers and their management have to estimate how much time a customer might spend in the LSPI region and develop strategies around that. They're not always going to be right or predict all customers. Myself, I would always, always lean towards staying away from the LSPI zone and deal with a much more minor annoyance in the form of more shifting. It's asymmetric risk.

Also,
Surveys and reports often do not capture the majority of customers. The loudest are always the ones with issues, and a few who are very, very happy. The majority are content/happy with their purchase and that's it to them.

I agree, it makes sense that there's a balancing act the Ford engineers have to do in order to get awesome fuel economy, impressive performance, safety and reliability, all while keeping cost down to keep the bean counters happy. That's all I was saying too is that the non-enthusiast most likely won't be driving it differently than an NA car and that is what creates some of the potential problems.

I realize surveys are flawed and it may be a small sample but if only the ones with issues were the ones being polled and speaking up, none of the cars in CR would get positive scores.

That's why I ONLY drive in Sport instead of Drive, unless it's bumper to bumper traffic and I don't wanna be riding a buckin' bronco xD

 

[Rogues Gambit]

People are acting like forced induction in cars has not been around for nearly 100 years.

Turbo four cylinders have been fairly common since the 80's. Diesel engines use turbos and those things last hundreds of thousands of miles if not millions of miles in many applications.

Why is this now a huge question mark when it comes to the new mustang?

Good question, it's not like this is ABSOLUTELY NEW technology, and this definitely ain't your 80's/90's turbo tuner either

Lug the engine, put the wrong gas in after you tune it, don't get an intercooler and Oil Catch Can and THEN you can worry xD

 

[Pa-fatboy]

See my post above. Simply more moving parts. Direct injection de-gunking for one, additional complications due to the turbos, and a generally higher stressed engine due to forced induction. Ford doesn't have to worry as much because most other manufacturers are going to turbos too, so they won't be the only ones with issues.

Really??? IMHO, as others havE stated, I'm pretty sure these 4 cylinder engines are not something new. Neither are turbos. I get the NA part and not as hot. Heat kills eventually. But you sound like doom and gloom. You sound like someone who,is having their toy taken away from them. I disagree Ford is missing something. I think V-6 owners are missing something. Premium int, 2 cylinders, horsepower and a mean exhaust note.

We have a 2014 1.5liter Ecco fusion for my wife. Every time I drive that car, I'm reminded how amazing it is that a 1.5 liter would drive so freaking nice. It is incredible to me how smooth and the torque it displays in normal driving. It is an awesome car.

Smaller displacement and better fuel mileage while delivering a fun driving experience is the future. I never understood why they offered 6's in recent years. They kinda outlived their usefulness once the 4's came on-line. The rest of the world is driving the 4's. They are part of the future. With them producing as much, if not more than the 6's, they are not viable. Some one mentioned it's nbean counters. Hey, I do not want my GT price to go up supporting an aging engine program. Keep my costs down. It is about the money. It is about profit. That's how it is. The Camaro was killed for awhile. Dollars. Ford would do the in a heart beat if the Mustang wasn't making money. I wouldn't expect them to produce it. Thank goodness Ford seems to have better bean counters than GM and the other one. Ford did not need government handouts to stay in business. I respect the hell out of Ford for that. What can you attribute that to? Right. Bean counters doing their job.

Get over it, enjoy it while you can.

 

[Pa-fatboy]

Also, most people forget - the birth of the Mustang started out with a 4-cyl engine that was in the functional 1962 prototype... The almighty Pony car did not originate with a V8, fact.

You are correct. You left out the reason the 1962 prototype, Mustang I, had the compact German Ford V-4. For the 2 seater prototype, they selected the V-4 based on size to fit into the tubular frame and the engine matched sport racing cars of the time. In 1961? Jack Brabham raced a 4 cylinder at Indy, failed to finish, but tells you about tech at the time.

At the same time as the V-4 being stuffed into Mustang I, Mr. Iacocca was already spinning his web with promoting 'total performance' and selling the idea of the 2+2 future car. He was already working with Shelby. By 1963' total performance at ford meant v-8 engines.

Cool stuff for sure. That V-4 was eventually a powerful little power plant that had success racing.

Piece.

 

[15wile]

i would look at the Camaro V6. you can get the leathers in it. dont buy the 4cyl mustang. it is poo

I am in awe of your staggeringly immense intellect, good sir.

 

[04DarkShadowGT]

Good question, it's not like this is ABSOLUTELY NEW technology, and this definitely ain't your 80's/90's turbo tuner either

Lug the engine, put the wrong gas in after you tune it, don't get an intercooler and Oil Catch Can and THEN you can worry xD

Yes you are right this is not 80s/90s tech overall, it is still forced induction. That part is similar, the direct injection and stuff like that is the real new tech and that is not just in this motor either.

To your last point, most of those questions or worries apply to all mustang engines. All three platforms people are putting on catch cans and have been for years in the GT models. Of course if you tune your car you need to run proper gas. If you want to run low grade, don't tune it.


With that being said, I do agree with the poster above. The ecoboost engines do sound like crap.

 

[Rogues Gambit]

Yes you are right this is not 80s/90s tech overall, it is still forced induction. That part is similar, the direct injection and stuff like that is the real new tech and that is not just in this motor either.

To your last point, most of those questions or worries apply to all mustang engines. All three platforms people are putting on catch cans and have been for years in the GT models. Of course if you tune your car you need to run proper gas. If you want to run low grade, don't tune it.


With that being said, I do agree with the poster above. The ecoboost engines do sound like crap.

but it makes turbo noises and confuses people, plus most only see the car

I can see all the Malibu Stacies and milfs plus poser rich kids lugging it, not taking care of it and whatnot and causing the inevitable engine recalls as we speak xP

 

[BmacIL]

but it makes turbo noises and confuses people, plus most only see the car

I can see all the Malibu Stacies and milfs plus poser rich kids lugging it, not taking care of it and whatnot and causing the inevitable engine recalls as we speak xP

The only one I've heard that sounds good is the MAP car with their turbo-back exhaust and the big turbo kit. Before the big turbo, yuck. After, sounded a bit like a well-done Evo, which can sound very mean.

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