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Question re: disabling Advancetrac

WildHorse

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Eh... Nannies are the reason we have so many 450-700 hp car options. And for that matter 200hp+ motorcycle options. As long as they can be disabled it's all good in my book.
Not really good cause when these guys turn em off to do stupid shit.. they instantly become internet famous.
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Norm Peterson

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Eh... Nannies are the reason we have so many 450-700 hp car options.
No, nannies are the reason so many people think they can safely handle cars with just about any amount of power. Even the 106 hp Toyota Yaris gets them. All you have to do is look around here (or most any enthusiast-oriented car model site) to find people who don't trust themselves to stay within the lowest of three limits (their capabilities, their car's capabilities, and road/weather conditions), meaning that they are relying on the various nannies to do what they can't or won't do for themselves.


As long as they can be completely disabled and made to stay disabled it's all good in my book.
Fixed. Not all mfrs' nannies can be completely disabled or made to stay that way.


Norm
 

sdiver68

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No, nannies are the reason so many people think they can safely handle cars with just about any amount of power. Even the 106 hp Toyota Yaris gets them. All you have to do is look around here (or most any enthusiast-oriented car model site) to find people who don't trust themselves to stay within the lowest of three limits (their capabilities, their car's capabilities, and road/weather conditions), meaning that they are relying on the various nannies to do what they can't or won't do for themselves.
Fixed. Not all mfrs' nannies can be completely disabled or made to stay that way.
Norm
So the alternate is only exotics are produced and people with race licenses are allowed to own the high HP cars. Since I have my license I'm good on count 2. However, it means there are limited numbers produced and cost per unit is high. I hear your argument and agree, but until we go to graduated licensing with mandatory serious driver training I prefer the defeat-able nanny situation.

In our current US legal climate, I just cannot imagine 400+hp cars being put into the hands of the general public without nannies. With nannies, the manufacturer has a great legal defense...why did you disable the nanny?

I believe we are in the true golden age of performance vehicles right now and nannies are the main reason why.
 

Loki-GT

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Heavens.. all you peeps running nannies as to not wreck woulda been eaten alive in the pre-nannie world. Learn to drive, or better yet, take a HPDS course where the cars they use have ZERO nannies.
I'm from the old days, nannies suck and if I could they would be disabled permanently. Car starts to get a bit sideways remove some throttle or give it some and have fun steering with your right foot.
 

Loki-GT

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844A6A8F-2E6D-466E-AAAC-FD4F3632A27B.jpeg

^This
I finally got my data logger. So, at tomorrow night’s TNT; I will have proof that drag mode doesn’t pull timing. I already have logs showing A10 shifter in S does cut power before each shift. See the waves above.

I also now know the ECU correctly infers the 91 octane California calls premium. I’m gonna run GT260 tomorrow night and hope the ECU infers at least 93 octane and advances the timing.

Cheers,
Agreed, while in S and Drag Mode I got the cut in power, I'll be darned if I remember if this happened in D and Drag Mode. I may be going to GLD in Wisconsin this Friday where I can run the car with more knowledge than I had before.

I need to get a CAI and Tune ASAP, I'd love to get a 93 and also a Flex tune.
 

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Loki-GT

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Eh... Nannies are the reason we have so many 450-700 hp car options. And for that matter 200hp+ motorcycle options. As long as they can be disabled it's all good in my book.
Valid points, heck even when these cars made 140hp people got into trouble with them.
 

Norm Peterson

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In our current US legal climate
It's this, and all the varieties of scaremongering that have accompanied it. Harp on peoples' fears long enough and most of them will come to believe that bad things can't be avoided unless the politically-correct agenda being promoted is followed.


I believe we are in the true golden age of performance vehicles right now and nannies are the main reason why.
I'm extremely reluctant to endorse this line of thinking, as it reinforces the notion that none of us is capable of staying within our own limits or those of our cars, or that any of us ever will. To those of us who started driving before any of today's nannies made their appearance (including clutch/starter interlock switches), it's a bit insulting.


Norm
 

Norm Peterson

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I hear your argument and agree, but until we go to graduated licensing with mandatory serious driver training I prefer the defeat-able nanny situation.
I think some sort of additional training - which would have to include high performance driving - combined with some way or ways of establishing satisfactory experience would be sufficient.

My position on "defeatable" nannies is that they aren't truly defeatable if they can turn themselves back on or can throw the car into a 'limp' or otherwise limited mode if disabled by means other than the OE-provided switch.

Most of the people in my age group came into cars when the ratios of power to braking and power to chassis/tire capability were more heavily skewed toward the "power" side. It's possible to learn self-discipline . . . it had to be back then, and should be now if people would just make up their minds that that was something they just had to do.


Norm
 
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sdiver68

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I think some sort of additional training - which would have to include high performance driving - combined with some way or ways of establishing satisfactory experience would be sufficient.

My position on "defeatable" nannies is that they aren't truly defeatable if they can turn themselves back on or can throw the car into a 'limp' or otherwise limited mode if disabled by means other than the OE-provided switch.

Most of the people in my age group came into cars when the ratios of power to braking and power to chassis/tire capability were more heavily skewed toward the "power" side. It's possible to learn self-discipline . . . it had to be back then, and should be now if people would just make up their minds that that was something they just had to do.


Norm
We agree on the key being defeatable and yes I grew up with ridiculous power to weight ratios and nothing but skill to control it. And I pushed those boundaries in regional and national level road racing. I get it 100%.
 

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I know this thread has been hijacked to an almost evangelical level of FUD. But, I wanted to post my drag mode data log in case someone made it through all that...

2018 drag mode with Advancetrac off does not pull timing. The yellow line in the bottom box is my throttle position. All the other lines are controlled by the ECM. The green line in the top box is vehicle speed. The “bumps” in the green line are traction loss. I pedaled the car too much and it shifted into second way too early. But, there was still massive wheel spin. That run was about 4 tenths slower than the others.
68375EAE-8B54-4A71-AA45-C166CAF074E7.png


Cheers,
 

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Norm Peterson

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I'm reading TPS and Spark being constant once you were in 2nd, right?

Am I seeing gears 1 through 6 here?



FWIW, it probably isn't possible to discuss disabling stability control without there being controversy over whether people should be allowed to do that, or if so under what conditions/in what locations.


Norm
 

Hivel

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I'm reading TPS and Spark being constant once you were in 2nd, right?

Am I seeing gears 1 through 6 here?

Norm
I think you’re right. The spark held steady at 22 degrees after it hit WOT. When the car hit second while I was pedaling the launch; I held the pedal position until the tires stopped spinning. I floored it for the rest of the pass when I felt the tires grab.

It’s a PP1 car and the car is in 6th through the traps at about 117 MPH.

Cheers,
 
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Cool. So F1 drivers suck because they have nannies.

Was listening to a podcast recently with a professional driver and even he said modern "nannies" are great and that if you are to the point they're kicking on you're probably driving wrong.
 

frank s

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The plug is DIRECTLY behind the air box on the driver side fender.
What does it mean, this "behind"? Is that longitudinally speaking, or latitudinally? Is the plug hidden behind the air box? And while we're at it, which of all the possible items under the hood is the "air box"? A picture would certainly help.
 

Lockdown18GT

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I think you’re right. The spark held steady at 22 degrees after it hit WOT. When the car hit second while I was pedaling the launch; I held the pedal position until the tires stopped spinning. I floored it for the rest of the pass when I felt the tires grab.

It’s a PP1 car and the car is in 6th through the traps at about 117 MPH.

Cheers,
Nice to see you yesterday were you mph off a little bit mine were 3 -4 mph off from 122-121 to 118-119 but time was around the same 11.4
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