Procharger D1SC eats rubber inlet...

[mustang_guy]

Travis please respond to my pms.

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[Travis@boostworks]

Travis please respond to my pms.

Will do. Just trying to get caught up on emails and messages. Lol

 

[mwbracing]

I'm done with PC, their representative here has shown a total lack of care for me as a customer of now two of their units. I paid very good money to buy a product that has failed on me twice. I'm very disappointed in the responses from PC. I'm the person who shelled out over 35% of the cars value on your product. You crush it in customer service? How? I've been in the customer service business for over 27 years, I would never let a photo shoot stop me from contacting my customer and working out an immediate solution. Instead you chose to be very defensive and spend the day responding in an (at least the majority on this thread think so) unprofessional way. I get damage control for sure, but remember this is twice with an issue on the same unit. Can you deny that? You have my serial number. So even though you say you don't have any issues and that may be true, I'm having an issue. Does that not matter to you guys at PC? Are you the owner? If not I would sure love to talk to the owner and explain my frustrations that you seemed to keep glazing over with all these facts of how great the product is. I get that, that's why I chose your product. Is this what you say a rare case is? My unit has failed twice. But thats not the only unit, the P1SC I bought in 2002 had issues twice with it leaking oil from faulty seals. Can you deny that? In fact when I called to inquire about this unit I spoke of that issue and the guys at PC said yes the early model P1SC did indeed have oil seal issues. I said well at least when there was an issue you guys stepped up and took care of them. Which again is why I chose to stick with PC. I get I'm just another number and that you have already washed your hands of me and my issues. I will seek other advise in how to handle this from here on out.
Thank you!

 

[Travis@boostworks]

We'll get it taken care of, Mike..

 

[markmurfie]

This is a private forum, its right in the first rule. I enjoy the information that helps everyone decide on what they want to buy or even prevent what might be a serious problem in the future with something already purchased. I don't like the way either vendor handled this thread. Dirty laundry in public yada yada.

The worst part about this is the cars owner seems to have gotten burnt by a non vendor shop and it has made two of the better vendors on this forum look bad. IMO that first shop that installed the kit did not do it correctly, the owner pointing an obvious rubbing problem out and it not being tuned correctly are just bad signs. I know the car is in good hands at BW and it will be taken care of. I also know the PC makes a good product from the numerous kits they sell and happy customers they have.

 

[r1lovin]

Ive had nothing but good experiences with pc. I Was sent the wrong pulley installed on my blower and they sent a replacement no problem. With that being said I think a metal elbow should come with the race valve at a small increase in price. Even though it can be trimmed it seems like a real pain to get it to fit.

 

[z06psi]

I'm done with PC, their representative here has shown a total lack of care for me as a customer of now two of their units. I paid very good money to buy a product that has failed on me twice. I'm very disappointed in the responses from PC. I'm the person who shelled out over 35% of the cars value on your product. You crush it in customer service? How? I've been in the customer service business for over 27 years, I would never let a photo shoot stop me from contacting my customer and working out an immediate solution. Instead you chose to be very defensive and spend the day responding in an (at least the majority on this thread think so) unprofessional way. I get damage control for sure, but remember this is twice with an issue on the same unit. Can you deny that? You have my serial number. So even though you say you don't have any issues and that may be true, I'm having an issue. Does that not matter to you guys at PC? Are you the owner? If not I would sure love to talk to the owner and explain my frustrations that you seemed to keep glazing over with all these facts of how great the product is. I get that, that's why I chose your product. Is this what you say a rare case is? My unit has failed twice. But thats not the only unit, the P1SC I bought in 2002 had issues twice with it leaking oil from faulty seals. Can you deny that? In fact when I called to inquire about this unit I spoke of that issue and the guys at PC said yes the early model P1SC did indeed have oil seal issues. I said well at least when there was an issue you guys stepped up and took care of them. Which again is why I chose to stick with PC. I get I'm just another number and that you have already washed your hands of me and my issues. I will seek other advise in how to handle this from here on out.
Thank you!

PM sent.

 

[mmc]

I'm done with PC, their representative here has shown a total lack of care for me as a customer of now two of their units. I paid very good money to buy a product that has failed on me twice. I'm very disappointed in the responses from PC. I'm the person who shelled out over 35% of the cars value on your product. You crush it in customer service? How? I've been in the customer service business for over 27 years, I would never let a photo shoot stop me from contacting my customer and working out an immediate solution. Instead you chose to be very defensive and spend the day responding in an (at least the majority on this thread think so) unprofessional way. I get damage control for sure, but remember this is twice with an issue on the same unit. Can you deny that? You have my serial number. So even though you say you don't have any issues and that may be true, I'm having an issue. Does that not matter to you guys at PC? Are you the owner? If not I would sure love to talk to the owner and explain my frustrations that you seemed to keep glazing over with all these facts of how great the product is. I get that, that's why I chose your product. Is this what you say a rare case is? My unit has failed twice. But thats not the only unit, the P1SC I bought in 2002 had issues twice with it leaking oil from faulty seals. Can you deny that? In fact when I called to inquire about this unit I spoke of that issue and the guys at PC said yes the early model P1SC did indeed have oil seal issues. I said well at least when there was an issue you guys stepped up and took care of them. Which again is why I chose to stick with PC. I get I'm just another number and that you have already washed your hands of me and my issues. I will seek other advise in how to handle this from here on out.
Thank you!

If PC overnighted you a new elbow, would you (BW) have installed it?

 

[ProChargerTECH]

I'm done with PC, their representative here has shown a total lack of care for me as a customer

I told you UP FRONT that I (just me) was out of the office organizing a photoshoot.
And that I (personally) couldn't contact you till after that.
(Didn't get done last night till almost 10pm)

However just because I was away, if you needed immediate assistance.
We have a phone staff here M-F 8:30-5:30 you can call ANY time.



I thought I was going out of my way to PM you and contact you to let you know that I was out.
Never once did you indicate that was an issue in PM's.

:(

 

[ProChargerTECH]

The worst part about this is the cars owner seems to have gotten burnt by a non vendor shop and it has made two of the better vendors on this forum look bad. IMO that first shop that installed the kit did not do it correctly, the owner pointing an obvious rubbing problem out and it not being tuned correctly are just bad signs. I know the car is in good hands at BW and it will be taken care of. I also know the PC makes a good product from the numerous kits they sell and happy customers they have.

Thanks for the kind words.

I will admit I was a bit brash in my first posts.
But anyone would be when they see an attack like that.
And it wasn't just me that felt that way.. (Hence why another Dealer actually forwarded me the link to the thread in the first place)

I can say that is one of the first times I have seen a shop do that, in as long as I can remember. Since most would call me on the phone and say "Hey man, here is what I got going on...." and discuss.

Even if its an install error, or something silly. I bend over BACKWARDS for shop owners. Since I used to own a shop, I know what its like to work 20 hour days, and be stuck on the dyno for hours and hours. Anyone that knows me, knows I am one laid back dude.

But start pointing fingers on the net, talking lies, and making demands.
Well...thats literally the worst way to approach an issue.

Ive had nothing but good experiences with pc. I Was sent the wrong pulley installed on my blower and they sent a replacement no problem. With that being said I think a metal elbow should come with the race valve at a small increase in price. Even though it can be trimmed it seems like a real pain to get it to fit.

Thanks man! :cheers:

We have no issues taking care of issues ASAP.
We have the best tech guys around to ask any question to on the phones.
We can overnight just about anything anywhere in the country.

Since there is no reason to have that valve unless your over 750hp.
It's pretty wild how many lower HP cars now have these valves.

But if someone wants one, it takes some major trimming to fit.
Thankfully not of the car.

But if installed and it's pushing on the inlet tube you have two major issues.

1) Your cutting off flow to the blower, which is bad for HP.
2) Your stressing the elbow, which can lead to collapse.

So two solutions.

1) Run the proper valve for the HP the car is making
2) Install the race valve in a manor thats not effecting the inlet.

Running a metal tube would be a bandaid.
Since if the valve is in the area of the rubber inlet, that means you are placing the valve in the inlet flow path, and would be reducing the superchargers ability to make power. (why have a race valve, if your choking down the inlet?)

I will however bring it up in a production meeting next week, to see if we can try and make this even easier for people to install, or the possibility of a metal tube. HOWEVER, since this is basically a 1 off event, I can't promise anyone is going to be in a rush to get this into production.

 

[Evolvd]

Anyone else think this thread should die? All's said that needs to be. I mean I love reading drama, but honestly it's gone beyond making points and assigning blame. Both shops made errors in this thread and it's all gonna boil down to "you should do this" or "you should've done that".

 

[ProChargerTECH]

While I'm very happy with my Procharger I did have some problems with the tune I paid for from Procharger . Procharger did make good on that and for that I thank them.. I had a problem with the water neck leaking and as soon as I told them they sent me out a new water neck ASAP ..Problem fixed ..

I thank you for the kind words, and to this day I still send people your way to talk to about your tuner. He has your car on POINT! And flying.

I'm also glad Boost Works posted about the intake elbow .. We knew about the old intake elbow problem and Procharger jumped on that pretty quick and sent out a replacement to those that wanted one ..The new kits shipped like mine came with the better elbow ..

His post is about the "better" elbow, which this is literally the first issue we have seen with the inlet thats been shipping for over a year or more. Which is why it made this issue so odd/rare.

What was upsetting, is that BW was using quotes about the OLD inlet, to make his case and point. And thats not only upsetting, but dishonest.

What I would like to see happen now is for Procharger to step up to the pump again like they in the past and send out a better Elbow that can't get sucked into the blower..

Out of thousands, with a single failure I can almost promise its going to be hard for me to push for a change. Especially given the circumstances behind this.

I will however be bringing next weeks planing meeting the idea of a larger "race" inlet, or hard pipe that would help eliminate any install errors. But again, just being honest...given the fact that this hasn't been an issue for well over a year now, it won't be a rush project.

The cost to Procharger sending out a better Elbow for the intake is surely cheaper than warrantee claims for a bent or broken Impeller ..

To date ZERO inlets have every made it into the impeller.
(until this one, which to have only touched the nut that holds it)
The other guy that sucked his inlet in, wasn't our part.

So again, ZERO inlets have ever touched a blower. (even the old ones)

Question for ProCharger:

The early released, and since shelved inlets.... why run them to begin with, if you have had 10+ years of success with the other inlets?

Thank you for the question and I will be happy to answer.

When the kit was designed, since the inlet was right up front we wanted to try and use some "shinny" silicone elbows for a little better "look" on this new system.

However, the very first run of kits that went out. (I think like 100 or so)
People with bone stock systems, running stock boost seemed to be fine.
But those with elevated boost levels, or with race valve installs (that had the valve pushing on the inlet a bit) found that the tube would collapse, and cause a lack of HP.

NOTE: NO blower failures ever resulted in this, actually I don't think even a tube was ever damaged, since nothing ever came into contact with the supercharger.

We decided to go back to our "tried and true" inlet hose that has been in production since... well before I worked here in 2002-ish. And offered these new inlets to those with the older version.

I would say 1/3 said "Cool thanks I will try it"
Another 1/3 said "I don't have a problem, don't send it, no worries"
And about the last 1/3 either had already made a custom inlet, or didn't run an inlet at all, because of racing.

So, since the change to the "tried and true" inlet hose. In hundreds of kits leaving the doors (heck maybe more, I stopped keeping track long ago) and happy customers around the world.

This post was the first we had seen of an issue with the hose that I would call "production" since far far far more of these are on S550's then of the early unit.

You had mentioned that the new inlets are the same inlets that have been used on cars/trucks/etc for 10+ years.

Why didn't you use them from the get go?

Cause we tried for something with more "aesthetic" quality.
Shame on us, we should have stuck with the tried and true from the get go.

Whats funny, is that I still see instagram posts daily, of cars that still have that original unit, and have no issues. So when not running high boost, and not having anything pushing on it, even that "weak" tube is still out their kicking it on cars across the US.

is it not possible that the factory that supplies your inlet tubes had at least 1 faulty or defective one?

Maybe, but since they are an OEM part from Gates.
Id have to safely say they are one of the biggest and best companies for quality control.

Id love to have an RMA # going to have that inlet back, and we could have overnighted one to them, and both sides would have been good to go.

1) BW would have a new part,
2) And my engineers could have the damaged one back, to determine if there was a defect.

Sadly that didn't happen.

Not going to argue.. I have no beef with Procharger. The blower ate the elbow, plain and simple. If they want to say that it's not a problem, then I'll disagree and they can say or do whatever they choose. A simple apology to the customer and to us for this waste of time would have been nice. Just reporting what this car did. Nothing more, nothing less.

Little more then that was done...and you know that.

My question is this...

Anytime there is an issue with vendors you purchase from, do you always put them on internet blast, before talking to them? (or was this a special case for us)

I hope that it was just special for us, cause even though that still sucks.
I can say that blasting manufactures on the internet is a VERY fast way to get a bad name in the industry. Nobody enjoys working with, or helping out someone that has a bad attitude.

We are all hard working people in this industry, just like you... doing the best to not only make killer products, but make products for a fun market called "performance" This industry is rough, and running a shop is even rougher, working together and supporting each other is the key. Internet bashing is for yelp reviews, and teenage kids.

And that is the last thought I will have on this.

 

[beefcake]

we've sold alot of systems, as mentioned, i'd venture to say more than any other vendor, i have yet to be contacted by a customer that had an issue with a self install, and we have never had issues with any local installs.

playing devils advocate. and not saying that was the case here. over the last 6 years, most of the time we run into issues on kits is due to installation errors.

again, not necessarily the case here, but when people bring us cars with issues, it's usually something was installed / hooked up / incorrectly.

i had 2 calls in the last week where customers called me with tune issues on self installs where care wouldn't start on one, and on the other wouldn't run right, instructed customers to go back over the car, which of course both told me they did. i had them do again.

one turned out to be a mass air not plugged in, and the other i never found out, but saw in the lund ticket that they uploaded logs with the car running fine.

just a sample of things that we see

 

[Travis@boostworks]

I thank you for the kind words, and to this day I still send people your way to talk to about your tuner. He has your car on POINT! And flying.



His post is about the "better" elbow, which this is literally the first issue we have seen with the inlet thats been shipping for over a year or more. Which is why it made this issue so odd/rare.

What was upsetting, is that BW was using quotes about the OLD inlet, to make his case and point. And thats not only upsetting, but dishonest.



Out of thousands, with a single failure I can almost promise its going to be hard for me to push for a change. Especially given the circumstances behind this.

I will however be bringing next weeks planing meeting the idea of a larger "race" inlet, or hard pipe that would help eliminate any install errors. But again, just being honest...given the fact that this hasn't been an issue for well over a year now, it won't be a rush project.



To date ZERO inlets have every made it into the impeller.
(until this one, which to have only touched the nut that holds it)
The other guy that sucked his inlet in, wasn't our part.

So again, ZERO inlets have ever touched a blower. (even the old ones)





Thank you for the question and I will be happy to answer.

When the kit was designed, since the inlet was right up front we wanted to try and use some "shinny" silicone elbows for a little better "look" on this new system.

However, the very first run of kits that went out. (I think like 100 or so)
People with bone stock systems, running stock boost seemed to be fine.
But those with elevated boost levels, or with race valve installs (that had the valve pushing on the inlet a bit) found that the tube would collapse, and cause a lack of HP.

NOTE: NO blower failures ever resulted in this, actually I don't think even a tube was ever damaged, since nothing ever came into contact with the supercharger.

We decided to go back to our "tried and true" inlet hose that has been in production since... well before I worked here in 2002-ish. And offered these new inlets to those with the older version.

I would say 1/3 said "Cool thanks I will try it"
Another 1/3 said "I don't have a problem, don't send it, no worries"
And about the last 1/3 either had already made a custom inlet, or didn't run an inlet at all, because of racing.

So, since the change to the "tried and true" inlet hose. In hundreds of kits leaving the doors (heck maybe more, I stopped keeping track long ago) and happy customers around the world.

This post was the first we had seen of an issue with the hose that I would call "production" since far far far more of these are on S550's then of the early unit.



Cause we tried for something with more "aesthetic" quality.
Shame on us, we should have stuck with the tried and true from the get go.

Whats funny, is that I still see instagram posts daily, of cars that still have that original unit, and have no issues. So when not running high boost, and not having anything pushing on it, even that "weak" tube is still out their kicking it on cars across the US.



Maybe, but since they are an OEM part from Gates.
Id have to safely say they are one of the biggest and best companies for quality control.

Id love to have an RMA # going to have that inlet back, and we could have overnighted one to them, and both sides would have been good to go.

1) BW would have a new part,
2) And my engineers could have the damaged one back, to determine if there was a defect.

Sadly that didn't happen.





Little more then that was done...and you know that.

My question is this...

Anytime there is an issue with vendors you purchase from, do you always put them on internet blast, before talking to them? (or was this a special case for us)

I hope that it was just special for us, cause even though that still sucks.
I can say that blasting manufactures on the internet is a VERY fast way to get a bad name in the industry. Nobody enjoys working with, or helping out someone that has a bad attitude.

We are all hard working people in this industry, just like you... doing the best to not only make killer products, but make products for a fun market called "performance" This industry is rough, and running a shop is even rougher, working together and supporting each other is the key. Internet bashing is for yelp reviews, and teenage kids.

And that is the last thought I will have on this.

Quite frankly, I've seen how you guys talk to customers who bring issues to light. I don't like it. Why would I call you when all you're going to do is tell me there isn't an issue, or that we installed it incorrectly? Say I do just that.. You send me another inlet and nothing gets said. How is that doing anything to address the issue?

The inlet was installed just as it should have been. Nothing was pushing on the elbow. It simply collapsed. It's not the only time this has happened either, which is why your denial really is disturbing.

Instead of apologizing for the issue, you've managed to call us liars, insinuate that we can't install your rubber inlet properly, and that we have ulterior motives for making this thread in the first place. You've also pissed off the customer. The guy who spent his money on your product TWICE.

We have a solid reputation here. Our vendors love to deal with us. You are not our vendor. Your customer service leaves something to be desired and your attitude is downright shocking.

I understand the need to run damage control. But people have a right to know. Especially if you're not going to do anything to fix the real problem. If you apologize to the customer, take care of him monetarily for the inconvenience of the past 3 months, and admit that there may be an issue here and commit to fixing it, then I will apologize for posting this and have this thread closed.

 

[mmc]

Quite frankly, I've seen how you guys talk to customers who bring issues to light. I don't like it. Why would I call you when all you're going to do is tell me there isn't an issue, or that we installed it incorrectly? Say I do just that.. You send me another inlet and nothing gets said. How is that doing anything to address the issue?

The inlet was installed just as it should have been. Nothing was pushing on the elbow. It simply collapsed. It's not the only time this has happened either, which is why your denial really is disturbing.

Instead of apologizing for the issue, you've managed to call us liars, insinuate that we can't install your rubber inlet properly, and that we have ulterior motives for making this thread in the first place. You've also pissed off the customer. The guy who spent his money on your product TWICE.

We have a solid reputation here. Our vendors love to deal with us. You are not our vendor. Your customer service leaves something to be desired and your attitude is downright shocking.

I understand the need to run damage control. But people have a right to know. Especially if you're not going to do anything to fix the real problem. If you apologize to the customer, take care of him monetarily for the inconvenience of the past 3 months, and admit that there may be an issue here and commit to fixing it, then I will apologize for posting this and have this thread closed.

You were not the installing dealer. The installing dealer seems questionable based on the entire experience posted here and how it arrived at your doorstep. How have you ruled out any potential problem with the install?

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