Ford Dealers are Terrible

[Thegipper]

You guys aren't making me feel that confident about my 2020 Mustang PP1 car. I know


I almost got a X2M35i before the stang. The car was a blast just still wanted a manual.

Since this was my first American car, I really thought the bad reputation was all talk. Not anymore. I’m as much of a Stars and Stripes flag waver as the next red-blooded American, but American cars are 5 notches lower than German, Japanese and Korean cars in terms of reliability and customer service.

Flat Rock must hire the rejects of other manufacturers and serve moonshine and crack to their employees, because the quality control is absolute trash.

.....and this doesn’t even address the low quality crap the penny pinchers in suits are responsible for. The leather seats have the worst quality and are barely even leather.

Your passenger gets 4 way adjustable seats, last year the same car had 6-way adjustable seats. Ford literally went from 6-way to 4-way seats to save money on such a basic comfort feature (A Kia Optima can be optioned with 8-way power seats). The Camaro gets 6-way adjustable passenger seats, a diff cooler and a heads up display. The Camaro also gets an amazing new feature, lol, power reclining seats. Ford cheapness is foul.

I’m not saying the Camaro is better because I hate it for other reasons, just that even it’s direct competitor isn’t as cheap. My next car will likely be foreign.

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[3rdRGR]

B.Co.1/14 the Golden Dragons!!

Right on brother, A Co. 3/75th. (3rdRGR) Long ago... Galaxy far far away... You didn't serve under a CSM Devens did you? He was my Plt. Sgt. in 92-93 and I'm pretty sure he went on to be the Div CSM at the 25th later on. If not Div. he was one of the top enlisted guys there at the time. Bad man!

 

[3rdRGR]

Since this was my first American car, I really thought the bad reputation was all talk. Not anymore. I’m as much of a Stars and Stripes flag waver as the next red-blooded American, but American cars are 5 notches lower than German, Japanese and Korean cars in terms of reliability and customer service.

Flat Rock must hire the rejects of other manufacturers and serve moonshine and crack to their employees, because the quality control is absolute trash.

.....and this doesn’t even address the low quality crap the penny pinchers in suits are responsible for. The leather seats have the worst quality and are barely even leather.

Your passenger gets 4 way adjustable seats, last year the same car had 6-way adjustable seats. Ford literally went from 6-way to 4-way seats to save money on such a basic comfort feature (A Kia Optima can be optioned with 8-way power seats). The Camaro gets 6-way adjustable passenger seats, a diff cooler and a heads up display. The Camaro also gets an amazing new feature, lol, power reclining seats. Ford cheapness is foul.

I’m not saying the Camaro is better because I hate it for other reasons, just that even it’s direct competitor isn’t as cheap. My next car will likely be foreign.

I don't think anything with four wheels is "5 notches" below the Germans in terms of reliability... Like the Bimmers, Audi's and Mercs don't live in dealership garages... Japanese, yes. Features, absolutely. Reliability of the German cars ahh no. There is a reason why you can buy any of those cars for 8 dollars after their warranties run out...

 

[shogun32]

Yeah the myth of German Engineering needs to die. Anything you buy in the states, is likely made here (see Spartanburg), so anything bad you have to say about "US manufacturers" also applies to German "manufacturers". Come at me BMW kids.

It's German quality ENFORCEMENT that is the difference. First, it's designed into the product itself with tighter tolerances on molds and fixtures. And similarly enforced against suppliers - there was a post somewhere about some supplier who could ship total crap to Detroit but wouldn't dare ship it to the German plants or suffer financial penalties. But also they are generally assembled in NON-union, freedom of association States. Which means the company can swiftly and ruthlessly kick substandard employees to the curb where they belong.

Americans CAN (and do) produce world-class products but it requires sufficient motivation. Also just because it's non-Union doesn't mean you automatically get good output as Boeing is learning the hard way. Probably to some extent because all the good employees have long since been vacuumed up by the automakers and only the worth-less are leftover. But again, Boeing is fighting a long-entrenched union that is trying to deliberately sabotage non-union plants. I think the automotive unions have realized their day is done and any obvious interference would lead to even faster dismemberment of rust-belt plants. Thing is, if they really cared about their jobs and value to the company, they'd whip their members into such heights of quality craftsmanship the C-suite would fall over themselves to retain their services.

 

[Dave2013M3]

Right on brother, A Co. 3/75th. (3rdRGR) Long ago... Galaxy far far away... You didn't serve under a CSM Devens did you? He was my Plt. Sgt. in 92-93 and I'm pretty sure he went on to be the Div CSM at the 25th later on. If not Div. he was one of the top enlisted guys there at the time. Bad man!

Left Hawaii in 1985...just aged myself. Man to be frank I don't remember who the CSM was of the 25th Infantry. I remember our Battalion SM, SGM Sodosky. I was in C Quad.

 

[Dave2013M3]

I don't think anything with four wheels is "5 notches" below the Germans in terms of reliability... Like the Bimmers, Audi's and Mercs don't live in dealership garages... Japanese, yes. Features, absolutely. Reliability of the German cars ahh no. There is a reason why you can buy any of those cars for 8 dollars after their warranties run out...

Actually sold my E92 M3 for almost $40k, a seven yr. old car. Very happy in the way this car held its value. Normally I would agree with you, depends on the car.

 

[Mustang5ohMan]

Actually sold my E92 M3 for almost $40k, a seven yr. old car. Very happy in the way this car held its value. Normally I would agree with you, depends on the car.

those m3s hold their value. I thought about buying one... a used one... there still like 50k for a 2 or 3 year old car however they have a warranty of 50k and 4 years.

 

[Soulja4187]

Eventhough the ford dealers suck I dont regret my purchase. I enjoy the car to much to let that sour my life. Plus once my 3/36 is gone I will be modifying this car.

 

[Thegipper]

I don't think anything with four wheels is "5 notches" below the Germans in terms of reliability... Like the Bimmers, Audi's and Mercs don't live in dealership garages... Japanese, yes. Features, absolutely. Reliability of the German cars ahh no. There is a reason why you can buy any of those cars for 8 dollars after their warranties run out...

Fair point. I should have said 5 notches lower in fit and finish, not reliability.

 

[3rdRGR]

Fair point. I should have said 5 notches lower in fit and finish, not reliability.

Not trying to knock them either. I’m a fan of quite a few models and strongly considered an S5 under warranty but all three have pretty poor records with warning lights. Germans can cut metal with the best. Own several of their products but they go bang or cut stuff not go zoom. Unfortunately, they haven’t figured out a reliable electrical system for sheot. Like all Euro brands.

 

[ice445]

It's German quality ENFORCEMENT that is the difference. First, it's designed into the product itself with tighter tolerances on molds and fixtures. And similarly enforced against suppliers - there was a post somewhere about some supplier who could ship total crap to Detroit but wouldn't dare ship it to the German plants or suffer financial penalties. But also they are generally assembled in NON-union, freedom of association States. Which means the company can swiftly and ruthlessly kick substandard employees to the curb where they belong.

Americans CAN (and do) produce world-class products but it requires sufficient motivation. Also just because it's non-Union doesn't mean you automatically get good output as Boeing is learning the hard way. Probably to some extent because all the good employees have long since been vacuumed up by the automakers and only the worth-less are leftover. But again, Boeing is fighting a long-entrenched union that is trying to deliberately sabotage non-union plants. I think the automotive unions have realized their day is done and any obvious interference would lead to even faster dismemberment of rust-belt plants. Thing is, if they really cared about their jobs and value to the company, they'd whip their members into such heights of quality craftsmanship the C-suite would fall over themselves to retain their services.

Yeah I dunno, on my 2017 VW GTI, it ate two water pumps in 54,000 miles. And the cam cover was leaking oil when I got rid of it. Doesn't seem like great enforcement to me. Sure it was made in Mexico, but VW has been doing that for ages, before anyone else. The car's build quality wasn't the issue, it was just shit parts they put on it which comes down to suppliers generally.

Ignoring all the political union talk, I think Ford's main failing to its customers is that they just play dress up with models and charge way more just for fat margins where they can get them. The difference between my 300A car and a 401A Premium is literally non existent when it comes to how it's assembled and the QC process they go through. The only difference is customer expectations. Mine were low because I paid for an engine that I can sit on, but if I spent $50,000 on a loaded Mustang and was running into issues with stuff breaking, rattling, or otherwise feeling cheap as hell, you bet I'd be angry. The stripper model Ecoboost sets the standard for all the others because the production line is designed around it first and foremost. The rest of the shit is stapled on. It's compounded by those same cars being treated like a base model Fiesta by dealerships who's main priority is service volume and customer pay. Ford pays like nothing on warranty jobs so dealership techs hate doing them. But that's another thing not unique to Ford (flat rate and warranty pay has been a cancer that's extracted most of the talent from the industry the last 20 years). The car industry is absolutely cut throat these days, especially on cars designed around a sub $40,000 price point. Ideally it wouldn't be that way, but that brings me to my final point.

The Mustang is a niche car. It always has been and always will be. Sure, it sells 30-40 thousand units a quarter, but on the flip coin Toyota is selling what, 200,000+ Camrys in the same period? Ford skirts a very fine line with making a unique platform with all unique parts still profitable in the end. If a car isn't profitable, it can't continue to exist. They can definitely be doing better of course, but if you look at it this way I feel like it's easier to understand some of the compromises that they have to make.

 

[Maggneto]

Really ready to throw the towel in on this car and I actually like the car... the Ford dealers in my area are a royal PITA to work with! I shouldn’t have to drive 20 miles to even find a decent one.

I’m thinking at this point I might need to locate a Roush, Steeda, or specialty dealer I hopes they’ll take better care.

Appointments are to just meet w/an advisor, work is a week or 2 out, oh and they want to take the car now, have it sit and not give you a loaner or another piece of transportation! Makes no sense to me!!

Making appointments and waiting your turn is how things work ace, especially now that Covid 19 is around. You just don't pull into your local dealership and get your car into the bay, this is not how things work in the real world.

Get a loner, are you serious? You get a loaner when you buy premium cars at premium prices. That should be clear when you make your purchase. My Audi came with a loaner when my car was in the shop, but Ford doesn't give loaners.

I drove German cars (Porsche, Audi, VW) for 20 years and now I happily drive a Ford Mustang.The Ford dealerships in my area are awesome and I can literally go to 4 Ford dealerships within 20 miles and get great service. Maybe it's southern hospitality or my expectations are just inline with reality.

 

[Mustang5ohMan]

Making appointments and waiting your turn is how things work ace, especially now that Covid 19 is around. You just don't pull into your local dealership and get your car into the bay, this is not how things work in the real world.

Get a loner, are you serious? You get a loaner when you buy premium cars at premium prices. That should be clear when you make your purchase. My Audi came with a loaner when my car was in the shop, but Ford doesn't give loaners.

I drove German cars (Porsche, Audi, VW) for 20 years and now I happily drive a Ford Mustang.The Ford dealerships in my area are awesome and I can literally go to 4 Ford dealerships within 20 miles and get great service. Maybe it's southern hospitality or my expectations are just inline with reality.

appreciate the response “ace”. but if you think making an appointment to speak with a service advisor then leave your car with them for a week while you have nothing to driver after you just spent 40k then they’ll love you for your expectations... and that’s fine it seems in this thread your one of the ones who has a different opinion and your welcomed to that.

Myself I am not going to pay for a car to drive whether it’s from BMW, Audi. Merc, Ford, Dodge or, Chevy and let it sit at a dealer until they can “get to it”.

 

[shogun32]

Myself I am not going to pay for a car to drive whether it’s from BMW, Audi. Merc, Ford, Dodge or, Chevy and let it sit at a dealer until they can “get to it”.

Most places I doubt have a fleet of vehicles they can just loan out - maybe 2 or 3 max. It's customary to offer a rental car though - the dealer negotiates heavy discounts on the side for just this purpose.

 

[Maggneto]

appreciate the response “ace”. but if you think making an appointment to speak with a service advisor then leave your car with them for a week while you have nothing to driver after you just spent 40k then they’ll love you for your expectations... and that’s fine it seems in this thread your one of the ones who has a different opinion and your welcomed to that.

Myself I am not going to pay for a car to drive whether it’s from BMW, Audi. Merc, Ford, Dodge or, Chevy and let it sit at a dealer until they can “get to it”.

Based on your description It appears you are looking for "specialty" work and not normal service correct?

For normal service you schedule an appointment and drop off your car when you are scheduled for service like everyone else Ace. For 5 years this is how my 37k Mustang has been serviced. My dealership offered me a loaner once because they had to fix an issue they caused but that's it. When I bought the Ford I knew that loaners were not a part of the deal like my Audi. To get an Oil change I need to schedule 1/2 weeks in advance.

For specialty work, as appears to be the case with you Ace, you need to schedule an appointment to speak with an advisor who handles specialty work. I happen to have my car serviced at the number 1 Roush dealership in the world and there are a limited number of people who handle those requests. You seem to think that everyone should be able to handle your "special needs" without waiting like everyone else.

You don't need to drop off your car. Talk to an advisor, make an appointment, and drop off your car when the service will be ready. This is how it works regardless of brand, service center, normal or specialty work. If you go to a specialty shop you will still need to make an appointment to have your car serviced and drop off your car when the service is ready.

All Ford dealerships don't suck because you can't wait your turn Ace. Smoke a bowl and relax.

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