Ecoboost Engine Blown?

[Steeeliskt]

Update: Engine to be torn down by dealership

After having a meeting with the GM of the dealership he talked with Ford to help me out. They agreed to do a teardown on the engine to determine what happened and what caused it. If they find my mods caused it I'll have to pay for the teardown. If it was a Ford part failure then my warranty will be reinstated and the engine replaced.

Good luck. I hope this works out for you.

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[GT Pony]

Update: Engine to be torn down by dealership

After having a meeting with the GM of the dealership he talked with Ford to help me out. They agreed to do a teardown on the engine to determine what happened and what caused it. If they find my mods caused it I'll have to pay for the teardown. If it was a Ford part failure then my warranty will be reinstated and the engine replaced.

Positive news ... let us know what they find. Get photos if possible.

 

[EcoSwag1990]

That's how it should be. Just because it's modded they can't just automatically rule out the possibility that it was a faulty engine

 

[15GTBEN]

People have been running (Berger Performance JB4 ''piggybacks'') for years in Bimmer 135i's/335is without issue.
There currently is a huge community running a similar unit their MK7 Golf R's/Audi A3 and GTI's. Not one horror story yet and ALL positive. It is the ecu flash tuned VW's blowing the motors and turbos.

It is of course possible that 5 PSI is too much for the ecoboost without tuning... but in the VW/Audi/BMW platforms, the ECU is dynamic enough to provide protection as long as the advised octane is used. This has been proven via datalogging and thorough testing.

OP should have removed the piggyback unit as there wouldn't have been ANY traces in the ECU that it was ever there. Now having run a flash tune, even briefly there's no turning back without a trace. Never go to the dealer with a blow motor without de-modding first, that is just asking for it...

 

[tsunami]

Why not to buy Chrysler...

I had bought a custom Dodge Van. From day 1, it banged like it had been hit with a sledge hammer every time I went slowly over a speed bump or gas station driveway curb. It was in the shop (under warranty) for 3 out of 5 days for nearly five weeks. The dealership was just down the street from my office. So...drop off going to work...pick up after. After more than a month...the service manager told me they had finally fixed 'the problem'. As I drove off the lot...BANG...I turned around and drove into the service bay. The service manager took my keys and threw them at me while cursing both me and my van, and said they would never touch my 6 week old van again for any reason!
I called Chrysler Detroit and was told that I HAD to have ALL warranty work done by the selling dealership! I told them that what they were saying was a lie and I would next be suing them.
My brother-in-law told me that his local Dodge dealership was known for their expertise. I brought it in to them...the service manager came back out in 15 minutes and said "all fixed!". He said that Dodge vans had a 'anti-rattle' clip on the brakes and my van had one missing from the factory. It never banged again. I vowed never to buy a Chrysler product again...and I have kept that promise.
My brother-in-law had similar situation with his Ford Taurus...fell apart soon after purchase. Ford kept denying warranty service. When I bought my 2005 Mustang, I had my fingers crossed. Same for the new convertible.

 

[l2frankie]

Any update?

 

[Mattrix]

Any update?

Unfortunately not yet, waiting for them to start it. The anticipation is killing me though. Is it going to be fixed or am I screwed? I'm trying to stay positive though, so much is riding on the findings.

 

[FordTechOne]

The issue is this - even if the system was JMS boostmax tricked - could it have created a scenario bad enough to throw a rod out the side of the block? Rods getting thrown out (as far as I know) are a result of poor workmanship or lack of oil - as opposed to overboosting and somehow that having enough force to overcome the strength of the rod/bearing on the stock turbo. Id assume if that were the case it would have been throwing codes and harshly pull back the timing when you got on it hard.

A bad tune can most certainly throw a rod through the block. Increasing boost, especially at low RPM, places tremendous stress on the pistons and especially the connecting rods. The force on the connecting rods can be so great that the rods fold like a pretzel when the engine loads up. It has absolutely nothing to do with the rod bearings, a lack of oil, or a factory defect.

In the event of an overboost condition in stock form, the PCM will set DTC P0234 and derate the engine through various measures. Once you have an aftermarket tuning device installed, all of those safety measures get thrown out the window, as the aftermarket device can override them.

Wouldn't assume it would take more than 30-45 minutes to pop a cap off of one of the cam journals and check for abnormal wear. If it was bad enough to throw a rod, it probably marred the cam surface as well. Filter should have stopped all of the bottom end-nom-nom so none of it should be able to reach the cam journals.

With a rod through the block, chances are great that the piston and/or rod contacted the cylinder head. Once that happens, the cylinder head is a paper weight. Therefore, failures like this almost always require long block replacement.

 

[PhillMcKraken]

Unfortunately not yet, waiting for them to start it. The anticipation is killing me though. Is it going to be fixed or am I screwed? I'm trying to stay positive though, so much is riding on the findings.

Hey, atleast you'll know for sure now.

Also, dont take this the wrong way but...

 

[Mattrix]

Seriously bro?

 

[PhillMcKraken]

Your mod list is seriously scary in all honesty.

 

[FordTechOne]

There has been a lot of discussion regarding warranty in here, so I wanted to clear a few things up for everyone regarding the way warranty works between Ford Motor Company and the dealer.

First off, warrantability is determined entirely by the dealer. Ford empowers the dealer to make these decisions to reduce the back-and-forth between manufacturer and franchisee. Ford provides the dealer with the Warranty & Policy Manual, which they are to interpret in order to make the correct decision regarding the warrantability of a repair.

Ford also provides other warranty resources, which include the Interior/Exterior Prior Approval and Powertrain Prior Approval programs, as well as the Warranty Assistance Center. The prior approval programs allow dealers to submit a request to assist with determining warrantability. However, it is still ultimately the dealer's decision to determine what is warrantable and what is not warrantable.

This is why different dealers will often have different opinions on what is a warrantable concern. Some dealers will warranty almost anything, which results in a lot of charge backs from Ford. Other dealers will not warranty anything that has been modified, because they are trying to avoid any potential charge backs.

The dealer determined that your engine failure was non-warrantable due to the fact that you installed an aftermarket tuning device, which modifies the powertrain control. Based on the Warranty & Policy Manual, that is the correct decision.

Ford spends millions of dollars developing and testing powertrain control software for vehicles. By installing an aftermarket tune or tuning device, you are bypassing all of the built in safety parameters in the calibration, and you can easily exceed engine design limitations, resulting in catastrophic damage.

 

[GT Pony]

^^^ So it sounds like the Ford dealership is taking on risk if they do honor the warranty without first checking with Ford, and then later Ford reviews it and says: "Ooops, that was not a viable warranty issue, so you need to pay for it yourself dealership."

If that's the case then I can see how the dealerships are really paranoid to do warranty work without first checking with Ford what their call is on the warranty claim.

 

[GT Pony]

A bad tune can most certainly throw a rod through the block. Increasing boost, especially at low RPM, places tremendous stress on the pistons and especially the connecting rods. The force on the connecting rods can be so great that the rods fold like a pretzel when the engine loads up. It has absolutely nothing to do with the rod bearings, a lack of oil, or a factory defect.

If the rods are bent or failed, and blown out the block and there is no evidence anywhere in the engine of lack of oiling then it was probably an over-boost situation. They should be able to tell if there was an oiling issue or not.

OP - they need to cut open the oil filter to inspect for metal debris also, which might help them determine if bearings were going south before it blew-up.

 

[richard0ne]

There has been a lot of discussion regarding warranty in here, so I wanted to clear a few things up for everyone regarding the way warranty works between Ford Motor Company and the dealer.

First off, warrantability is determined entirely by the dealer. Ford empowers the dealer to make these decisions to reduce the back-and-forth between manufacturer and franchisee. Ford provides the dealer with the Warranty & Policy Manual, which they are to interpret in order to make the correct decision regarding the warrantability of a repair.

Ford also provides other warranty resources, which include the Interior/Exterior Prior Approval and Powertrain Prior Approval programs, as well as the Warranty Assistance Center. The prior approval programs allow dealers to submit a request to assist with determining warrantability. However, it is still ultimately the dealer's decision to determine what is warrantable and what is not warrantable.

This is why different dealers will often have different opinions on what is a warrantable concern. Some dealers will warranty almost anything, which results in a lot of charge backs from Ford. Other dealers will not warranty anything that has been modified, because they are trying to avoid any potential charge backs.

The dealer determined that your engine failure was non-warrantable due to the fact that you installed an aftermarket tuning device, which modifies the powertrain control. Based on the Warranty & Policy Manual, that is the correct decision.

Ford spends millions of dollars developing and testing powertrain control software for vehicles. By installing an aftermarket tune or tuning device, you are bypassing all of the built in safety parameters in the calibration, and you can easily exceed engine design limitations, resulting in catastrophic damage.

I understand what you are trying to say and as consumers we respect that. However, I have seen stock cars have engine problems (rings not seating correctly from factory), blue smoke from the exhaust, etc. . So things happens to unmodified cars as wel.

So just because a person have aftermarket parts doesn't mean the dealer should deny the warranty. They should find the root cause and then determine whether or not it's warranted. In the OP's case, yes it looks the the JMS boost max is the main culprit since it increased boost without properly calibrating the engine but there's always a slight chance that it could be something else that. Very small chance but that should be determined and confirmed.

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