Does the EB ECU "dumb down" mods?

[LeonBorden]

The fact is, this is a new platform and there is going to be a lot of wrong information while companies are trying their best to figure this platform out. The last thing this consumer base needs to do is make vendors and tuners afraid to discuss their findings.

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[Juben]

It'd be nice if everybody on this site would stop grilling every vendor that posts anything. Do you want to offer any proof or reference any of their posts before making accusations?

Grilling them? Asking for proof isn't grilling them! On 2GFusions, there's several guys that's done big turbo swaps with the ATP kits for the FoST cars. Seeing how the 2.0EB is the same between the Fusion and FoST, the kit is a direct bolt-on affair. It's been documented by the guys that's swapped them on. Well one guy had LMS install his turbo swap and they said several things had to be "modified" for the kit to work. Every time someone posted about doing a turbo swap, LMS would ring in and say that parts had to be "modified" to work, but yet never say what! They were asked over and over and over again yet would just pass over the question about what they had to do differently!!! The kit bolted up without modification! I knew that and some other guys knew that because we've done the swap, but still they'd say it couldn't be done! So yes, when there's absolute tons of data to say the factory FMIC is garbage from not only us but also from very well respected tuners and then they want to say it's "overkill", then they do need to provide a reason for that claim. Otherwise, it's don't spread FUD!

^Agree the anti LMS commentary is getting real old it almost feels like there are ppl from other vendors making accounts to mess with them. I don't see them having anything to gain from saying an upgraded intercooler isn't necessary so I would think he has seen evidence of this. Lets see what they have to say when they get back to the forum

I assure you that I'm not another vendor! I have no stake in asking for proof other than not wanting horse crap put out there when it's been well documented from tons of people and tuners! I hope they do post the reason that they said that, but if it's like most cases that I've seen before, we'll just get a generic canned response!

I was very clear that I wasn't trying to be an a**hole, but I just wanted them to give the reasons with some kind of data or proof as to why they made that statement.

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[Juben]

The fact is, this is a new platform and there is going to be a lot of wrong information while companies are trying their best to figure this platform out. The last thing this consumer base needs to do is make vendors and tuners afraid to discuss their findings.

This platform is heavily similar to the 2.0EB platform (that it is based from) along with all of it's complications, e.g. fueling limitations. To anyone that's well versed in the 2.0EB, these things are very familiar. So, while the 2.3 is new in displacement and the Mustang, a lot of it's attributes and quarks isn't.

In regards to making them afraid to discuss their findings, I'm not trying to do that at all. They made a pretty wild statement in saying that an upgraded FMIC is "overkill", so I asked for proof. Normally, they won't provide proof for their opinions, unlike other vendors, and more or less just want you to trust that they're right.

If 100 Mustang owners and tuners had data that said the stock turbo was good to 500 hp, then someone came along and said it was only good till 300 hp, then you'd want to know why too! They made a claim; I asked for proof of that claim without a generic, canned reply.

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[LeonBorden]

So LMS is a bad company because they refused to give specific install instructions about a competitors product? Makes sense...

I'm with you, I'd love to see some proof on the intercooler topic, but there's a tactful way to request it without bashing a company. This is not the first thread this has happened on, and not the first vendor.

 

[Juben]

So LMS is a bad company because they refused to give specific install instructions about a competitors product? Makes sense...

I'm with you, I'd love to see some proof on the intercooler topic, but there's a tactful way to request it without bashing a company. This is not the first thread this has happened on, and not the first vendor.

No, they were telling people that things needed to be modified (which didn't) and saying that you couldn't do it yourself! So, we asked for proof of these complicated "modifications" that would stop a driveway installer from throwing on their turbo kits. Saying things that aren't true without backing up your claims is just spreading FUD. We didn't ask for an install sheet or step-by-step instructions for anything, but if the downpipe had to be modded (which it didn't), then they could have said something like, the downpipe flange needed to be modified. They wouldn't say, even vaguely, what was modified other than it was. Everyone would have been happy with even that little bit of info to back up their claims of "modifications needed".

How was I not tactful? I asked for the data or proof without a canned response. I even said they had good work!

I usually keep my mouth quiet and don't challenge vendors (as I've seemed to do in your mind), but we don't need people, whether vendors or members, throwing out what would appear to be baseless claims based against the tons of information and data that's already out there, especially in regards to our junk FMICs.

I'm assuming that you have one or multiple of their products because their customers seem to not like it when you say or ask anything of them that can be conveyed in a negative light. But, I'll just say this, I don't think I was rude and even clearly stated that I didn't intend it to be such, but rather I just wanted their legit reasons for this claim about the factory FMIC and not a canned response. And again, I even said they have good work (which they do)! However, whether you're a member or vendor, if you're gonna make claims about these cars, or any car for that matter, you need to have legit reasons and/or data and be open to back that up with more than a 'just trust us on this one'.

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[dragonacc]

So LMS is a bad company because they refused to give specific install instructions about a competitors product? Makes sense...

I'm with you, I'd love to see some proof on the intercooler topic, but there's a tactful way to request it without bashing a company. This is not the first thread this has happened on, and not the first vendor.

Ok, I'm going to break it down to specifics from this board without making accusations -

Thermostat - Required for one of their stage upgrades. Helps over come the sky high intake temps. Proof requested months ago, none given so far.

Intake - Used a stock photo of the Air Raid intake, claimed it was their own design. Had to be pressed multiple times to say that Air Raid makes it. Still claimed that they made multiple changes to the interior but still haven't shown pictures or anything of what was changed.

Stock IC is fine - This is the first time I've heard them say that. And they didn't give a good explanation behind their opinion (and it's contrary to what every other tuner has stated).


And now my .02 cents - Spend your money where you want. But personally if a company wants to charge a higher price than everyone else for their parts and the only explanation for why I should buy them is that - they are the best - I'm not buying it.

 

[Renner]

I did two 3rd gear pulls in 15° weather yesterday and the charge air temps jumped from 24° to 87° on one of the pulls. I'd say that's pretty close to Michigan temps lol.

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I was trying to get at LN saying a upgraded intercooler was "overkill" Of course they don't see a need for it now, but once it is 90+ out I highly doubt they will think a larger IC is overkill

 

[Renner]

Ok, I'm going to break it down to specifics from this board without making accusations -



Thermostat - Required for one of their stage upgrades. Helps over come the sky high intake temps. Proof requested months ago, none given so far.



Intake - Used a stock photo of the Air Raid intake, claimed it was their own design. Had to be pressed multiple times to say that Air Raid makes it. Still claimed that they made multiple changes to the interior but still haven't shown pictures or anything of what was changed.



Stock IC is fine - This is the first time I've heard them say that. And they didn't give a good explanation behind their opinion (and it's contrary to what every other tuner has stated).





And now my .02 cents - Spend your money where you want. But personally if a company wants to charge a higher price than everyone else for their parts and the only explanation for why I should buy them is that - they are the best - I'm not buying it.

Could not agree more..I for one will not support a company that only "claims" information.

 

[dragonacc]

I was trying to get at LN saying a upgraded intercooler was "overkill" Of course they don't see a need for it now, but once it is 90+ out I highly doubt they will think a larger IC is overkill

Or when they release their own. Sorry, that was mean…

 

[UPRjoe]

I am working with Mike at FFTEC to get one of thier Performance Intercooler's on the UPR Ecoboost as I am tired of beating my Fiancee in our 2015 GT the first race and then being dead even the second race and after that I can measure my losing distance in light years.

$&@%* Oh did I say that out loud. Either way the FFTEC IC is on the way along with every other trick part Mike will help me get our Ecoboost fitted up with.

Let's stay on topic with making our EcoBoost Mustangs something that will shake the V8 foundation. BTW, I've got a really cool emblems I made and would love to get your feedback on it.

Joe

 

[Juben]

I am working with Mike at FFTEC to get one of thier Performance Intercooler's on the UPR Ecoboost as I am tired of beating my Fiancee in our 2015 GT the first race and then being dead even the second race and after that I can measure my losing distance in light years.

$&@%* Oh did I say that out loud. Either way the FFTEC IC is on the way along with every other trick part Mike will help me get our Ecoboost fitted up with.

Let's stay on topic with making our EcoBoost Mustangs something that will shake the V8 foundation. BTW, I've got a really cool emblems I made and would love to get your feedback on it.

Joe

Would the emblem of which you speak be the turbocharged emblem on your engine cover, lol?

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[dragonacc]

I am working with Mike at FFTEC to get one of thier Performance Intercooler's on the UPR Ecoboost as I am tired of beating my Fiancee in our 2015 GT the first race and then being dead even the second race and after that I can measure my losing distance in light years.

$&@%* Oh did I say that out loud. Either way the FFTEC IC is on the way along with every other trick part Mike will help me get our Ecoboost fitted up with.

Let's stay on topic with making our EcoBoost Mustangs something that will shake the V8 foundation. BTW, I've got a really cool emblems I made and would love to get your feedback on it.

Joe

Can't go wrong with FFTEC's parts Joe!

I may be a bit biased seeing as the only non-FFTEC part I have is your catch can and the AP (which is FFTEC tuned...). ;)

 

[UPRjoe]

UPR Ecoboost Emblems

Would the emblem of which you speak be the turbocharged emblem on your engine cover, lol?

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Very Funny.....

https://plus.google.com/111368442576496538340/posts/cv1xUXppxsW

It took me some time to come up with the EcoBoost with the Turbo's to give you all something with a Wicked Design.

:cheers:

 

[Renner]

Or when they release their own. Sorry, that was mean…

Nah..they will just put their logo on another one ;)

 

[Apwrx]

Very Funny.....

https://plus.google.com/111368442576496538340/posts/cv1xUXppxsW

It took me some time to come up with the EcoBoost with the Turbo's to give you all something with a Wicked Design.

:cheers:

Emblem looks good As far as livernois claim,yes it would be nice for some backing info. I will say they seem to be the fastest of the tunes out right now which is good backing in my mind that they've got something figured out.Iam going with a custom Cobb tune which iam hoping matches the livernois numbers,iam not impressed with what Ive seen from cobbs ots tune.iam really hoping a protune makes up the difference.

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