Do I really need an oil catch can?

[Angrey]

Tick tick tick. How long before this thread get's locked What does politics have to do with an oil catch can?

The mods seem to be a bit slanted on the subject too.

You're correct. Then we should keep the discussion focused on whether or not implementing a catch can is beneficial, rather than the aspects of whether or not it's legal/illegal (or should/shouldn't be).

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[Mspider]

This is a typical leftist fallacy. "Every other government does x, y, z" to which the founders of the Constitution would reply "that's the entire point."

I would never want to live there lol. I was just more so speaking out loud that a lot of places around the world are like this or even worse. Believe me even Cali has a lot more freedoms than most of the world.

 

[Bossdog]

But Ford Performance do sell catch cans:

https://performanceparts.ford.com/part/M-6766-A50

And the first line is:

• This oil-air separator is a must have for any track enthusiast

So Ford Performance engineers think this is a must have.

So The Ford Performance O/A separator does not apply to 2018-2023 GT? Nor to PP2's? I'm out on both accounts

I'm still undecided if I should install a catch can(s). I still don't really understand if you need one, why you wouldn't need one for both sides? Can someone help me out with that?

I'm in agreement, on a street only car, its not necessary/beneficial.

I Road course track on average 2 weekends per summer, not a ton of track time.

Only down side I see is if you buy a cheap one and it clogs or fails. Second if you don't maintain it.
I have a laundry list of track duty items I need to purchase before I head to the track so Catch cans(s) will likely be at the bottom of that list.

 

[CrazyHippie]

so I have a few extra dollars to spend on mods and wondering if i really need to spend money on an oil catch can on a 2021 GT premium? I only have 2,300 miles currently.

I would recommend that you install one. The Coyote is designed to draw a certain amount of hot, oil and moisture-laden air from the engine crank case, through the PCV and a hose, back into the intake. The engine will do this, regardless of whether you insert a catch can into the existing hose or not. Installing the catch can changes nothing about how the engine operates, except it strips some of the oil and moisture from the hot air stream before the air re-enters the intake. To me its a no-brainer - it will help keep your intake cleaner. There's no need for one on the drivers side - air enters that side and is pulled through by the intake vacuum under normal driving conditions.

 

[MAGS1]

So The Ford Performance O/A separator does not apply to 2018-2023 GT? Nor to PP2's? I'm out on both accounts

I'm still undecided if I should install a catch can(s). I still don't really understand if you need one, why you wouldn't need one for both sides? Can someone help me out with that?

I'm in agreement, on a street only car, its not necessary/beneficial.

I Road course track on average 2 weekends per summer, not a ton of track time.

Only down side I see is if you buy a cheap one and it clogs or fails. Second if you don't maintain it.
I have a laundry list of track duty items I need to purchase before I head to the track so Catch cans(s) will likely be at the bottom of that list.

I have the FP one on my 2022. Passenger side only. Just emptied it after about 4,000 miles. It does what it’s supposed to. Is it really necessary for 99% street driving? Probably not but it is keeping that oil vapor from going through the intake. I had FordPass points to use so it didn’t cost me anything.

 

[m3incorp]

Without being for or against the use of catch cans.... I am just wondering how much a personal lawyer would cost to fight the Ford lawyer and the engineers. I hear a lot a people say take this or that to court....and unless you are a lawyer or know one that will do it free...I'm guessing it might get expensive. Having said that, yes I make mods but understand the circumstances. Your last sentence makes a whole lot of sense .

I'd love to see that hold up in court. They'd literately have to prove that the catch can caused a failure. Any dealer can deny work for whatever reason and most people just go oh ok. If anyones dealership is like that simply remove the darn thing before going in.

 

[Bulutt]

I can’t help feeing that for the very little it would cost to fit OEM, which we would pay for anyway, I find it hard to believe Ford wouldn’t fit it standard if it was truly useful.

 

[Bossdog]

That is because the driver side is an air intake 99% of the time. The only time the driver side gets blow by is under WOT.

The crank case ventilation system is fresh air in the driver side, crank case air out the passenger side, unless WOT then both sides see crank case air passing out.

Well, Being at the track (road course or drag strip) is all About WOT, right. I do appreciate the description of why the Passenger side collects more in the catch can. However, I can't say I under stand what what it means functionally.
That being said, I will start with a passenger side JLT (now J&L OSC)

 

[monte87]

I have a dual can set up on my 21' Roushcharged GT, after about 800 miles both of them are empty...so far I haven't seen the "need" for it but to me it was better to have it and not need than to need it and not have it

I am also roushcharged and I had the $400 UPR dual catch cans, after 2x with there new catch can set ups causing throttle hesitation and stumbles, (Vacuum leak) I ripped them off and connected roush stock lines and never had an issue again with vac leaks. Did you have an isuses?
Anthony

P.S. Meant to say, UPR sent me free replacement for 1st crappy unit and it still leaked.

 

[Paul McWhiskey]

One thing to consider when making modifications to your vehicle is whether or not you are prepared to become your own warranty station. The vehicle is warranted as it is supplied to the customer. Once we modify said vehicle the manufacturer has every right to deny warranty unless we can prove that the modification does not cause undue stress and/or wear on related systems.

Now it is well understood that those of us who "tinker" also tend to be somewhat adept in the use of the English language to defend or expound upon the virtue of said "tinkering". I make no comment on whether air/oil separators are beneficial, required, of no purpose. And I make no claim against Ford if they were to deny warranty coverage because of one.

Because, when I BOMB (Better Off Modified Baby) my ride, I become my own Warranty Station.

 

[Angrey]

One thing to consider when making modifications to your vehicle is whether or not you are prepared to become your own warranty station. The vehicle is warranted as it is supplied to the customer. Once we modify said vehicle the manufacturer has every right to deny warranty unless we can prove that the modification does not cause undue stress and/or wear on related systems.

Now it is well understood that those of us who "tinker" also tend to be somewhat adept in the use of the English language to defend or expound upon the virtue of said "tinkering". I make no comment on whether air/oil separators are beneficial, required, of no purpose. And I make no claim against Ford if they were to deny warranty coverage because of one.

Because, when I BOMB (Better Off Modified Baby) my ride, I become my own Warranty Station.

First, I think you've applied the burden/onus onto the consumer far too much. The burden isn't necessarily 100% on the consumer to prove that a modification isn't proximate to the defect, the warranter has an obligation to demonstrate that it does. There's plenty of warranty laws/protections on the books.

Having said that, most warranties are only as good as the attitude of the warranter. If they feel like it, they can deny for any number of legit or bogus reasons, knowing that it takes significant effort and resources for people to challenge it (including time with the vehicle down/unrepaired).

We've all observed the wide spectrum that is warranty claims. One dealer will deny warranty claims if they see the filter is too new (surmising that it's recently been reinstalled and that an aftermarket one was likely employed during the service life) while others will honor work knowing the car has all sorts of mods and upgrades (including tunes) some even with blowers/turbos.

Point is, I don't think someone who utilizes a catch can should automatically assume they no longer have warranty coverage. And at the same time, I'm not a fan of warranties in the first place, I've purchased and administered hundreds of millions worth of warranties in my work capacity and I can tell you that most people overvalue the risk coverage/protections they provide (or don't provide).

I run a catch can, because despite the Ford nutswingers, the engineers don't always get it right, and many of those times, they didn't even get it wrong, they were constrained to do it that way for some other reason (cost, compliance with law, limitations for production and timing, etc). No car should recirculate unspent heavy hydrocarbons through the intake manifold. Period. It's 100% an environmental effort. A catch can makes more sense (from an enviro standpoint) than a breather. In either case, it's better than reducing your effective knock rating, coating your internals with sludge and film, etc. The reason the OEM's choose no catch can is because of the "user" issues with relying upon a person to actually empty the capture and dispose of it PROPERLY (i.e. not in the trash or the drain).

 

[Paul McWhiskey]

First, I think you've applied the burden/onus onto the consumer far too much. The burden isn't necessarily 100% on the consumer to prove that a modification isn't proximate to the defect, the warranter has an obligation to demonstrate that it does. There's plenty of warranty laws/protections on the books.

Having said that, most warranties are only as good as the attitude of the warranter. If they feel like it, they can deny for any number of legit or bogus reasons, knowing that it takes significant effort and resources for people to challenge it (including time with the vehicle down/unrepaired).

We've all observed the wide spectrum that is warranty claims. One dealer will deny warranty claims if they see the filter is too new (surmising that it's recently been reinstalled and that an aftermarket one was likely employed during the service life) while others will honor work knowing the car has all sorts of mods and upgrades (including tunes) some even with blowers/turbos.

Point is, I don't think someone who utilizes a catch can should automatically assume they no longer have warranty coverage. And at the same time, I'm not a fan of warranties in the first place, I've purchased and administered hundreds of millions worth of warranties in my work capacity and I can tell you that most people overvalue the risk coverage/protections they provide (or don't provide).

I run a catch can, because despite the Ford nutswingers, the engineers don't always get it right, and many of those times, they didn't even get it wrong, they were constrained to do it that way for some other reason (cost, compliance with law, limitations for production and timing, etc). No car should recirculate unspent heavy hydrocarbons through the intake manifold. Period. It's 100% an environmental effort. A catch can makes more sense (from an enviro standpoint) than a breather. In either case, it's better than reducing your effective knock rating, coating your internals with sludge and film, etc. The reason the OEM's choose no catch can is because of the "user" issues with relying upon a person to actually empty the capture and dispose of it PROPERLY (i.e. not in the trash or the drain).

With you all of the way. A simple catch can was the analogy for some of the other things that folks do that cause a problem and then do exactly as you stated, put it back to stock and take it to the dealer with the look of innocence on their face expecting a "free" repair of what they lunched.

If you are (or think that you are smarter than the engineers that designed it) go ahead and BOMB it. Then, if it does go sideways, be adult enough to learn from the failure and pay for the repair yourself. In my career I had several who thought that the lubricants that I had supplied them was the fault for various failures. Interestingly every single one that I was able to get to and get good lubricant and failed part samples never showed the fault to be the lubricant itself. Almost all were due to contamination which was introduced by poor product handling after the product had been delivered. Things like fill ports not being cleaned before being opened, being wiped with dirty rags before or after being opened, not being cleaned at all, dirty transfer containers, lack of desiccant breathers or out of service desiccant breathers on storage tanks, NO LUBRICANT when unit was operated and then topped off before contacting me, wrong lubricant for application even though it was available, and I could go on.

Mistakes get made. Own them, learn from them, and move on.

I do not recall ever owning a vehicle that I had not modified. I also have never taken any of them back to the dealer with the hope that they were going to repair or replace anything that failed that could even faintly be associated with anything that I had done to it. I also don't wish to spend my time acting for a service writer. Thus, I Become My Own Repair Station.

 

[RowdyRam]

One thing to consider when making modifications to your vehicle is whether or not you are prepared to become your own warranty station. The vehicle is warranted as it is supplied to the customer. Once we modify said vehicle the manufacturer has every right to deny warranty unless we can prove that the modification does not cause undue stress and/or wear on related systems.

Now it is well understood that those of us who "tinker" also tend to be somewhat adept in the use of the English language to defend or expound upon the virtue of said "tinkering". I make no comment on whether air/oil separators are beneficial, required, of no purpose. And I make no claim against Ford if they were to deny warranty coverage because of one.

Because, when I BOMB (Better Off Modified Baby) my ride, I become my own Warranty Station.

Sounds just like a post from the Turbo Diesel Register!

 

[Roger Blose]

I have the FP designed catch can. Ford designed it so it should be good. And it helps keep the cats cleaner in the long run since you are burning up less deposits over many miles.

 

[Snellemin]

I can’t help feeing that for the very little it would cost to fit OEM, which we would pay for anyway, I find it hard to believe Ford wouldn’t fit it standard if it was truly useful.

I figure that the majority of owners, wouldn't empty a catch can out. So it's cheaper to avoid headaches and just let the blow by go back through the intake and burn off through the combustion chamber.

The FP catch can is the first thing I installed when I got my ride. Driver side was a bit of a pain to install, but my OCD said to install one just in case. So far I have only empty out the passenger side, when I do an oil change.

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