Anybody buying this media fueled COVID-19 bull schitt?

[Burkey]

Interesting article, way to long to quote. Who knows, maybe even Bucky will like it.

https://jbhandleyblog.com/home/2020...Mk-dVdb4gewa7uOuITl-I1EpqWhZRCXldk0UDK1V785NY

Obvious troll is obvious.
Find something a little more credible and we can discuss.
I’m up for a discussion regarding an alternative view, but skewing the data like your mate has in his article isn’t something worthwhile.
I’m quite sure you saw the gaping holes in the data too of course.

Sponsored

 

[Rinzler]

Even more interesting is that BLM isn't even a charity, it exists to funnel money to the DNC. Raised hundreds of millions of dollars and no actual black community outreach programs. Just another Clinton foundation, pay to play.

Bro you are on full tilt. Somebody get this old man some help, please! His pills are wearing off.

 

[Rinzler]

I feel my personal experience is a pretty good cross section and a decent sample size across the country. maybe read what I said. I didn't say it didn't exist I said the numbers i believe are inflated. And if you read enough of the stories you can see plenty of examples of hospitals and states inflating numbers to get more funding. There have been more then a few hospitals caught saying everything was covid and all deaths regardless of reason was covid. And several states that peopel involved came out and said they were told to inflate covid numbers.

And I can say same to you. Just because you know several people with it does not mean it is as bad as you think. Just because it is disproportionately affecting you does not mean it is everyone.

And technically just about everyones opinion on covid is confirmation bias. Every single person here on this thread is looking up info to agree with their opinion even you.

I would actually disagree with that. Lets make sure we're boxing in your original argument that it's not as bad as the media is making it out to be based on your personal observations. For example, your opinion of the situation can change, from not thinking it's a big deal to thinking it is, while the number of COVID cases and deaths do not.

While you're absolutely correct, there are areas, especially metropolitan area which are disproportionately affected by COVID than others, that does not mean that my statement regarding the severity of the situation is incorrect. Those two things can co-exist together in the same sentence.

To your point around hospitals "inflating numbers", please do not confuse people which were presumed positive, versus people who tested positive. That is easy to confuse, and even easier to misconstrue as some sort of malicious behavior. It was well documented, recommended, and a generally accepted practice to assume a positive COVID diagnosis, if symptoms were present, even if there was not yet a positive test result. This was due to a severe shortage in test results as well as a very long wait time to receive said diagnosis. This means, hospitals were in fact reporting positive COVID cases without a positive test case. This was the recommendation and guideline followed by most hospitals around the country. I cannot say that every person reporting cases, nor every hospital were perfect or just in their representation, however, in most cases, hospitals reported to the best of their ability.

And no, my statement was not opinion so I will not let you use false equivalency here. My statement was based off factual numbers, while your opinion was based off of perceived severity. The numbers indicate this is a severe situation which should be taken with swift and concise action. You opinion/observation that it's not that bad is well within your rights to say, but doesn't have basis in reality based on the current situation.

Please do not pass your opinion as fact. It is dangerous at worst, and irresponsible at best.

 

[Briebee72]

I would actually disagree with that. Lets make sure we're boxing in your original argument that it's not as bad as the media is making it out to be based on your personal observations. For example, your opinion of the situation can change, from not thinking it's a big deal to thinking it is, while the number of COVID cases and deaths do not.

While you're absolutely correct, there are areas, especially metropolitan area which are disproportionately affected by COVID than others, that does not mean that my statement regarding the severity of the situation is incorrect. Those two things can co-exist together in the same sentence.

To your point around hospitals "inflating numbers", please do not confuse people which were presumed positive, versus people who tested positive. That is easy to confuse, and even easier to misconstrue as some sort of malicious behavior. It was well documented, recommended, and a generally accepted practice to assume a positive COVID diagnosis, if symptoms were present, even if there was not yet a positive test result. This was due to a severe shortage in test results as well as a very long wait time to receive said diagnosis. This means, hospitals were in fact reporting positive COVID cases without a positive test case. This was the recommendation and guideline followed by most hospitals around the country. I cannot say that every person reporting cases, nor every hospital were perfect or just in their representation, however, in most cases, hospitals reported to the best of their ability.

And no, my statement was not opinion so I will not let you use false equivalency here. My statement was based off factual numbers, while your opinion was based off of perceived severity. The numbers indicate this is a severe situation which should be taken with swift and concise action. You opinion/observation that it's not that bad is well within your rights to say, but doesn't have basis in reality based on the current situation.

Please do not pass your opinion as fact. It is dangerous at worst, and irresponsible at best.

And what makes anything you said fact? the news?

Disagree all you want, what are your facts? The news tells you? Where are you getting these facts from? I mean the news can tell me the sky is red all it wants and you can show me papers that its red and studies that its red. But go out side and look. Its blue. The old saying open your eyes. Just like the use car shortage they keep saying is happening. UM I see used cars every flippin where every city i drive through has 10 to 20 used car lots full. there are 2 auction houses near me all full of cars. the rental car companies have so many cars I think its hertz is trying to sell of 1.2 million of them. Yet everywhere I look people are saying well there is a shortage. I point at the full used car lots and say how... they say well there is the news said so.

It was fact that masks didnt help, then it was fact they did, now it is fact yet again that some masks are worse then wearing nothing. Its fact that masks help stop the spread. yet if you open your eyes and look at transmission charts they align with the push to wear masks. Since we started pushing masks and making them mandatory the numbers have increased. HUmmm touching your face more are we.... are masks better? yeah facts ... every one has facts dont they. maybe people need to stop believing the news as facts and start just being observant.

And at the end of the day where are the people you say are telling us facts getting them from? where exactly does the local abc news channel get its facts? you think little kelly news anchor from po dunk Virginia has some special facts connection? No they are all googling the shit the same way you are and taking government reports which no one trusts the same way you are. so again what makes it a fact?

Ive seen reports of the covid affecting people of color worse, then ive seen reports of it not affecting them that badly. so whats the facts? hard to say stuff is facts when its changing everywhere. Again just go out and look. Get off the phone and stop googling and actually look.

but please make sure you type up a 7 page response with yet more no facts in it claiming they are facts. I wont respond im not gonna get drawn into a 9 page whos penis is bigger argument. I got better things to do like not hiding in my house cause the news said so. anyway I know you will want the last word, a last I told ya so, so go ahead knock yourself out have the last word and be right. IM gonna go drive and enjoy my life and not worry about this stupid crap.

 

[Weather Man]

Obvious troll is obvious.
Find something a little more credible and we can discuss.
I’m up for a discussion regarding an alternative view, but skewing the data like your mate has in his article isn’t something worthwhile.
I’m quite sure you saw the gaping holes in the data too of course.

Poor Bucky, doesn't like how they interpreted the data.

 

[Briebee72]

A good friend of mine made a good point the other day. A senator may cost you a million or two but you can buy 10 scientist to 500k.

When your funding depends on you scientific position it’s not really science at all. It’s politics. Climate change is a perfect example. The government under Obama spent exactly $0.00 on science that disproved global warming. Kinda hard to find somethings true weight when you only get paid for finding the “right” answers.

Thank you.

 

[raptor17GT]

so you guys believe the Covid death numbers are made up? Just to make money from the Government? Show how fcked up your health system if that is the case. Profit before healthcare, medi insurance before pay rises. Yup, sounds delightful

 

[Rinzler]

And what makes anything you said fact? the news?

Disagree all you want, what are your facts? The news tells you? Where are you getting these facts from? I mean the news can tell me the sky is red all it wants and you can show me papers that its red and studies that its red. But go out side and look. Its blue. The old saying open your eyes. Just like the use car shortage they keep saying is happening. UM I see used cars every flippin where every city i drive through has 10 to 20 used car lots full. there are 2 auction houses near me all full of cars. the rental car companies have so many cars I think its hertz is trying to sell of 1.2 million of them. Yet everywhere I look people are saying well there is a shortage. I point at the full used car lots and say how... they say well there is the news said so.

It was fact that masks didnt help, then it was fact they did, now it is fact yet again that some masks are worse then wearing nothing. Its fact that masks help stop the spread. yet if you open your eyes and look at transmission charts they align with the push to wear masks. Since we started pushing masks and making them mandatory the numbers have increased. HUmmm touching your face more are we.... are masks better? yeah facts ... every one has facts dont they. maybe people need to stop believing the news as facts and start just being observant.

And at the end of the day where are the people you say are telling us facts getting them from? where exactly does the local abc news channel get its facts? you think little kelly news anchor from po dunk Virginia has some special facts connection? No they are all googling the shit the same way you are and taking government reports which no one trusts the same way you are. so again what makes it a fact?

Ive seen reports of the covid affecting people of color worse, then ive seen reports of it not affecting them that badly. so whats the facts? hard to say stuff is facts when its changing everywhere. Again just go out and look. Get off the phone and stop googling and actually look.

but please make sure you type up a 7 page response with yet more no facts in it claiming they are facts. I wont respond im not gonna get drawn into a 9 page whos penis is bigger argument. I got better things to do like not hiding in my house cause the news said so. anyway I know you will want the last word, a last I told ya so, so go ahead knock yourself out have the last word and be right. IM gonna go drive and enjoy my life and not worry about this stupid crap.

Alright, lets unpack this.

1. I have never once cited the news as a source of information. I don't think you should consider anything from news as objectively fact, actually. I do, trust the numbers the CDC are putting out as a consistent metric of progression. So whether it's correct to the individual case is a non-issue, it is a good indicator, however, of whether cases are going up or cases are going down. That can be distilled as an objective truth about the situation.
For reference, anytime I referenced the "the numbers", I was referring to the official numbers as reported by the CDC and the HHS here.

2. As any metric, it is important to understand the context in which that measurement was made. Was it in context of a specific city, a specific state? That helps box in exactly what is being measured so that the applicability of the information is extremely straightforward. In the case of COVID affecting people worse, the context was that people of color tend to be poorer, live in greater concentrations of numbers, and generally have less opportunity to work from home. Therefor, the statement has been made that people of color are more affected by COVID than other groups who have opportunity to do those other things.

3. Regarding face masks. There was a study that showed that neck gaiters could in fact be worse than wearing nothing at all, because the mesh was so large that it ended up breaking larger droplets into smaller ones. This was due to the material the mask was made out of which was mostly highly stretchable polyester. Cotton masks were sufficient in stopping large droplets, polypropylene masks an order of magnitude better, surgical masks an order of magnitude better than that, and N95 masks as being best.

I've always equated face masks to seat belts. While seat belts do not prevent 100% of vehicle deaths, they do help keep the body in the seat during a crash. Even if this is 50% effective (which it is much higher), that is 50% fewer people who wouldn't die from a car accident. Similarly, although cotton masks do not prevent 100% of all particles, even a 20% reduction would be extremely significant for stopping the spread.

4. In relation to the numbers increasing even though people are advocating for masks, respiratory transmission is not the ONLY method of transmission. This is why continued hand washing, sanitization, social distancing, and others are ALL methods in which we can stop the spread. Masks are one of the tools in our toolkit to prevent the spread and should not be seen as a cure-all or prevent-all for COVID. We should be using every tool we have in order to stop this and get things back to normal.

Lastly, here's some opinions for you:

I don't think anyone in this situation has Confirmation Bias such that they want COVID to continue the spread. I don't think it makes much sense that folks would want the numbers to increase and stay at home orders to continue. It's annoying as hell for everyone and everyone wants this hell that is 2020 to be over with. However, we have a growing number of folks who are just saying 'fuck it' and continuing the spread, probably unknowingly. It's good that YOU haven't had to deal with a lot of it, but for those of us who see COVID in the people we love and care about, 'fuck it' is not an acceptable response to the frustration of this situation.

If you choose to believe the numbers as being reported, that's on you. But don't try to pass off your ambivalence as substitute for information. And you know what? I'd rather have a long ass response to a complicated question that addresses issues and arguments than not. So if you don't want to engage, go somewhere else. Why come to a thread about COVID then complain that everyone is talking about COVID? That's nonsensical.

 

[Briebee72]

Why come to a thread about COVID then complain that everyone is talking about COVID? That's nonsensical.

Well becasue the thread is call "Anybody buying this media fueled COVID-19 bull schitt? I answered that question. I am not. You are. So there it is. You win the internet your penis is bigger only your view point is valid. You do a lot of gum flappin about facts and then provide nothing but opinion in your responses yet tell everyone else they are wrong. Enjoy your day. Buh bye

and covid

 

[raptor17GT]

Well becasue the thread is call "Anybody buying this media fueled COVID-19 bull schitt? I answered that question. I am not. You are. So there it is. You win the internet your penis is bigger only your view point is valid. You do a lot of gum flappin about facts and then provide nothing but opinion in your responses yet tell everyone else they are wrong. Enjoy your day. Buh bye

and covid

I think you take the award for dumbest post of the year, as nominated by me (the now previous holder of this prestigious award ) and by Weather Man. Have a cookie

 

[Briebee72]

I think you take the award for dumbest post of the year, as nominated by me (the now previous holder of this prestigious award ) and by Weather Man. Have a cookie

Na this award goes to the whole thread to be honest. If anyone takes me seriously that just goes to show you all need lifes out side of forums and arguing over this pointless crap. if yall cant tell when someone is shooting fish in a barrel them you all need some help. Its easy to get idiots worked up over their opinions. I honestly could care less about numbers, facts, opinions or covid. but yall enjoy arguing with each other from your mothers basements. Considering all 213 pages of this thread are basically the same 4 people arguing over who has the more factual facts.

 

[Burkey]

Poor Bucky, doesn't like how they interpreted the data.

Lol. No, I didn’t like the numbers they quoted because they aren’t FACTUAL. I’m quite willing to have a debate based on numbers that are supported by EVIDENCE but if you want to have a debate based on numbers plucked out of thin air, you go right ahead. Rational people who require evidence for their beliefs won’t be taking part in it.

 

[Burkey]

A good friend of mine made a good point the other day. A senator may cost you a million or two but you can buy 10 scientist to 500k.

When your funding depends on you scientific position it’s not really science at all. It’s politics. Climate change is a perfect example. The government under Obama spent exactly $0.00 on science that disproved global warming. Kinda hard to find somethings true weight when you only get paid for finding the “right” answers.

100% agreed. Governments across the globe should stop allocating funds to scientists whose findings are inconvenient and instead start funnelling cash into disproving already established scientific theories that don’t suit the agendas of the governments that fund them or the people who vote for those governments.
Why stop at climate change though?
We all know that science isn’t a self-correcting system.
Governments should also pay scientists to work out why vaccines cause autism, why the earth is flat, why the theory of evolution is entirely wrong and disprove a whole raft of already well established scientific principles.

But more seriously, when you consider how much money certain lobby groups have been willing to pay unqualified scientists to come up with utter trash that has done NOTHING to disprove the current theory, it makes me wonder how much more they would pay someone suitably qualified to come up with something that actually works.
I guarantee you there’s a LOT more money in working for companies that stand to make profits than there is in working a government funded job.
Willie Soon made $1.25 million for his horrible attempts, above and beyond what he was receiving for his regular day job.
Best part is, he didn’t even have to do any research, instead simply looking at already published research and trying to prove it wrong, which he failed dismally at because he isn’t qualified in the relevant fields that he was critiquing.
Yep, follow the money. It’s amazing.

 

[Silver Bullitt]

I think you take the award for dumbest post of the year, as nominated by me (the now previous holder of this prestigious award ) and by Weather Man. Have a cookie

Na this award goes to the whole thread to be honest. If anyone takes me seriously that just goes to show you all need lifes out side of forums and arguing over this pointless crap. if yall cant tell when someone is shooting fish in a barrel them you all need some help. Its easy to get idiots worked up over their opinions. I honestly could care less about numbers, facts, opinions or covid. but yall enjoy arguing with each other from your mothers basements. Considering all 213 pages of this thread are basically the same 4 people arguing over who has the more factual facts.

And then follows it up with the most intelligent commonsensical response of the millennium!!! Brilliant!!!

 

[Weather Man]

100% agreed. Governments across the globe should stop allocating funds to scientists whose findings are inconvenient and instead start funnelling cash into disproving already established scientific theories that don’t suit the agendas of the governments that fund them or the people who vote for those governments.
Why stop at climate change though?
We all know that science isn’t a self-correcting system.
Governments should also pay scientists to work out why vaccines cause autism, why the earth is flat, why the theory of evolution is entirely wrong and disprove a whole raft of already well established scientific principles.

But more seriously, when you consider how much money certain lobby groups have been willing to pay unqualified scientists to come up with utter trash that has done NOTHING to disprove the current theory, it makes me wonder how much more they would pay someone suitably qualified to come up with something that actually works.
I guarantee you there’s a LOT more money in working for companies that stand to make profits than there is in working a government funded job.
Willie Soon made $1.25 million for his horrible attempts, above and beyond what he was receiving for his regular day job.
Best part is, he didn’t even have to do any research, instead simply looking at already published research and trying to prove it wrong, which he failed dismally at because he isn’t qualified in the relevant fields that he was critiquing.
Yep, follow the money. It’s amazing.

Bucky, it must be painful to be as naive as as you are. But, garbage in = garbage out I guess.

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