SCCA F-Street Setup. What's Everyone Done so Far?

[kz]

The difference is even more stark when you hop back into an S550 immediately. Did you ever try using the center air vents too? Because of the placement, the air doesn't reach your face unless it's at full blast. Also you cannot fit 4 wheels and tires in that car. I fit my mounted 305/30R19 RE71's on 19x11s in the Mustang! There are soooo many things like that on the Camaro that were 100% styling decisions. The platform and chassis is an objectively and subjectively better performer in every way, but it sucks at everything people use cars for.

Exactly - cars are quite a bit better than Mustangs, especially 1/LE. I just rode in one at autocross,that was all. Fitting the wheels is another thing - I used to fit four FS wheels with everything else, a cooler and passenger. I can fit four 305s on 11s now with lots of stuff but no passenger (remains to be seen if it becomes more doable with no rear seat). I am not sure if one 305/30/19 would even fit through Camaro's trunk opening...

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[TeeLew]

This is why I gave up on F-Street before even considering it. To make this car handle well requires a lot more than Street allows. CAM life.

Eco's have a pretty nice BoP in STU & you're allowed to do enough stuff to make the car work. That's the target with my HPP.

 

[TeeLew]

Yeah, not bad. You're still going to have a hard time in STU with a well-prepped Evo/STi. STU doesn't let you fix the giant mistakes for suspension bushings that Ford uses.

Ya, you're kinda stuck with Poly or Delrin. It still looks like fun.

 

[TeeLew]

I don't know if this is allowed (rules are no additional metal content added)...but it functionally fixes the ridiculous suspension bind in the rear control arms:
https://superpro.com.au/show-product/superpro-bushing-kit/orphan-SPF4736K

That would seem to fit the spirit of the rules if not the actual letter.

 

[Schnupper]

I finally got to try out my new setup this weekend. Took 4th in overall PAX. I ended up setting the koni's to 1.5 in front and just a little over 1 in the rear. I also got the RE71'rs dialed in. Ended up with 33psi hot in front and 30psi hot in the rear. I so far dislike the RE71'rs compared to Rivals. Here is a video of my best clean run of the afternoon. I messed up around 25 seconds in on the lefthander going into the slalom.

 

[Dana Pants]

That run showed some real good anticipation of the vehicle’s capabilities.

It looks like you are using throttle stabby-stabby to cause rotation in a vehicle that wants to push. Most data-logging of alien drivers in power cars shows quite smooth throttle modulation. Come with me to the dark side of big rear sway bar...

 

[Whiskey11]

That run showed some real good anticipation of the vehicle’s capabilities.

It looks like you are using throttle stabby-stabby to cause rotation in a vehicle that wants to push. Most data-logging of alien drivers in power cars shows quite smooth throttle modulation. Come with me to the dark side of big rear sway bar...

That's not the dark side, that's literally what everyone runs except a few of us who are crazy and run the front bar.

My experience is spoiled by the fact I run on the Nationals Concrete for EVERY event. I have a lot of seat time on this concrete. In these tighter courses on smaller lots, the rear bar helps, but on the big courses at Nationals or Spring Nats or the larger national tour locations, it's much easier to drive a front bar car IME. I guess we should be thankful Ford got these cars pretty well balanced from the factory that we can have these discussions at all... even though the PP1 cars are horribly undersprung and underdamped and undertired....

The RE71R requires precision in steering. It rewards smooth inputs with more overall grip while cornering. They are also NOT tolerant of heat (IME). They are NOT tolerant of a lot of overdriving. They do NOT like being UNDER pressure at all. 33 front and 30 rear is pretty low. Justin and I were at 38 all around on 285's all around and at one point as low as 36 but couldn't deal with the wear (like 3 weekends and the shoulders were shot on the fronts). No difference in time, but better wear, better controllability at the limit and less finicky at the limit.

Agreed on throttle inputs... if you want the car to rotate, then put more consistent gas overall to get the car to work.


Listen to the throttle inputs in this video and compare it to your video... watch the sections where the car oversteers and watch the throttle percentage. You can see the "average" throttle point was higher than similar corners on course but there was only one point in which I "stabbed" the throttle to get rotation, much fewer "cuts" in the throttle too. It comes with confidence in what the car is doing.

FWIW, I also run significantly higher damper settings... I'm full stiff up front and a turn from full stiff out back. There isn't enough damping on the Koni Yellows to "jack down" the car with the front bar setup so I'm not worried about playing on the bump stops, and the car is definitely faster and easier to drive with more front rebound. Tune the rears to the slaloms you typically see so the car is just a smidge loose on lift off in that slalom and then drive around it everywhere else. Seems to work out well for my driving style anyway.

 

[Dana Pants]

Yeah, my notes from last year specifically reference that I should use 38 psi front at Nats. I currently run 35/32 on asphalt and can confirm that less is plain old bad.

 

[Schnupper]

That run showed some real good anticipation of the vehicle’s capabilities.

It looks like you are using throttle stabby-stabby to cause rotation in a vehicle that wants to push. Most data-logging of alien drivers in power cars shows quite smooth throttle modulation. Come with me to the dark side of big rear sway bar...

I was definitely struggling to get it to rotate. After watching all my videos I could have just manned up and rolled on the throttle to get it to turn. I am very hesitant to change bars until I get to run the car on our other location. The other location is gigantic and has tons of grip. The layouts also allow you to hit 3rd gear also!

Yeah, my notes from last year specifically reference that I should use 38 psi front at Nats. I currently run 35/32 on asphalt and can confirm that less is plain old bad.

My gauge could be reading differently. The tire wear was perfect, no rollover at all, and the pictures also show that. Now at the other location, I might have to bump up the pressure a few due to higher speeds/loads. I will put that in my notes!

That's not the dark side, that's literally what everyone runs except a few of us who are crazy and run the front bar.

My experience is spoiled by the fact I run on the Nationals Concrete for EVERY event. I have a lot of seat time on this concrete. In these tighter courses on smaller lots, the rear bar helps, but on the big courses at Nationals or Spring Nats or the larger national tour locations, it's much easier to drive a front bar car IME. I guess we should be thankful Ford got these cars pretty well balanced from the factory that we can have these discussions at all... even though the PP1 cars are horribly undersprung and underdamped and undertired....

The RE71R requires precision in steering. It rewards smooth inputs with more overall grip while cornering. They are also NOT tolerant of heat (IME). They are NOT tolerant of a lot of overdriving. They do NOT like being UNDER pressure at all. 33 front and 30 rear is pretty low. Justin and I were at 38 all around on 285's all around and at one point as low as 36 but couldn't deal with the wear (like 3 weekends and the shoulders were shot on the fronts). No difference in time, but better wear, better controllability at the limit and less finicky at the limit.

Agreed on throttle inputs... if you want the car to rotate, then put more consistent gas overall to get the car to work.


Listen to the throttle inputs in this video and compare it to your video... watch the sections where the car oversteers and watch the throttle percentage. You can see the "average" throttle point was higher than similar corners on course but there was only one point in which I "stabbed" the throttle to get rotation, much fewer "cuts" in the throttle too. It comes with confidence in what the car is doing.

FWIW, I also run significantly higher damper settings... I'm full stiff up front and a turn from full stiff out back. There isn't enough damping on the Koni Yellows to "jack down" the car with the front bar setup so I'm not worried about playing on the bump stops, and the car is definitely faster and easier to drive with more front rebound. Tune the rears to the slaloms you typically see so the car is just a smidge loose on lift off in that slalom and then drive around it everywhere else. Seems to work out well for my driving style anyway.

I will put this in my notes and give it a shot! I appreciate the input and video. Thank you! I will definitely report back after my next event.

 

[TeeLew]

That's not the dark side, that's literally what everyone runs except a few of us who are crazy and run the front bar.

Have you ever stuck some spring rubbers (not bump rubbers) in the rear to get some extra rear stiffness? I believe they're legal (need to check) and it might be a way to keep the FARB and get a stiffer rear.

 

[Gearz]

I'm still working out pressures but at the Topeka Pro last weekend I ran 29F and 26-27R on bumpy asphalt. It gripped really well and transitioned good but I did knock the outer edges of the fronts off quite a bit. This is on a GT350 so wider wheels than FS and I have the factory camber plates (-2.6°) but otherwise 305 square RE71s. I'll probably bump them up to 31F/28R for Lincoln this weekend and see how they do.

 

[jpaulson]

I ran my stones at 32f 29r in FS trim. I don't remember deviating over a pound either way for any surface. This was big front bar setup.

 

[TeeLew]

Have you ever stuck some spring rubbers (not bump rubbers) in the rear to get some extra rear stiffness? I believe they're legal (need to check) and it might be a way to keep the FARB and get a stiffer rear.

Nevermind, that's Street Touring.

 

[Dana Pants]

So in today’s episode of time wasting activities, I shifted my front sub-frame to try to balance my front camber.

Looks like the whole exercise was worth about 0.2 degrees per side. I have would needed about twice as much adjustment as was available, but progress is progress.

On the other hand, I can confirm this isn’t hard to do. you just need an 18 mm socket, a breaker bar and a pry bar basically.
The first two images show silver paint pen marks from before I shifted the subframe and how much the subframe moved.

And of course my high tech alignment print-out:
View attachment 484588

Location of sub-frame bolts. Torque to 85 ft-lb

 

[TeeLew]

What balance issues do most people struggle to cure?

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