10 Speed Owners... please talk to me...

[Robottrainer]

The 10r80 does not adapt to driving styles.

Yes! My understanding it adapt to keep things within operational design parameters.

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[engineermike]

Yes! My understanding it adapt to keep things within operational design parameters.

Exactly. For instance, stroke is the phase of the shift when it's moving the clutch plates into position. The pressure is specified in the tune, but the time is calculated based on the volume of fluid that is needed. If it detects the plates start to engage early or late, it will add or subtract from the stroke time. As plates wear, it has to adjust the time. This is the adaptive part. It also has tie-up (2 gears engaged) and flare (neither gear engaged) detection, and it will adjust torque transfer ramp rates to address these. These have nothing to do with driving style. The shift points and firmness are fully specified in the tune and do not "learn". As I stated earlier, Dodge/Ram do adjust firmness and shift points based on a driver aggressiveness "score" that it determines for you. As such, tuners are trying to tune to a moving target.

 

[Gen 6 Mach1]

I was only relaying the information I had found on the 10r80. I stand corrected on the learning , I had read in some information . Sorry I should of did more research bf including that . I'm new to the forum and the 5.0ti vct and 10r80 power train and just trying to learn about the combination. Thank you Mike for your in-depth on the adaptive operation aspects and correcting me.

 

[engineermike]

@Gen 6 Mach1 no worries. The entire drivetrain control is immensely complicated and very often misunderstood. Most people believe it adapts to driving style so it’s a common misconception.

 

[Gen 6 Mach1]

@Gen 6 Mach1 no worries. The entire drivetrain control is immensely complicated and very often misunderstood. Most people believe it adapts to driving style so it’s a common misconception.

Thanks Mike , this is what I understand,( but at the time it was a learning experience) 1976 til 2005 I sure had a great time. Looking back the combination is so simple . At 70 I can't do anymore. So stepped up and bought my first Ford Car. So do they need to be this complicated?

 

[1v1MeBro]

The only similarity to mine is the delay in the paddles, but it doesn't seem to be as bad as yours. In normal mode mine does take a bit too much throttle input to downshift, but it's very responsive in sport or track mode. No clunkiness or harsh engagement. I guess I got lucky.

Then it is doing what is supposed to do. Paddle shifting is delayed when under less throttle, and snappy when under more throttle.

 

[1v1MeBro]

2020 10r80 car which is normally driven easily, but sometimes spirited. I think the only thing that I have in common with the OP's issues is the lagging paddle shifts. From what I gather, that's how it is supposed to drive. More lag(smooth) under less throttle, and snappy/quick in sport mode, or under heavier throttle. I notice the same lagging issue until I put it in sport, but then again the only time use the paddles is if I am about to party, and I want to select my perfect gear, it goes back into auto shift after the hit.

 

[Arthonon]

Then it is doing what is supposed to do. Paddle shifting is delayed when under less throttle, and snappy when under more throttle.

That's interesting to hear because I had noticed slow upshifts while using the paddles, and noted that it was as I was easing off the throttle, and wondered if that was intentional. I hadn't heard any official statement to that effect, but it seemed like a logical possibility, though I am not sure why.

 

[1v1MeBro]

That's interesting to hear because I had noticed slow upshifts while using the paddles, and noted that it was as I was easing off the throttle, and wondered if that was intentional. I hadn't heard any official statement to that effect, but it seemed like a logical possibility, though I am not sure why.

This is just from personal experience with y 10r80, and taking the time to drive it in all modes, and different driving styles. I have found that in normal mode and driving normally, it will lag, sport mode under throttle it is way snappier. go mess with yours and see if that is the case.

 

[acemastr]

Curious which diff you guys have. I just swapped my 3.55 to a 3.15 and the trans feels much smoother, presumably because of the ratio change.

 

[engineermike]

... I hadn't heard any official statement to that effect, but it seemed like a logical possibility, though I am not sure why.

It's because the paddle shift can only initiate the shifting process. It has to go through prime/boost phase, stroke phase, and torque transfer phase before the ratio changes. At light load and low rpm, those phases take longer by design. There is no reason to execute the torque transfer phase and others quickly under those conditions.

If you wanted to go deep in the trans tuning, you could set up one of the shift characters to execute low rpm, low torque shifts quickly and switch to that character when entering LID or SST modes. Might be a fun science project.

 

[MidwayJ]

Then it is doing what is supposed to do. Paddle shifting is delayed when under less throttle, and snappy when under more throttle.

In principle yes, but upshifts were delayed too much unless you were at 80-100% throttle, to the point of being annoying and unusable. Fortunately the transmission behaved very well in automatic mode. (I'm using past tense because I recently sold the car.)

 

[Robottrainer]

It's because the paddle shift can only initiate the shifting process. It has to go through prime/boost phase, stroke phase, and torque transfer phase before the ratio changes. At light load and low rpm, those phases take longer by design. There is no reason to execute the torque transfer phase and others quickly under those conditions.

If you wanted to go deep in the trans tuning, you could set up one of the shift characters to execute low rpm, low torque shifts quickly and switch to that character when entering LID or SST modes. Might be a fun science project.

My memory sucks but I think sport SST is characterisric 1. Its also 1 in normal mode...I think.

 

[1v1MeBro]

In principle yes, but upshifts were delayed too much unless you were at 80-100% throttle, to the point of being annoying and unusable. Fortunately the transmission behaved very well in automatic mode. (I'm using past tense because I recently sold the car.)

Yeah, that is weird.

 

[Arthonon]

In principle yes, but upshifts were delayed too much unless you were at 80-100% throttle, to the point of being annoying and unusable. Fortunately the transmission behaved very well in automatic mode. (I'm using past tense because I recently sold the car.)

I also found that in lower gears, when accelerating harder, it responded to manual shifts quickly, and also while down-shifting, but as I approached the top speed I wanted to hit, and began lifting on the throttle, the upshifts were less responsive. Because my speed was stabilizing at that point, it didn't really impact performance much, but was kind of annoying.

Since the Ford tune was applied, I haven't felt the need to manually shift much because it seems to do such a good job on its own.

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