2024 Darkhorse (tremec) vs 2023 Camaro ZL1 (tremec)

[SheepDog]

Bottom line:
15-17 Mustang GT - OMG bang for yer buck.
s650 - buck for yer bang.
Darkhorse - like paying 500 to a hooker & only getting a 5 dollar BJ.
IMO

And an ugly hooker at that. The front end of the Darkhorse is vomit

Sponsored

 

[SheepDog]

Let’s do apples to apples.
Stock for stock what you get for the ZL1 and the DH the ZL1 wins hands down. A lot more bang for the buck.

Now when it comes to modifications and power for your dollar Ford has proven time and time again that their engine technology is heads and shoulders that above of GM. Modded ZL1s gets their lunch eaten by modded 5.0 on the net in just about every video that’s posted. I’ve seen a few Camaros and ZL1 beat mustangs but that’s far few in between and many times they are gutted down to 1 seat a steering wheel and a speedo.

Again if you’re going to stay stock yes the ZL1 price point offers way more then the DH but what it comes down ia how far do you want your dollar to stretch if you’re staying absolutely stock.

Considering that the S650 PCM's will be locked, staying stock will be the only option. (I'm sure companies like Burger Tuning will have piggybacks available, but that likely won't work with Forced Induction)

 

[AZlb5.0]

Considering that the S650 PCM's will be locked, staying stock will be the only option. (I'm sure companies like Burger Tuning will have piggybacks available, but that likely won't work with Forced Induction)

The GM C8 PCM was supposed to be locked also. We’ve seen C8Zs with turbo kits operating already. I put a grain of salt on that whole “locked” argument. There are folks out there that their whole existence revolves around breaking “locked” PCMs.

 

[blitzburgh]

They're similarly priced.

Drag strip ~ ZL1
Road course ~ ZL1
Street ~ ZL1
Street manners ~ Darkhorse
Price ~ Though a little more expensive ZL1

IMO The ZL1 is the full meal deal.
IMO The Darkhorse is a Hamburger combo that's missing the fries.

what's the ZL1 price compared to dark Horse with the 25k markup that you know is coming with it.

 

[WildHorse]

The GM C8 PCM was supposed to be locked also.

Well in all fairness, it's essentially a recycled C7 PCM.

I think FORD will allow only FORD PERFORMANCE 1/2/3 tunes for NA. Figure about a 3 fold increase in price for that. I also think they'll be the sole providers of FI tunes using Whipple superchargers sold through FORD performance.

 

[AZlb5.0]

Well in all fairness, it's essentially a recycled C7 PCM.

I think FORD will allow only FORD PERFORMANCE 1/2/3 tunes for NA. Figure about a 3 fold increase in price for that. I also think they'll be the sole providers of FI tunes using Whipple superchargers sold through FORD performance.

I get what you’re saying, but PCMs get cracked all the time. Unless Ford has an auto kill, meaning the car will need a new PCM if someone tries to crack it, I don’t think it’ll be impossible to crack. And we know the go fast game is expensive so paying 3X what it would normally cost it’ll the price we pay to go fast.

 

[WildHorse]

Unless Ford has an auto kill, meaning the car will need a new PCM if someone tries to crack it, I don’t think it’ll be impossible to crack.

Heard through the grapevine (reputable guys/gals) the s650 constantly 'phones home'. IF it detects a different strategy (cracked/piggyback/etc) in the PCM, it will lock down other modules forcing you to bring it in for service.

Guess we're gonna find out sooner rather than later how true that is.

 

[AZlb5.0]

Heard through the grapevine (reputable guys/gals) the s650 constantly 'phones home'. IF it detects a different strategy (cracked/piggyback/etc) in the PCM, it will lock down other modules forcing you to bring it in for service.

Guess we're gonna find out sooner rather than later how true that is.

Wow that would be a game changer. I’m honestly interested in what’s going to happen. Ours could go down the road much like the Dodge PCMs. Owners have to send theirs in for one that’s already cracked then a tune gets uploaded to their needs. Then there’s disabling the coms between your car and Ford and again that would have to disable your whole car for it to work correctly. I am in agreement that your point is right about price. I guess it’ll depend on what we are willing to pay to have tuned get done. All of this crap is being done to maintain cars CARB compliant.

 

[WildHorse]

Wow that would be a game changer.

And good fricken luck with forscan.

 

[MAGS1]

Wow that would be a game changer. I’m honestly interested in what’s going to happen. Ours could go down the road much like the Dodge PCMs. Owners have to send theirs in for one that’s already cracked then a tune gets uploaded to their needs. Then there’s disabling the coms between your car and Ford and again that would have to disable your whole car for it to work correctly. I am in agreement that your point is right about price. I guess it’ll depend on what we are willing to pay to have tuned get done. All of this crap is being done to maintain cars CARB compliant.

Yeah that’s the talk over on 7G, that it’s a fully networked vehicle. Hard to say how fully networked it really is until they start getting produced and into consumers hands but that’s the rumor. Wouldn’t surprise me if that’s the case though. Ford wants a bigger piece of the aftermarket apparently.

 

[AZlb5.0]

Yeah that’s the talk over on 7G, that it’s a fully networked vehicle. Hard to say how fully networked it really is until they start getting produced and into consumers hands but that’s the rumor. Wouldn’t surprise me if that’s the case though. Ford wants a bigger piece of the aftermarket apparently.

I mean I get it, not hating on Ford for wanting to make money. The good thing will be is that now you have a warranty with a 1K HP car. But like you said we will have to wait and see.

 

[Hack]

what's the ZL1 price compared to dark Horse with the 25k markup that you know is coming with it.

Sad but true - Ford will probably only make a few DH and they will be marked up by many dealers.

 

[Gregdd]

Every dark horse review shows a picture of your car on the giant dash screen. Why do you need that ? I might be out of touch. Has to be a reason for it ?

 

[newmoon]

I'm diehard Ford guy but I would agree given the choice between a ZL1 and Darkhorse at similar price I would go ZL1. Main reason the Darkhorse is basically an optioned out GT, and no Mustang GT should ever be near 70k, especially when only two years ago the base GT350 with handling package was 65k.

 

[jon.smith76063]

ZL1 is supercharged 650hp. apples to oranges, try again.

This.

Sponsored