What should be installed at the same time?

[PamAndJim]

I am planning on picking up an FRPP track pack sometime after the first of the year. I also plan to pick up the CB005 and probably some jacking rails and install those at the same time. I would prefer to knock everything out at the same time, even if it takes me longer to save up. So, what other parts do yall recommend installing at the same time? My car is a daily driver that enjoys some spirited back road driving, but will likely never be tracked. I'm more about straight line acceleration, soI don't really need to go "all out" on the suspension. I just want something that I can have some fun in. For the time being, I'll be on my stock wheels, on which I'll soon be putting some General g-max as-03s on. Once the suspension is done I'll start saving up for wheels and good summer tires.

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[Brazenbuck]

I'd be interested in other's response on this. My car is stock and I'm about to install

Steeda diff bushings, cradle lock outs, alignment dowels and subframe braces
DSS driveshaft and safety loop
Barton shifter
Resonator delete
FRPP track kit

 

[Rebellion]

I am planning on picking up an FRPP track pack sometime after the first of the year. I also plan to pick up the CB005 and probably some jacking rails and install those at the same time. I would prefer to knock everything out at the same time, even if it takes me longer to save up. So, what other parts do yall recommend installing at the same time? My car is a daily driver that enjoys some spirited back road driving, but will likely never be tracked. I'm more about straight line acceleration, soI don't really need to go "all out" on the suspension. I just want something that I can have some fun in. For the time being, I'll be on my stock wheels, on which I'll soon be putting some General g-max as-03s on. Once the suspension is done I'll start saving up for wheels and good summer tires.

I'd say, put them jacking rails first...it will make your job a ton easier! The jacking rails, apart from helping you install the rest of parts, help protect the car if you ever bottom out your suspension (which is a reality for a lowered car).

I would add the J&M alignment sleeves cut for the CB005, it takes no extra effort to put them when you install the CB005. I don't know if it adds any benefit, but I chose to get them done just for safety's sake.

I had the CB006, I think that's the PN, which is the 4 point brace. If you plan on using Kooks headers, you'll want the 2 point one. I really don't know much much handling does it add, but it's not expensive and easy to put on.

You can put the Ford racing cowl/k brace, which is also inexpensive and helps with handling. All of the above are NVH free.

The track pack needs some retainers on the front sway, I believe, that will keep the bar from displacing side to side. Kelly has mentioned that this missing part is their weakness. I think energy suspension offers a kit for that.

If you're up to it, you can add a set of vert links (I choose poly instead of delrin or bearing), it does help a bit with wheel hop...and maybe toe links (I'm not convinced of their benefit, except for the easy adjustment and eccentric bolt delete, so I kept the stock one).

I've done all of the above with different springs, except the sways and toe links. I'm not quite sure on the LCA bearing, it's quite a job to get them done and they're not cheap IMO. The same with Steeda UCA, which I like a lot, but it might end up being more trouble/expense that what's worth.

 

[ForTehNguyen]

Do CB005 rear lock out, diff bushing inserts, and rear springs at the same time so you only have to mess with the subframe bolts once

 

[IvanCRF]

Do CB005 rear lock out, diff bushing inserts, and rear springs at the same time so you only have to mess with the subframe bolts once

The CB005 is great. If he isn't bothered much by noise, I would recommend solid aluminum diff bushings just in case his diff bolts shear with the inserts. My diff bolt sheared with the inserts and I had to drop my cradle entirely so I made it bulletproof at that point to never drop the cradle again.

If he's buying the track pack, it comes with the toe bearing, and at that point he might as well press in upgraded LCA bearings while he's messing with a press.

 

[Rebellion]

Depends, mine was done with a ball joint press...there ain't no way in hell the LCA one is coming out with that. With a press to do the knuckle bearing, it requires you to remove the knuckle, which is a step I'd rather avoid.

 

[xXANCHORMONXx]

Don't touch the diff if you are sensitive to nvh

 

[Competition Orange]

has there been a good differential NVH recording? I'd like to get an idea of what it would bring.

 

[xXANCHORMONXx]

has there been a good differential NVH recording? I'd like to get an idea of what it would bring.

Nope. It will be noticeable on the highway

 

[IvanCRF]

has there been a good differential NVH recording? I'd like to get an idea of what it would bring.

Cruising at around 60mph, it sounds like a vacuum cleaner is running. There's only slightly more vibration. It's the sound that you will notice right away.

 

[PamAndJim]

OK, a few follow up notes/questions
I'll look into the alignment dowels. I believe Steeda has some also.
I don't think I'm going to do anything to the diff as my car is my DD. I'm fine with hsrhness, and vibrstion, but I know the noise would get old.
I'm a little confused by your comments regarding the LCA bearings. It sounds like it would be optional, but is there a part of the track pack install that requires a press? Based on the install video I watched, it looks like everything bolts up right out of the box.
Questions:
I can't seem to find any front sway bar retainers. Does anyone have a link?
Are there other sway bar options I should look into? I tried piecing together something that would include everything from the track pack and it would be way more expensive. But, I am open to other options.
I read last night that all (or at least some) of the hardware involved is designed to be one time use and that a hardware kit is needed when doing the install. Is that correct?
Should I invest in some camber bolts? Like I said, I'll never track the car, so I'm pretty sure I don't need plates.

 

[wildcatgoal]

Jacking rails should go on first - so you can jack the car up easily. I have Steeda's which are shorter in length not because it's a bad design, but because it allows accommodation of their IRS brace, which itself effectively extends the jacking rails with its own little lip that you can jack the car on. I have sat the car up on 4 jack stands on just the Steeda rail and have never had a single wobble. Whatever ones you get, they are extremely helpful. But if you just use a hockey puck on top of the jack slit to go over the pinch weld, you can skip them if you want (doesn't work on greatly lowered cars).

I recommend Steeda's alignment kit (delrin)... the other company's aluminum design does not sit well with me for this application nor is it even remotely necessary to center the IRS. Steeda makes a kit that works with BMR's CB005, if that is what you choose to go with.

Do not add differential bushing inserts from any manufacturer if you do not want to increase clunking or hear the differential operate, especially in tight slow turns. And especially if you have a manual and Torsen. If you can tolerate this, go for it - it helps power input feel more immediate but it's not really going to help you handle all that much better. Steeda's inserts are excellent and you have options of how stiff they are - I went with red (softest). The chatter about bolts breaking from these and the other options comes primarily from people not torquing them down properly, plus you can get higher grade bolts if you are worried.

All that said, LCA bearings are what I'd do after your jacking rail installation before installing ANYTHING else on the car. It makes the single largest noticeable difference of all the things I have installed on my car (see signature). It will also add minor NVH. Every time to add a bearing or a stiffer bushing, expect some NVH. Not much... some.

After you get the LCA in, the Ford track pack can go on. I do not feel like you need to spend money on either BMR or Steeda's "hop stopping stuff" like BMR's CB005 or Steeda's IRS brace until you have identified, after installing your LCA bearing and track package, improvements you want to make in relation to how you drive the car. Vertical links should probably be one of the last things you get. I recommend, when you do, Steeda's... again. I've had vertical links from three different companies. One of them poly - the poly failed on 3 of the 4 mounting points after one track day. One! The spherical option was nice, but was too harsh, especially with the LCA bearing and removing it eliminated a lot of noise. I have the Steeda vertical links now, which are big overbuilt delrin bushings, and it is perfect - very firm, but not harsh.

As for sway bar bushings/clams - the FRPP package apparently uses the ones you already have on the car.

 

[PamAndJim]

Thank you for the very thought response. I will definitely be installing the jacking rails. Right now I have one of those Harbor Freight cross beams for my jack. It essentially acts like a jacking rail that's attached to the jack instead of the car. I can have the car in the air on jack stands in a couple minutes. I love it, but it won't work if the car is lower. So, jacking rails will go on at the same time as the suspension.

As for the LCA bearings, am I understanding correctly, that I'd have to take the LCA off the car and have the bearings installed by someone with a press?
Is there any particular reason that you recommend doing the bearings over the cradle lockout? It seems that they're both mean to reduce wheel hop. It seems like the cradle lockout would be a more straightforward install.

 

[Bluemustang]

Thank you for the very thought response. I will definitely be installing the jacking rails. Right now I have one of those Harbor Freight cross beams for my jack. It essentially acts like a jacking rail that's attached to the jack instead of the car. I can have the car in the air on jack stands in a couple minutes. I love it, but it won't work if the car is lower. So, jacking rails will go on at the same time as the suspension.

As for the LCA bearings, am I understanding correctly, that I'd have to take the LCA off the car and have the bearings installed by someone with a press?
Is there any particular reason that you recommend doing the bearings over the cradle lockout? It seems that they're both mean to reduce wheel hop. It seems like the cradle lockout would be a more straightforward install.

Two different purposes. Cradle lockout is for the subframe. Both will help the wheelhop. I would definitely do the cradle lockout. The subframe moving around is the biggest issue in the IRS IMO from hearing other people's posts on here. When you focus on it, you can actually feel the subframe moving around even in DD situations. It leads to unpredictable handling situations as well as a feeling of the front and rear feeling disconnected from each other. After I had mine installed it felt completely different and more connected on acceleration and cornering.

I haven't done the LCA bearing but my wheel hop is gone. The other mods I've done have probably contributed to ridding the hop. The two just serve different purposes. But the Cradle lockout kit is probably the cheapest and easiest way to make the front and rear of the car to feel more connected to each other. The best bang for your buck IRS mod.

 

[wildcatgoal]

Thank you for the very thought response. I will definitely be installing the jacking rails. Right now I have one of those Harbor Freight cross beams for my jack. It essentially acts like a jacking rail that's attached to the jack instead of the car. I can have the car in the air on jack stands in a couple minutes. I love it, but it won't work if the car is lower. So, jacking rails will go on at the same time as the suspension.

As for the LCA bearings, am I understanding correctly, that I'd have to take the LCA off the car and have the bearings installed by someone with a press?
Is there any particular reason that you recommend doing the bearings over the cradle lockout? It seems that they're both mean to reduce wheel hop. It seems like the cradle lockout would be a more straightforward install.

Yes, you have to remove the LCA. Not particularly easy but not rocket science - just be patient. It's time consuming and a lot of bolts to torque back together, but it's how the PP GT should have come. Almost anything else you can slap onto the IRS is easier to install, but none will offer as big of a reward, IMHO. May be worth paying a performance alignment/suspension shop to do it for you.

From what I've learned and experienced, the LCA bearing alleviates (at the source) the most detrimental defect of this IRS - slop it is actual operation (articulation), not its connection to the car itself. After installing the LCA bearing, you can decide from there to add on parts to target solutions you, in your world, need to address. If you install it after, you (1) have to take most of that stuff of just to do the installation and (2) may go too far with NVH or stiffness or for other reasons.

Listen man, talk to the manufacturers and ask them the purpose of their design and why it works. They'll say they're better than the "other guy", of course, but you get to ask the tough questions and, in the end, you are the driver and you choose where and how to drive. I'm happiest with Steeda. Plenty of people happy with BMR. This forum has lots of wrong answers, but you'd never know. They are more expert than most anyone on this forum, including me.

As eluded to above by [MENTION=19599]Bluemustang[/MENTION], BMR's CB005 and an LCA bearing have different affects on the IRS. There are a lot claims that make each company's IRS parts out to be better than they are and claims saying they didn't have the effect they expected (their expectations based upon the fact others said they were so amazingly awesome-sauce and made them the best driver ever... nope). But universally, after someone installs an LCA bearing, they start proclaiming how the car has improved and changed... factually (because this isn't some "shore it up part", it's a replacement). UNIVERSALLY this happens. Lots of people like the CB005, lots of people like Steeda's solutions (like me). But... everyone who has one likes what the LCA bearing does. So that's why I say... start there.

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