S550 underwelming...

[Nagare]

I would say the dayz of the high rpm, high compression V8’s are numbered. The 2023 models will officially usher in the new era of hybrid power with awd. Around 2030 highways around metro areas will start using auto driving (taking control of vehicle) to more efficiently and safely move traffic around the city. Good times ahead...? Lol.

That's a great dream but with how much our current infrastructure is lacking on maintenance, I don't see it happening near that quickly!

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[Norm Peterson]

Ok guys. Just to show you I have a heart. That I have compassion for you - here is a vid pretty much confirming what you all said. He even takes a swipe at V6 Mustangs (like he’s been reading stuff here...).

I really would rather have a V6 Mustang (got to be a 6MT, though) that's maybe a 5 seconds to 60 on a good day than that 3.x second Tesla. 300 HP is enough to have fun with on a road course if the chassis is up to it, enough to challenge me to be on my A-game.

What scares me now that it's occurred to me is a future is filled with sub 4-second to 60 cars whose drivers have (on average) even lower skills than they do today.


Norm

 

[BmacIL]

That's a great dream but with how much our current infrastructure is lacking on maintenance, I don't see it happening near that quickly!

This. Anyone close to it knows that we're very, very far away from anything close to level 4 autonomy. There are so many difficult and expensive things that need to be implemented from the infrastructure aspect, as well as significant regulatory hurdles that are required to be settled. That's all outside of the recognition and decision-making software/hardware that's 10+ years out from even being commercially viable (inexpensive enough to be sold).

 

[Norm Peterson]

Still, the real measure of you and your car or any car is 'flat out competition.' ie street or drag......
Until you can outrun someone on the street and leave them, you don't know what
performance is.

Sorry, I can't agree with that at all, and it's not coming from any PC position on street racing.

You certainly do know what performance is on a hot lap even in just an HPDE environment when you're either foot-to-the-floor down the straights, hard on the brakes from above 120 mph within 500 feet of a 65 mph corner, or well beyond 1g in that corner. After 20 minutes at a time where you're rarely below 80% of the car's capabilities (or your own) in any direction, times four sessions, there just isn't anything left to prove on the street.


Norm

 

[sdiver68]

Someone is going to have to prove to me they and their car will outrun and out handle mine........

Many of us have been there. I just hope you realize that anyone with real skills will wait for you to come to the track.

 

[Fatguy]

Norm[/QUOTE]

I really would rather have a V6 Mustang (got to be a 6MT, though) that's maybe a 5 seconds to 60 on a good day than that 3.x second Tesla. 300 HP is enough to have fun with on a road course if the chassis is up to it, enough to challenge me to be on my A-game.

What scares me now that it's occurred to me is a future is filled with sub 4-second to 60 cars whose drivers have (on average) even lower skills than they do today.


Norm

If you watch the vid I posted above he actually tries flooring it in a corner and the traction control never makes the car lose control so it’s safe for the public but boring for the enthusiast. And actually the car is a 3.2 second 0-60 car done in a scientific way. They then dropped it to 3.12 going to lighter and smaller 18” wheels. They then tried tried going to 17” but at one end the brakes would not clear so they wanted a 17” and 18” combo that just would look weird and that was that...

As for the V6 stuff I find it amazing that the V6 Mustang is still the whipping boy of the automotive world even though it is extinct. I’m keeping mine even though it was basically a business ride that replaced the Hyundai Elantra I was supposed to get. But man the negativity! So I’m staying here in V6 land as my fellow V6 owners need a real had ass looking out for them.


For what it’s worth Norm I spent 140 grand on a film we finished and premiering next month at this big lavish 400 seat theater in Toronto. That’s just one thing I do with my cash. There is more to life than cars. But I just could not think about driving an Elantra as my DD, so the V6 Mustang was bought and so far so good...

 

[BrettT]

Like this?

Great ad. Looks like it probably would have got banned anywhere else...…..

 

[Norm Peterson]

If you watch the vid I posted above he actually tries flooring it in a corner and the traction control never makes the car lose control so it’s safe for the public but boring for the enthusiast. And actually the car is a 3.2 second 0-60 car done in a scientific way. They then dropped it to 3.12 going to lighter and smaller 18” wheels.

Let's not argue about tenths of a second, when as far as I'm concerned it could run low-twos and I'd still pick the V6/6MT Mustang. Nor can I get on board with any notion that band-aiding cars that are way overpowered relative to their buyers skill level with nannies is entirely a good thing. Indirectly teaching people that throttle modulation is neither a necessary nor a desirable skill is just plain wrong.


Norm

 

[BrettT]

I think this entire discussion could apply to any car today compared to the same car made 20-30 years ago.

I had a 1987 VW Jetta (MkII), it weighed 2,000 lbs, and was light and nimble. With a 5 speed, it was fun to drive. My 2006 Jetta (MkV) weighs over 3,200lbs. Which car would you rather drive on a daily basis? No contest. It's the nature of the automotive industry. To take 500lbs or more out of the car would result in two possibilities. 1. the car is stripped of comfort and quality. It other words it would result in cheap plastics, less or no sound deadening, and buyers would look at it and say what a P.O.S. or 2. It would have to be made with more exotic materials, like aluminium, titanium, carbon fibre etc... which would result in a price increase of likely $5-10K per car, and while a small % of buyers would be happy and pay it, the majority of buyers would say it was overpriced and go buy a BMW or Merc, and then complain at how "fat" they are....

You can't have you cake and eat it..... Modern cars give up the lightness and agile feeling of cars from 20 years ago, but they give you much more in return.....

I have not owned a previous Mustang, won't buy a car that doesn't have independent rear suspension, but, all I can say is, there is nothing underwhelming about my MY19 Bullitt. Quite the opposite, I have to constantly restrain myself.....and just save myself for the road trips into the mountains......where I can fully enjoy the car....

 

[2018OFPP1?2]

What scares me now that it's occurred to me is a future is filled with sub 4-second to 60 cars whose drivers have (on average) even lower skills than they do today.


Norm

This. Exactly this.

 

[Norm Peterson]

You can't have you cake and eat it..... Modern cars give up the lightness and agile feeling of cars from 20 years ago, but they give you much more in return.....

It's not 'more' if you don't want it.


Norm

 

[IronG]

Norm

If you watch the vid I posted above he actually tries flooring it in a corner and the traction control never makes the car lose control so it’s safe for the public but boring for the enthusiast. And actually the car is a 3.2 second 0-60 car done in a scientific way. They then dropped it to 3.12 going to lighter and smaller 18” wheels. They then tried tried going to 17” but at one end the brakes would not clear so they wanted a 17” and 18” combo that just would look weird and that was that...

As for the V6 stuff I find it amazing that the V6 Mustang is still the whipping boy of the automotive world even though it is extinct. I’m keeping mine even though it was basically a business ride that replaced the Hyundai Elantra I was supposed to get. But man the negativity! So I’m staying here in V6 land as my fellow V6 owners need a real had ass looking out for them.


For what it’s worth Norm I spent 140 grand on a film we finished and premiering next month at this big lavish 400 seat theater in Toronto. That’s just one thing I do with my cash. There is more to life than cars. But I just could not think about driving an Elantra as my DD, so the V6 Mustang was bought and so far so good...[/QUOTE]

I really think you need to find a new hobby :-). Schlepping EV future on a Mustang forum is like telling BBQ ribs joints to sell shawarma. It just does not matter here. I also agree with Norm earlier on comparing tech. Sure advancements in tech make things faster and "better" but that does not mean everyone will care about it. It is like comparing an SSD to a HD, sure one is faster, but that does not mean it fits every type of use. EV's in general in a straight line are faster, no argument, but the flaws they have are numerous. I have no doubt over time the flaws will decrease. My personal opinion is that if I lived in a city in a warm climate I would have one as my DD. I still would want to have a dino powered car for fun. To date, I have not seen a EV that I would even bother with using for fun. Even the supercar models are fairly lifeless...fast hell yeah, but just no soul. They need to figure out how to get a soul into them at least for me to want one.

Not sure what the comment was for with the 140k film, but I spend yearly 40 plus million on PC equipment for a 160k person company. And that is just one line item. Now if you are saying the 140k came out of your pocket to produce the film, that would be a different story. What is the film about anyway?

Lastly, I like your persistence, but I think you should really find another forum, this one does not seem to be for you.

 

[Fatguy]

If you watch the vid I posted above he actually tries flooring it in a corner and the traction control never makes the car lose control so it’s safe for the public but boring for the enthusiast. And actually the car is a 3.2 second 0-60 car done in a scientific way. They then dropped it to 3.12 going to lighter and smaller 18” wheels. They then tried tried going to 17” but at one end the brakes would not clear so they wanted a 17” and 18” combo that just would look weird and that was that...

As for the V6 stuff I find it amazing that the V6 Mustang is still the whipping boy of the automotive world even though it is extinct. I’m keeping mine even though it was basically a business ride that replaced the Hyundai Elantra I was supposed to get. But man the negativity! So I’m staying here in V6 land as my fellow V6 owners need a real had ass looking out for them.


For what it’s worth Norm I spent 140 grand on a film we finished and premiering next month at this big lavish 400 seat theater in Toronto. That’s just one thing I do with my cash. There is more to life than cars. But I just could not think about driving an Elantra as my DD, so the V6 Mustang was bought and so far so good...

I really think you need to find a new hobby :-). Schlepping EV future on a Mustang forum is like telling BBQ ribs joints to sell shawarma. It just does not matter here. I also agree with Norm earlier on comparing tech. Sure advancements in tech make things faster and "better" but that does not mean everyone will care about it. It is like comparing an SSD to a HD, sure one is faster, but that does not mean it fits every type of use. EV's in general in a straight line are faster, no argument, but the flaws they have are numerous. I have no doubt over time the flaws will decrease. My personal opinion is that if I lived in a city in a warm climate I would have one as my DD. I still would want to have a dino powered car for fun. To date, I have not seen a EV that I would even bother with using for fun. Even the supercar models are fairly lifeless...fast hell yeah, but just no soul. They need to figure out how to get a soul into them at least for me to want one.

Not sure what the comment was for with the 140k film, but I spend yearly 40 plus million on PC equipment for a 160k person company. And that is just one line item. Now if you are saying the 140k came out of your pocket to produce the film, that would be a different story. What is the film about anyway?

Lastly, I like your persistence, but I think you should really find another forum, this one does not seem to be for you.

The comment was just to show that cars are not the be all and end all of our lives. You compromise if you have other things going on...

On this forum whether you like it or not, you are evaluated by the model of car you drive. Like your self-worth is just what model car you drive. Inject some other part of your life into the mix and you deconstruct a shallow commercialized part of this website. I say “part” because there are genuine enthusiastic members doing interesting things.


On a writing forum you are evaluated by whether you were published by a legitimate publisher. On a filmmaking forum you are evaluated by the festivals you got into like Sundance where we get the word in early December. On and on but inject the fact that the people at the website are more than one dimensional beings - you make it harder to stereotype people based on a single metric. And that was what I was getting at.

As for Norm I should tell you it is now confirmed that the Tesla Roadster will come with cold air thrusters as an option. You could modify it so pulling back on the stick rockets you forward and pulling forward stops you. Pulling to the left fires rockets on the right to help you take the corner better and the same pulling to the right. Keep an open mind Norm. I expect to pass by your local track and see you teaching the kids of “the art” of rocket technology in dropping track times!


Could happen Norm... Could happen!

 

[Fatguy]

Not sure what the comment was for with the 140k film, but I spend yearly 40 plus million on PC equipment for a 160k person company. And that is just one line item. Now if you are saying the 140k came out of your pocket to produce the film, that would be a different story. What is the film about anyway?

Lastly, I like your persistence, but I think you should really find another forum, this one does not seem to be for you.

Almost had me going there but I deleted it. Trust me I am working tirelessly for everyone here despite the car stuff. Let’s keep it at that. 140 grand was my own cash BTW. I good man...

 

[SpeedLu]

The BRZ with a small amount of boost is a riot. A friend has one on 7 lbs and it's exactly what the car should've been: completely on rails handling, perfect driving position and controls, but enough poke to be exciting too. That car needs somewhere between 250-270 hp and 220-250 ft lbs from the showroom and it'd be one of the best cars you can buy if you like driving. Light boost gets it there, and it'd be worth a $4-6k cost hit to get it with a warranty.

I agree, a little boost would make the BRZ the perfect little track car, but then the price point would be a lot higher.

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