PSS or non-R SC2 for wet track day

[matthewr87]

Looks like the first of my two days at VIR is going to be a wet one. Should I use my 4000 mile and 3 track event-worn PSS, or my brand spanking new non-R SC2? I have read that they have the same wet rating but I was wondering if anyone had direct experience comparing the two. Thanks.

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[Davesvt2000]

Last month I was at Charlotte motor speedway for a two day event, and the first day was a steady light rain.

I still went out on new PSC2’s, and they were surprisingly fine, but obviously running at a much lower speed than if it were dry out.

that day was more about learning the line on the wet, and re familiarizing myself with the roval, as it had been a few years since I had been there.

 

[03reptile]

I've got the non-R Cup 2's on my 2019 GT350. They are respectable in wet conditions. I was pleasantly surprised at their adhesion abilities when caught in rain. I'd bet the PSS tires that came on your car would be okay for your track application. I've never used the PSS tires, so it's just spit-balling from my perspective. The non-R Cup 2's are great in hot weather but at this time of year, I'm not sure they would be that much of an improvement over the PSS's.

 

[honeybadger]

Cup2s are very grippy in the rain UNTIL they can't dissipate water fast enough. If the track is damp or lightly raining, Cup2s are good. If you think it'll rain fairly heavily, I'd bring something with more tread depth.

 

[pilotgore]

Looks like the first of my two days at VIR is going to be a wet one. Should I use my 4000 mile and 3 track event-worn PSS, or my brand spanking new non-R SC2? I have read that they have the same wet rating but I was wondering if anyone had direct experience comparing the two. Thanks.

Depending on how the tread looks on the PSS's, I'd take those over the cups if you're expecting more than a sprinkle or very light rain. I've run the cups in rain 3 times, and each time I wished I had PS4's or SS's. While light rain doesn't seem to effect my traction at all, anything heavier than that and my traction completely disappears rapidly while on the racing line. I've learned to either drive the wet line with cups, or just use one of my other cars for a wet track day (one has SS's and the other PS4's). Under dry conditions I can take turn 1 at my home track around 100mph, with light-moderate rain I cant go over 55 without starting to slide. Other GT350's Ive run with seem to have zero issues with traction using the SS's in heavy rain. . . meanwhile I'm slipping and sliding all over the place getting passed by Honda civics.

I guess my thought process is, PSS's you'll sacrifice a second in lap time during dry conditions vs Cups, but wet conditions you might be 10-15 seconds faster and have more confidence in your traction.

If you do decide to run the Cups in decent rain, just remember to keep the tire pressures up from the onset as you'll have trouble getting heat into the tires. Run in sport instead of track mode. At the first sign of diminished traction, drive the wet line or be prepared to get off track.

Hope this helps.

 

[NoXiDe]

I'm glad this topic came up because it brought light to my plans as I'll be tracking in the future. I bought SV701 and wrapped them with Non-R Cup Tires. From this thread, it sounds like my "winter" set wheels should be installed if the forecast shows rain as the tire depth on those tires are in the 6-8/32s. This is if I want to go over 55 mph on a turn while on the track and also in the rain.

@OP, it sounds like it's a coin flip. If those are recently new non-r and the features, sipes, and groves are not worn out than my recommendation would be the non-r cup tires if your having to choose between worn out pss and non-r cup tires. It also sounds like it will be a "get to know the track" kind of day.@BillyJRacing , any advice you can share would be appreciated.

 

[oldbmwfan]

I'm glad this topic came up because it brought light to my plans as I'll be tracking in the future. I bought SV701 and wrapped them with Non-R Cup Tires. From this thread, it sounds like my "winter" set wheels should be installed if the forecast shows rain as the tire depth on those tires are in the 6-8/32s. This is if I want to go over 55 mph on a turn while on the track and also in the rain.

@OP, it sounds like it's a coin flip. If those are recently new non-r and the features, sipes, and groves are not worn out than my recommendation would be the non-r cup tires if your having to choose between worn out pss and non-r cup tires. It also sounds like it will be a "get to know the track" kind of day.@BillyJRacing , any advice you can share would be appreciated.

Correct. As the guys said above, the Cup2 will grip wet pavement quite well, but it sucks for evacuating water (no lateral grooves and shallow tread depth overall = hydroplanes easily in any standing water). Light rain or damp road or track and temps >45F and the Cup2 are fine. Heavy rain or puddles, you're screwed. For track use, if it's cold and wet, you're similarly screwed - the tires do require some heat to grip, and cold, wet pavement will prevent that heat buildup.

On a fairly wet day at Mid-Ohio, which is especially slick in the rain, I went faster on PSS than on Cup 2s.

 

[NoXiDe]

Awesome, I think I'm dumping the Nitto 555 G2 on my winter set and going with 4S (replacement for PSS) in the future. I appreciate the feedback.

 

[matthewr87]

Alright thanks guys. Looks like a chance of some showers for now with a temp around 15 C (60F). If it turns out to be wet I'll stick with the PSS and save the SC2s for the Saturday.

 

[BillyJRacing]

The bespoke GT350 Cup 2 has better wet grip than the bespoke PSS it replaces.

As others have said, the PSS has better hydroplaning resistance in deep water than the 350Cup 2, but depending on how worn your PSSs are from those track days, the 350Cup 2 may be your better bet.

Post a pic of the condition of your PSS.

 

[L8APEX]

The bespoke GT350 Cup 2 has better wet grip than the bespoke PSS it replaces.

As others have said, the PSS has better hydroplaning resistance in deep water than the 350Cup 2, but depending on how worn your PSSs are from those track days, the 350Cup 2 may be your better bet.

Post a pic of the condition of your PSS.

Billy, if all I cared about was lap times....which tires would be faster? The bespoke GT350 cup 2s or Advan A052 or RE71Rs or R888Rs? The reason I ask is I am allowed to run any 180TW+ tire in the class of time attack I am doing. There is a tire contingency if I select the R888Rs and it is exempted from the 180TW+ rule. I would be running 19x11 Apex rims.

 

[matthewr87]

The bespoke GT350 Cup 2 has better wet grip than the bespoke PSS it replaces.

As others have said, the PSS has better hydroplaning resistance in deep water than the 350Cup 2, but depending on how worn your PSSs are from those track days, the 350Cup 2 may be your better bet.

Post a pic of the condition of your PSS.

Here are some pics. PSS are still in good shape I think. I have never been to VIR so I do not know if there is a tendency for puddles to build up.

 

[BillyJRacing]

Billy, if all I cared about was lap times....which tires would be faster? The bespoke GT350 cup 2s or Advan A052 or RE71Rs or R888Rs? The reason I ask is I am allowed to run any 180TW+ tire in the class of time attack I am doing. There is a tire contingency if I select the R888Rs and it is exempted from the 180TW+ rule. I would be running 19x11 Apex rims.

That's tough and will "Depend". The RE71R is very fast when it's cool. They overheat quickly and do not do well when they get hot. So hot days they are greasy and not very fast.

The Cup 2 tends to be quicker on east coast tracks than west coast tracks (i'm not sure if it has to do with the general asphalt composition, and they're all probably greatly different but it seems to be a general theme.

I have a new set of A052s that i'm about to try for the first time and those seem to be pretty impressive. I'm looking forward to testing them.

The GT350 Cup 2 is not as fast as the GT350R Cup 2. If I had to guess, the 3 competitors you listed MIGHT be a little quicker than the 350Cup2 (except the 71R on a hot day).

Here are some pics. PSS are still in good shape I think. I have never been to VIR so I do not know if there is a tendency for puddles to build up.

"rivers" do tend to form across the track.

Those have enough tread left where they would probably still outperform the 350Cup2 in deep water. Since VIR does not drain that quickly and because you have never been to VIR, that may be the safer bet.

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