Prices are on the rise......

[ecoboost321]

There’s no way to get all the safety crap and batteries packaged in a 4-seat car based on an Explorer chassis under 4K pounds, unless Ford somehow is partnering with the UFOs circling our Navy warships.

Let’s face it...
Coyote + Electrification = weight
Total Electrification = weight
V6TT + Electrification = weight

There’s no way to avoid it... a Taycan Turbo S is 2370kg. A Tesla Model 3 is 4031 pounds. Anything will be heavier than a GT350, and thus will have increased consumables. The. You have to worry about trackability after that.

My 2018 Tesla model 3 LR rear wheel drive (discontinued model) weighs about the same as my GT350R, and has better weight balance (47/53) and way lower center of gravity.

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[PP0001]

It could happen especially with Farley at the helm, a real car guy, I could see them investigating the idea of bringing the Thunderbird back and making it the corvette competitor that the gen 1 was.

I’m curious Harry, what were your thoughts on the Hagerty piece? As a journalist there were some errors in it when laying out the general information about the cars—19R upgrades for instance, the article made the argument that 2020 R car got “the chassis upgrades” that the 19 base cars received which isn’t accurate as it had different upgrades that were R related and the 19R did receive a ABS calibration and new upgrades servos and electronics vs 15-18Rs—blame the fact that this is relatively unknown to Ford marketing bungled that one favoring your keep the focus on the revamped 2019 base upgrades; the article assumed the final number of the fleet which currently we still do not have the final numbers—we can approximate but we don’t know the final. I also found it interesting that they counted the production number as a combined total number of 350/350R production to say the fleet was larger than a previous generation GT500, which is odd because all GT500s were all the same car—GT350/GT350R vehicles are separated by enough variance that insurance agencies count them differently and even in Hagerty’s own data they showed that they did have two categories R & Non-R.

I did think it was good to see a snapshot of one agencies data of the vehicles which is valuable in where their internal data is showing a trends in collectability. It wasn’t a perfect article based on the facts of the vehicle, in my opinion, but that breakdown of data was extremely important to prove that a trend exists and it validate things like this thread, in that even agencies are seeing this car as an instant classic.

Brett, I totally agree that bringing back the Thunderbird is a strong possibility and personally I would like to see that happen once again.

Having said that we all saw the direction that Ford took with 11th generation 2 seat Thunderbird starting in 2002 and it was a very disappointing effort at least from my standpoint.

I thought that Ford did a great job on the styling of the 11th Gen Thunderbird but the 240 C.I. V8 engine and 5 speed automatic was really a big let down as that car could have been something really special.

Could a 12th generation Thunderbird be on the horizon, I personally hope so but to suggest that it could compete with the C8 Corvette would be difficult to imagine but then again we all know how much blue blood flows through Jim Farley's veins therefore if there is a chance it will be with Jim Farley at the helm.

Regarding the Hagerty article on the 2nd generation GT350/R's I suggest that their intent was good but as you mentioned their attention to accurate detail was not good as there were just too many errors especially when it came to overall production numbers.

In addition I am not sure that the journalist even knows that a Base R Model even exists over a 4-year production run and if he did I wonder why he would not comment on their collectability or lack thereof?

Obviously I am not a journalist such as yourself but being an avid automotive enthusiast especially when centered around these outstanding GT350/R's I expect accurate and proper information from the likes of the Hagerty Team and hope that you agree with my comments?

Although I appreciated and agreed with their intent Hagerty needed to do a much better job of providing you and I with accurate and more detailed information.

 

[Wildcardfox]

Brett, I totally agree that bringing back the Thunderbird is a strong possibility and personally I would like to see that happen once again.

Having said that we all saw the direction that Ford took with 11th generation 2 seat Thunderbird starting in 2002 and it was a very disappointing effort at least from my standpoint.

I thought that Ford did a great job on the styling of the 11th Gen Thunderbird but the 240 C.I. V8 engine and 5 speed automatic was really a big let down as that car could have been something really special.

Could a 12th generation Thunderbird be on the horizon, I personally hope so but to suggest that it could compete with the C8 Corvette would be difficult to imagine but then again we all know how much blue blood flows through Jim Farley's veins therefore if there is a chance it will be with Jim Farley at the helm.

Regarding the Hagerty article on the 2nd generation GT350/R's I suggest that their intent was good but as you mentioned their attention to accurate detail was not good as there were just too many errors especially when it came to overall production numbers.

In addition I am not sure that the journalist even knows that a Base R Model even exists over a 4-year production run and if he did I wonder why he would not comment on their collectability or lack thereof?

Obviously I am not a journalist such as yourself but being an avid automotive enthusiast especially when centered around these outstanding GT350/R's I expect accurate and proper information from the likes of the Hagerty Team and hope that you agree with my comments?

Although I appreciated and agreed with their intent Hagerty needed to do a much better job of providing you and I with accurate and more detailed information.

Camilo Pardo was one of the lead designers on the 2002 Thunderbird. He is most famous for being the lead designer on the 2005-2006 Ford GT. He talked about how the Thunderbird concept was designed over in Italy at the Ghia. He said regarding the production version as being more “light rain” than a Thunderbird as the original concept had been diluted. I love that quote— “light rain “.

I totally agree based on the Hagerty article. Some more thorough information would’ve made it more of an authority piece. I think it was good to see their data, but it needed to be more specific and more detailed and more accurate to really analyze the data correctly, in my opinion. And just like how you mentioned the bass cars were absent from the analyzation, I myself didn’t even realize that so you saw another error. There was also qualification that the author made about the engine being the highest horsepower for a naturally aspirated engine that forces ever put in the car but then he had parentheses where he qualified that suggesting that Ford has a newer version that’s even higher horsepower in a naturally aspirated engine which doesn’t make sense because no engine exist currently from Ford, so there were some suspect claims and it’s an article that is meaning to be a roadmap for future collectors. So there were some dubious choices in the article.

 

[stanglife]

Most people never looked at Mustang and Corvette as direct competition... really, except for a couple supercars, Ford never really tried to compete with that. The weight was always a big deal there. I'd be surprised if they started now. I think their efforts are best spent on improving their best-selling pony car. I still don't like the "Mustang" Mach-E naming but as time passes, it seems more and more genius.

 

[PP0001]

Most people never looked at Mustang and Corvette as direct competition... really, except for a couple supercars, Ford never really tried to compete with that. The weight was always a big deal there. I'd be surprised if they started now. I think their efforts are best spent on improving their best-selling pony car. I still don't like the "Mustang" Mach-E naming but as time passes, it seems more and more genius.

On board with all your comments but will never agree that the Mustang name plate should ever be associated with an all wheel drive SUV.

Aside from not liking the use of the Mustang name being associated with the Mach-E there is no doubt that it is a very good vehicle and suggest that the launch and the timing of the Mach-E was genius as you mentioned and feel much the same about the launch of the new Bronco.

 

[Wildcardfox]

Most people never looked at Mustang and Corvette as direct competition... really, except for a couple supercars, Ford never really tried to compete with that. The weight was always a big deal there. I'd be surprised if they started now. I think their efforts are best spent on improving their best-selling pony car. I still don't like the "Mustang" Mach-E naming but as time passes, it seems more and more genius.

Most people but they raced against each other for years. I love this Triumph ad from a Riverside International Raceway race program.

I’m going to frame that. Triumph had balls to really REALLY rub in a win.

 

[brokenblinker]

As someone that's been shopping for a GT350 for the past few months, I'm on the opposite end of many here hoping prices will fall a bit. They at least seem to be plateauing a bit, i guess we'll find out soon if they actually start dropping again.

 

[72&18]

As someone that's been shopping for a GT350 for the past few months, I'm on the opposite end of many here hoping prices will fall a bit. They at least seem to be plateauing a bit, i guess we'll find out soon if they actually start dropping again.

Curious as to your data source.

 

[brokenblinker]

Definitely a subset. This is just the CarGurus price trends page.

 

[PP0001]

Speaking of prices that are on the rise, I was in the S.E. USA a couple weeks ago and inquired about purchasing this 2016 GT350R that is a 1 of 1 and the only factory 4 seat R model that the FRAP had assembled over the 6 year run.

Unfortunately this car was not for sale and we never even got to discuss pricing but was told that I was first on the list if and when it ever goes up for sale.

In addition to the rear seats this vehicle also comes with Blue stitching and Blue highlights in the front seating area.

When the owner took delivery of this vehicle in the Fall of 2015 he brought me into his office and showed me the paperwork from Dearborn whereby it was all made out to Jay Leno in error based on a foregone conclusion that Jay was going to be the high bidder on this 1 of a kind Ford auction/charity car.

 

[72&18]

Speaking of prices that are on the rise, I was in the S.E. USA a couple weeks ago and inquired about purchasing this 2016 GT350R that is a 1 of 1 and the only factory 4 seat R model that the FRAP had assembled over the 6 year run.

Unfortunately this car was not for sale and we never even got to discuss pricing but was told that I was first on the list if and when it ever goes up for sale.

In addition to the rear seats this vehicle also comes with Blue stitching and Blue highlights in the front seating area.

When the owner took delivery of this vehicle in the Fall of 2016 he brought me into his office and showed me the paperwork from Dearborn whereby it was all made out to Jay Leno in error based on a foregone conclusion that Jay was going to be the high bidder on this 1 of a kind Ford auction/charity car.

Very cool. I am curious if it had no pin striping since it already had blue over the roof stripes. I know the red stitching on the R's also had red pin striping on the outside of the stripes.

 

[PP0001]

Very cool. I am curious if it had no pin striping since it already had blue over the roof stripes. I know the red stitching on the R's also had red pin striping on the outside of the stripes.

Yes, the Red badge in the grill is there along with the Red pin striping is also on this car.

A few of his other cars are LR009 which is a 2020 GT350R HEP car and also a couple of Ford GT's that just happen to be built as Heritage Edition cars from 2006 and 2020.

Based on my understanding there is only one other person in the world who owns both a 2006 and 2020 Ford GT that were built as Heritage Edition cars.

 

[Hack]

There’s no way to get all the safety crap and batteries packaged in a 4-seat car based on an Explorer chassis under 4K pounds, unless Ford somehow is partnering with the UFOs circling our Navy warships.

Let’s face it...
Coyote + Electrification = weight
Total Electrification = weight
V6TT + Electrification = weight

There’s no way to avoid it... a Taycan Turbo S is 2370kg. A Tesla Model 3 is 4031 pounds. Anything will be heavier than a GT350, and thus will have increased consumables. The. You have to worry about trackability after that.

I agree. You are 100% right. And I'm not interested in any of those things unless batteries get worlds better. I'm extremely unlikely to buy a car with that stuff on it just due to the weight. Heck, I ruled out the Mach 1 as a buy it new car because it has direct injection. I don't like that technology. I think it pollutes too much and exemplifies some of the issues with the "ECO" movement.

We all like big V8s. We all know they are going bye bye. The transition will be a hybrid platform with electric to satisfy government imposed regulations, but will also allow the use of the petrol fueled engine for performance.

The Europeans have been using this technique for years now. Its viable and a bridge until full electrification becomes feasible. Total electric systems, as they are right now, are not practical for all applications.

The big V8 may be on the way out, but if you incorporate a lighter S650 chassis and hybrid technology, it will most likely kick the crap out of what the GT350R can do and probably the GT500 as well.

I won't buy a hybrid Mustang. I don't care how fast it is. Fast isn't the top thing that sells me on a car. I was never interested in the GT500 either. Certain things I just don't like.

If the automotive manufacturers stop making big NA V8s, they might never get another new car sale from me. I'm just one guy but I'm sure there are a lot of people who feel this way. I can get by with cars already built and in the marketplace.

Ford just designed a brand new 7.3 liter pushrod V8 and they are selling a ton of them. It's just silly to think a V8 in a Mustang pollutes more than that 7.3 in a big pickup.

 

[PP0001]

Very cool. I am curious if it had no pin striping since it already had blue over the roof stripes. I know the red stitching on the R's also had red pin striping on the outside of the stripes.

In the same showroom is this sexy looking 2018 50th Anniversary Mustang Cobra Jet chassis #45.

Built at the FRAP and then shipped to Watson Racing for race modifications/weight lightning and then sent back to the FRAP for final paint and decals these 5.2L Coyote powered Cobra Jet Mustangs are not only extremely fast with quarter mile times coming in at ~8 seconds at ~155 MPH but they also look terrific in Race Red.

With just 68 examples built I suggest that these 50th Anniversary 2018 Mustang Cobra Jet racecars will not only hold their value but increase in value going forward.

 

[CANTWN4LSN]

Speaking of prices that are on the rise, I was in the S.E. USA a couple weeks ago and inquired about purchasing this 2016 GT350R that is a 1 of 1 and the only factory 4 seat R model that the FRAP had assembled over the 6 year run.

Unfortunately this car was not for sale and we never even got to discuss pricing but was told that I was first on the list if and when it ever goes up for sale.]


Thought you recently stated you were moving and unloading several of your cars. Change of heart? Too much temptation?

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