[poll] Auto or Manual next gen?

[Dinosoar]

Yeah, my only point was that these current auto trannys (DCT, or automated clutches, especially with 7+ gears) are just faster. I ain't saying they are more or less fun. I think that's almost like choosing a color; it's just what one likes. For me, I do love three pedal cars and heel-toe down shifting. However, what I love more is the blending, at the limit, acceleration, turning and braking to get the fastest speed out of the car. So, for me, the auto trans is less of a compromise. My focus is on the tires more than anything; that's what I enjoy most.

I would also suggest, at least at the track while driving near the limit, autos are safer. One of the most critical moments of road racing (or HPDE) is the braking zone. Add the down shifting, and mistakes happen more easily. But again, there is an "old school" fun about rowing the gears, and that challenge of being as fast as the guy with the better equipment. What I do love about at three pedal Mustang, is passing an M3 or 911 with a DCT. You know it's all driver at that point (provided HP is similar)

Anyway, they are both great, just different, and the big difference is autos are now faster. A lot of us grew up with true slush box torque converters. Even they are better these days with computers, select shift, and lots of gears (BMWs 8-speed is a great example). Do the DCT or automated clutch technology, and there's no comparison to a manual. The new autos seem like cheating...almost, like AWD and stability control...it just takes the driver out of it a bit. But, that's why I want both.

Sponsored

 

[OppoLock]

Yeah, my only point was that these current auto trannys (DCT, or automated clutches, especially with 7+ gears) are just faster. I ain't saying they are more or less fun. I think that's almost like choosing a color; it's just what one likes. For me, I do love three pedal cars and heel-toe down shifting. However, what I love more is the blending, at the limit, acceleration, turning and braking to get the fastest speed out of the car. So, for me, the auto trans is less of a compromise. My focus is on the tires more than anything; that's what I enjoy most.

I would also suggest, at least at the track while driving near the limit, autos are safer. One of the most critical moments of road racing (or HPDE) is the braking zone. Add the down shifting, and mistakes happen more easily. But again, there is an "old school" fun about rowing the gears, and that challenge of being as fast as the guy with the better equipment. What I do love about at three pedal Mustang, is passing an M3 or 911 with a DCT. You know it's all driver at that point (provided HP is similar)

Anyway, they are both great, just different, and the big difference is autos are now faster. A lot of us grew up with true slush box torque converters. Even they are better these days with computers, select shift, and lots of gears (BMWs 8-speed is a great example). Do the DCT or automated clutch technology, and there's no comparison to a manual. The new autos seem like cheating...almost, like AWD and stability control...it just takes the driver out of it a bit. But, that's why I want both.

Good points. I'd be happy with one of the better autos out there. I love the burps you get on upshifts when the fuel's momentarily cutoff, or the rifle shot downshifts. If this was something of a track car or even just a more focused sports car, I'd probably opt for a two pedal setup.

 

[allgripnoslip]

I can see only on the street would you want a manual transmission. The new automated manuals are great, but they still cannot predict what you are going to do with the car unless you put them in full on race mode. You may not want that on the street. You may want to leisurely hold a gear knowing the road ahead. The automated manuals cannot predict that and in turn won't do it without you manually overriding them.

I couldn't have said it better. Manuals can change from full on sport, I.E. Race mode to full fuel savings economy mode to limio smooth all in real time. It's that control that is more important than out right speed.

I would also suggest, at least at the track while driving near the limit, autos are safer. One of the most critical moments of road racing (or HPDE) is the braking zone. Add the down shifting, and mistakes happen more easily. But again, there is an "old school" fun about rowing the gears, and that challenge of being as fast as the guy with the better equipment. What I do love about at three pedal Mustang, is passing an M3 or 911 with a DCT. You know it's all driver at that point (provided HP is similar)

One man's safety net (not having to control another aspect of the car) Is another mans challenge. I think the real question is, what is the purpose for ones car? If it's to have the most fun, the choice is clear. If you're being timed by a stopwatch the choice is clear. If you want to challenge yourself to learn new skills and better your rapatwar of driving abilities, automated (I.E. done for you) transmissions make me too complacent. In these automated transmissions I feel like I'm not involved and my mind wanders to things less important than operating a deadly machine.When driving manual I truly don't even think about shifting any more, it's kinda funny but my brain just handles a manual trans. up and down shifts automatically - instinctual almost, yet my mind stays on what's important, driving.

 

[phil1336]

When Ferrari has dropped its Manual Transmission as an Option for its 2015 Model "California" for the U.S. market, does that give you a clue of the future? Even high end BMW M Series and Audi S Series are importing fewer and fewer Vehicles with Manual Transmissions. Most Americans under 30 have never even driven a "stick shift"! Enjoy "rowing your gears" while you can.

 

[89Trooper]

Sciatic nerve problems down my left leg and two back surgeries...

Automatic.

 

[Laztug]

Owning an MT-82 5.0

Automatic.
Live and learn

 

[Brent302]

Owning an MT-82 5.0

Automatic.
Live and learn

Please go read the reviews and see how improved the Revised MT82 actually is..if I'm reading your post correctly

 

[Firepath]

Having a Manual Transmission is even more fun and challenging when someone is (tailgating) you and say a foot or so behind your rear bumper and your on a hill or a slight incline. Even with so called "Hill control" built into some Manuals, its always fun attempting to leave your foot of the brake and pressing the accelerator while you release the clutch and hope that your vehicle doesn`t roll backwards a few inches. You could always hold your manual transmission in place by simply using the accelerator and clutch to maintain your braking as you prematurely burn away at your clutch to remain stopped in place, a non warrantied item of course. Guess you could always engage your emergency brake lever and use that to maintain braking and slowly release the lever as your press the accelerator and release the clutch pedal. Its fun practicing ones co-ordination.

Or you can just do a correct hill-start. Get the clutch close the the friction point, start taking off (accelerator down, clutch up) and release the handbrake in one coordinated motion.

 

[Laztug]

Please go read the reviews and see how improved the Revised MT82 actually is..if I'm reading your post correctly

I don't think you fully understand the beast that is 6R80.
I enjoy my MT-82, don't get me wrong. But I am done being the under dog when I take on the beast.
It is VERY hard to match the speed / consistency / strength of the 6R80.
The beast has taken on over 1000hp in stock form and came out victorious, if that's not impressive i don't know what is.

Sure the MT-82 is fun to drive, but if your planning on doing anything other than daily driving you will regret not going with the 6R80. I passed up on the performance package for my 6R80! Times have changed, the days of the ford manual being the superior transmission are over my friend.

6R80 embrace it or chase it.

Stock 6R80 at the office.

 

[Laztug]

Or you can just do a correct hill-start. Get the clutch close the the friction point, start taking off (accelerator down, clutch up) and release the handbrake in one coordinated motion.

"correct hill-start! Got it! lets see what its got at the track

Clutch close to the friction point. CHECK
Start taking off - HERE WE GO!
accelerator down, clutch up, I have no idea why the hell I have the hand brake up but down it goes in a coordinated motion aaaaaand........"

"I should of gone auto!"

 

[G-train]

Manuals are so rare in the States these days that a manual feels special. I know traffic blows and will annoy but I can always take a break from my manual and jump in a commuter car.

I hope they continue to offer it, even if it has to be a factory ordered

 

[phil1336]

Why use the "hill assist" or the "hand brake"? Simply use the tried and true clutch and accelerator co-ordinated method and forget about pre-mature clutch burn out failure.

 

[Norm Peterson]

When Ferrari has dropped its Manual Transmission as an Option for its 2015 Model "California" for the U.S. market, does that give you a clue of the future? Even high end BMW M Series and Audi S Series are importing fewer and fewer Vehicles with Manual Transmissions.

In part with the higher-end European makes, one cannot ignore the "snob appeal" factor. To me, it's disgusting that that sort of attitude has any impact on car design for the rest of us. It's bad enough that you're supposed to want an automatic if you're shopping for a "family sedan", where in times past you did have the choice.


To Dinosoar, I disagree with the notion that automatics are safer up around the limit. Simply put, anything that runs with its own programming has the capability of overriding what you need it to be doing - it's certainly not going to pause and ask your permission for what it's about to do. But it could very well startle you or upset the car with an unexpected mid-corner shift when you're already steering with the throttle. Never mind if you're running in the wet. I'll pass, thank you.

Even faster isn't worth the cost in terms of involvement or fun to me. I've posted it in various forms many times - I'd drive a 15 second car with a conventional manual transmission by active choice over a 12 second automatic. Every single time. That's me.

All the noise about DCT conveniently ignores the fact that a few hundred milliseconds here and there will make no useful difference in normal driving. Only at the track do they really come into their own. But even there, anybody who takes all the credit for a hero lap or new personal best with a DCT is only fooling one person.


You said it yourself,

...it just takes the driver out of it a bit.

and that's not something I care to experience at all. Anywhere.

Most Americans under 30 have never even driven a "stick shift"! Enjoy "rowing your gears" while you can.

I am pleased to mention that my 17 y/o granddaughter, with her freshly minted driver's license, does "drive stick". As of this past weekend she now has her own car . . . which has a 5-speed manual.


Norm

 

[Norm Peterson]

I don't think you fully understand the beast that is 6R80.
I enjoy my MT-82, don't get me wrong. But I am done being the under dog when I take on the beast.
It is VERY hard to match the speed / consistency / strength of the 6R80.
The beast has taken on over 1000hp in stock form and came out victorious, if that's not impressive i don't know what is.

Sure the MT-82 is fun to drive, but if your planning on doing anything other than daily driving you will regret not going with the 6R80. I passed up on the performance package for my 6R80! Times have changed, the days of the ford manual being the superior transmission are over my friend.

6R80 embrace it or chase it.

<Sigh> . . . same old "automatics are faster" argument. Yet again, and nothing I didn't actually suggest to people over 45 years ago when it was 3A vs 4M.

A 6R80 has no place in either my daily or my recreational driving, and the single kind of situation where it is unquestionably superior doesn't interest me.


Norm

 

[Brent302]

<Sigh> . . . same old "automatics are faster" argument. Yet again, and nothing I didn't actually suggest to people over 45 years ago when it was 3A vs 4M.

A 6R80 has no place in either my daily or my recreational driving, and the single kind of situation where it is unquestionably superior doesn't interest me.


Norm

I like Norm lol [emoji106]

Sponsored