Lightning Struck
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I'm wondering what the available depth for the midrange is? The driver I'm looking at is 49.5mm deep, but the motor is relatively small in diameter, if that makes a difference.
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Midrange Depth
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mikes2017gt
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The stock adapter piece that the midrange attaches to is about 3/4" thick. Side view of the stock driver mounted to the adapter. Lousy pic but you get the idea. The stock driver sticks out the back about a 1/4" maybe a little more.
The depth of the cutout from the actual door surface to the metal behind it is about 3/4" as shown here.
So you've got roughly 1.5" mounting depth total, using the stock spacer. However: I discovered that the issue w/the mid is not the mounting depth, but the mounting HEIGHT. How far towards the door panel the driver sticks out.
I originally made adapter plates out of 1/4" thick material for my mids as shown here.
It wound up that the driver was too close to the door panel and the surround was hitting the ribs on the back of the grill. These squiggly line things, mainly where I circled.
Even though I ground those raised ribs down the driver was still too close for my liking...it might have been OK but I didn't chance it. I made new mounting plates out of 1/8" thick material.
What I probably should've done was just make a new "factory adapter plate" out of 1/2" material and mounted the driver to that. Too late now.
Point is that the mounting depth isn't really the issue, it's the mounting height. Hope this helps!
The depth of the cutout from the actual door surface to the metal behind it is about 3/4" as shown here.
So you've got roughly 1.5" mounting depth total, using the stock spacer. However: I discovered that the issue w/the mid is not the mounting depth, but the mounting HEIGHT. How far towards the door panel the driver sticks out.
I originally made adapter plates out of 1/4" thick material for my mids as shown here.
It wound up that the driver was too close to the door panel and the surround was hitting the ribs on the back of the grill. These squiggly line things, mainly where I circled.
Even though I ground those raised ribs down the driver was still too close for my liking...it might have been OK but I didn't chance it. I made new mounting plates out of 1/8" thick material.
What I probably should've done was just make a new "factory adapter plate" out of 1/2" material and mounted the driver to that. Too late now.
Point is that the mounting depth isn't really the issue, it's the mounting height. Hope this helps!
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Lightning Struck
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Hmm, but with the drivers I'm looking at, with a depth of 49.5mm(2") I probably would have issues with the metal behind them.
MegaG
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FWIW, from Crutchfield, I got these dimensions while looking at the Morel CDM 880 Midrange. These are the Door's dimensions not the Morel's
Size: 3-1/2"
Depth: 2.031
Mounting Height: 0.383
Cutout diameter: 3.005
What'sthe actual driver your are looking at?
Size: 3-1/2"
Depth: 2.031
Mounting Height: 0.383
Cutout diameter: 3.005
What'sthe actual driver your are looking at?
MegaG
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Mike, any idea what the dimension is from the raised ribs above to the back of the door panel?It wound up that the driver was too close to the door panel and the surround was hitting the ribs on the back of the grill. These squiggly line things, mainly where I circled.
Even though I ground those raised ribs down the driver was still too close for my liking...it might have been OK but I didn't chance it. I made new mounting plates out of 1/8" thick material.
What I probably should've done was just make a new "factory adapter plate" out of 1/2" material and mounted the driver to that. Too late now.
Point is that the mounting depth isn't really the issue, it's the mounting height. Hope this helps!
If one was to top mount a midrange, say to add a 3 way to a base system without buying new door panels, I suspect it will help to have a spacer to tie the top mounted speaker and the door panel firmly to the door's inner skin to avoid rattling.
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Lightning Struck
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The drivers I'm looking at are the Stereo Integrity Carbon M3's
Carbon Fiber cone and dust cap
Synthetic copolymer surround
Cast basket
Copper voice coil
Neo cup motor
Frequency response from 125 Hz to 20,000 Hz
Mounting depth of 49.5 mm
72.5 mm Cutout
94.4 mm OD
Carbon Fiber cone and dust cap
Synthetic copolymer surround
Cast basket
Copper voice coil
Neo cup motor
Frequency response from 125 Hz to 20,000 Hz
Mounting depth of 49.5 mm
72.5 mm Cutout
94.4 mm OD
MegaG
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Nice looking speaker, the new Morel midrange I was looking at are similar to these.The drivers I'm looking at are the Stereo Integrity Carbon M3's
To be honest, these feel like you would need to top mount these on the door panel due to Mike's post above about how this the factory grill is. Its something I am considering doing though I am coming from the base model so I can cut out exactly what I need, the premium door panel may dictate the hole size due based on the existing grills dimensions.
The cost of the SI is a lot easier to stomach then the Morel's which are $900 a pair. That's why I may ultimately go with the discontinued Morel CDM 880, just need to buy them before they are all gone.
https://www.morelhifi.com/product/elate-carbon-mm3/
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Lightning Struck
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My other choice is a Scanspeak 10f. I know people have fit them in the midrange location. My weird OCD just likes to have all the drivers be the same brand!
MegaG
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Yeah, I resemble that remark, otherwise a better install might be the Audiofrog GB25, the GB40 just seems to big as well, unless...
Ironically, in the beginning it was between the Morels and Audiofrogs, went with the Morels to save some money with their Hybrid versus the GB series but another concern I had was getting the AF tweeters right in the factory location. Of course, I was also starting with a 2-way but now possibly jumping to the 3-way before I have even heard the 2-way.
Complicating things is I have softened on my requirement that it needs to be a stealth stock install to the point that I am considering cutting up the door panel for the mids. I have even wondered if I can show-off the Morel grills for the 6-1/2". I would just pick up an extra set of door panels from an auto recycler. I just wish there was room for the Morel Elate MW9
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Lightning Struck
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All of the GB10 installs I've seen in the factory locations have turned out great though.. I've already got a set of SI TM65 Mk2's that I've had stashed for a bit, and with SI coming out with some amazing looking A/B amplifiers, I was trying to stay all SI, but I think it might be a loss cause with the midrange.
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mikes2017gt
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I seriously thought about mounting my Morel mid on the door panel. i have the premium door panels, but the Morel's mounting ring assembly is larger than the stock cutout so it wouldn't have been a problem. I would never mount a mibbass to a stock door panel but a mid doesn't vibrate much at all.
I decided against it b/c I thought it wouldn't look right. You have this stock door panel with one little Morel speaker sticking out like a sore thumb.
There really is very little space b/t the mid and the stock door panel grill. The problem really is the stock mounting plate. It gives clearance for the magnet inside the door, but it pushes the mid way up against the door panel.
If I ever do this again, I'll fab up some spacer plates that are deep enough for whatever driver I'm using, while also not pushing it out too far towards the door. I had a really hard time with the mids in my current install. I made nice adapter plates to mate the driver to the stock spacer and then wound up having to remake the adapter plates out of thinner material to clear the grill.
The door speakers in the S550 really require custom mounting solutions, no matter what drivers you choose.
I decided against it b/c I thought it wouldn't look right. You have this stock door panel with one little Morel speaker sticking out like a sore thumb.
There really is very little space b/t the mid and the stock door panel grill. The problem really is the stock mounting plate. It gives clearance for the magnet inside the door, but it pushes the mid way up against the door panel.
If I ever do this again, I'll fab up some spacer plates that are deep enough for whatever driver I'm using, while also not pushing it out too far towards the door. I had a really hard time with the mids in my current install. I made nice adapter plates to mate the driver to the stock spacer and then wound up having to remake the adapter plates out of thinner material to clear the grill.
The door speakers in the S550 really require custom mounting solutions, no matter what drivers you choose.
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mikes2017gt
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You mean from the ribs to the surface of the door? If I had to take an educated guess I'd say approximately 1". The stock spacer is about 3/4" high all by itself.
MegaG
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This is why I am seriously considering the Morel CDM 880, I just need to fab an adapter that's 1/2 IN thick and its all good. The new CDM 700 is a better price, which helps since I also need two door panels, but at 8 ohms I am concerned about getting the gains to match properly when the other two speakers are 4 ohms. I just don't have any first hand experience with active systems.
I know the tweeter won't use all the power I give it but if I give the 4 ohm woofer 125 watts RMS and the 8 ohm mid 125 watts rms am I turning the gain down too much on the woofer to balance everything?
Does it even matter, at my age, I like loud music, loud to me, but it may not take as much power as I think. I have measure 85 dBs in a car and I can't listen at that level for too long not that you're supposed to according to OSHA.
mikes2017gt
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Midrange drivers will use a lot less power than midbasses. You would be just fine with an 8-ohm midrange on a 125w amp channel. You could probably get away with half that.
In my current in-progress install, I'll be giving the midbasses 150w and the mids 75w. They're all 4-ohm drivers though.
In my current in-progress install, I'll be giving the midbasses 150w and the mids 75w. They're all 4-ohm drivers though.
MegaG
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OP,
I hope you got something out of my earlier posts, I apologize for jacking your thread
Mike,
After all this discussion I think I am going to stick to my original plan of a 2.1 system, see how that works and how I like it with no rear fill, get some measurements done, see where the deficiencies are and then think about next steps. This also gives me some info to share with the community for those who absolutely can't afford a 3-way, gives them a path they can follow.
I just got distracted by Morel discontinuing the Elate midrange since its true replacement (MM3) is a big step up in size and cost and I viewed the CDM 700 as a lower level midrange then the CDM 880, however, it may not be.
I hope you got something out of my earlier posts, I apologize for jacking your thread
Mike,
After all this discussion I think I am going to stick to my original plan of a 2.1 system, see how that works and how I like it with no rear fill, get some measurements done, see where the deficiencies are and then think about next steps. This also gives me some info to share with the community for those who absolutely can't afford a 3-way, gives them a path they can follow.
I just got distracted by Morel discontinuing the Elate midrange since its true replacement (MM3) is a big step up in size and cost and I viewed the CDM 700 as a lower level midrange then the CDM 880, however, it may not be.
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