GM is pulling back on EVs

[kz]

Heat pumps have become the eco fiasco of the decade (msn.com)

Hello; I was puzzled about the title as I have a heat pump (HP) and it does sort of work. I thought the problem would be how inefficient they become as the outside temperatures become extreme. Somewhere around freezing temps my HP resorts to old fashioned resistance heating coils. These coils are like the burners on an electric stove, perhaps the most expensive to heat with electricity.
But i was wrong. The problems appear to be in part because the country has not been destroyed by war in many decades.

Have you checked how cold the winters are in UK ? They'll more than fine I think...
And you have unique gift of finding all the articles that are clearly influenced by someone having business in preventing the change, they're all happy to have guys like you that fall for this shit so easily.

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[K4fxd]

Have you checked how cold the winters are in UK ? They'll more than fine I think...

The point is the talk in the UK is the government will force people to rip out current heating systems and install heat pumps. See my link to the Telegraph in an above post.

 

[sk47]

Have you checked how cold the winters are in UK ? They'll more than fine I think...
And you have unique gift of finding all the articles that are clearly influenced by someone having business in preventing the change, they're all happy to have guys like you that fall for this shit so easily.

Hello; Guess you ignored the part of my having a heat pump. If you read the article part of the issue is not so much the heat pumps short comings, but the old homes being hard or expensive to be set up to work.
My house was built in the 1970's and even it needed some upgrades to the insulation when i bought it 13 years ago. My heat pump is also older as it was already in place when i bought the house. So a newer unit ought to be able to do better when it gets down to freezing and below.

I have not been to England so do not have experience with the winters. My area has temps down to five or more degrees below zero F some winters. This current winter coldest was right around 0 degrees F for almost a week in late December. Been in the 20's F the last few nights. So, i know from experience a bit about winter and heat pumps if that counts for anything.

 

[K4fxd]

I've got a 16 seer multi stage heat pump and when it gets below 30 degrees or so the aux heat comes on.

 

[sk47]

The point is the talk in the UK is the government will force people to rip out current heating systems and install heat pumps. See my link to the Telegraph in an above post.

Hello; The use of force to push heat pumps is a big part, perhaps the biggest part of the story. If your house is hundreds of years old and not easy to retrofit a heat pump also part of the story.

The first winter in a house with only a heat pump for heat was a cold one. After I added several inches of blow in insulation to the attic and sealed up the house it is better. Still feel cold most of the time with only the heat pump.

 

[sk47]

I've got a 16 seer multi stage heat pump and when it gets below 30 degrees or so the aux heat comes on.

Hello; Same for mine. I can tell when the resistance coil aux heat starts to work. There is a smell and a bit of actual warm air comes out of the vents. Might as well turn on the electric stove or oven when the aux heat is in use. It just runs electricity thru resistance wires so the wires get red hot which is a much less efficient way to heat a house.

 

[K4fxd]

It's starting here, my cold dead hands.

I guess the people in charge don't know most electricity is made from fossil fuel



https://www.thecity.nyc/2023/1/13/23554476/future-gas-stoves-ban-new-york-what-to-know
In a few years, new buildings in New York City won't be allowed to feature gas stoves in kitchens, or any other appliances powered by fossil fuel. The City Council in 2021 passed a bill that effectively bans gas in new buildings, starting in 2024 for those under seven stories and in 2027 for anything taller.Jan 13, 2023

 

[sk47]

Hello; Guess you ignored the part of my having a heat pump. If you read the article part of the issue is not so much the heat pumps short comings, but the old homes being hard or expensive to be set up to work.
My house was built in the 1970's and even it needed some upgrades to the insulation when i bought it 13 years ago. My heat pump is also older as it was already in place when i bought the house. So a newer unit ought to be able to do better when it gets down to freezing and below.

I have not been to England so do not have experience with the winters. My area has temps down to five or more degrees below zero F some winters. This current winter coldest was right around 0 degrees F for almost a week in late December. Been in the 20's F the last few nights. So, i know from experience a bit about winter and heat pumps if that counts for anything.

Hello; Let me add a bit to this. I found some of the previous owners electric bills in a closet. They were paying $300 or more a month in the winter months. I likely keep the thermostat lower (68 F) than they did and with added insulation and sealing up my top bills only rarely are over $100 now. Top bill in years was $115.

 

[AZlb5.0]

“The rules will prevent up to 85 premature deaths per year and save up to $890 million a year in health-care costs and lost work.”
Seriously 85 deaths a year. Wow So if you live to 86 instead of 85 it did its job huh?

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/sa...ut-natural-gas-heating-appliances-2023-03-16/

 

[sk47]

Hello; Interesting as to how over a few posts the China & emissions question has been spun and twisted. This sidetrack discussion began with a contention from Gregs I think. He seemed to focus on the idea that because China manufactures "green" equipment and EV's they are above being reproached about their overall emissions.
Within a limited context of discussion of emissions of only greehouse gases, my take is overall emissions ought to count. My guess is the average private citizen in China is not behind the decisions to build and put into use every 10 to 15 days a new coal fired power plant. Those sorts of decisions are more part of the ruling crew of the nation.
Not clear how the average joe in most countries is directly on the hook for the emissions of a nation state. I do get that individuals in China and most places want a better life and also that often the definition of a better life tends to be a life more like a western/USA lifestyle.

Back in the 1980's, 90's and early 2000's I used a statistic to illustrate a concept in my classes. That for the entire world to have the lifestyle of an average Joe westerner we would need the resources of five planets the size of the earth. Not necessarily a dead bang on number, but illustrative. Guess the point turns out to be there is not enough to go around for everyone to have multiple cars, a McMansion, four kids in college, nice vacation cruises and the like.

Do all the people in China, India & elsewhere who have not had a chance for a "western lifestyle" need a grace period of allowance of extra emissions so as to be allowed to catch up. The idea and concept of everyone doing better is appealing, however a big question arises. By the standards of you, Gregs and a few others for so many years of posts the planet absolutely needs very much less GHG emissions or we will have catastrophic global climate change. We all who have read the many posts know you favor the EV and Green energy future. Guys like me are told to get use to the idea EV's, windmills and no coal or oil. You say that is how the planet can be saved.
Yet here in the last few pages you have been telling me to look at Chinas emissions from a PER-CAPITA point of view. That gives China a pass on its ongoing current and ever-increasing emissions, while at the same time condemns the USA which is doing some better.

(NOTE- I did not have to resort to a putdown to make a point. )

Hello; I am soon going to call the debate of China's world leading pollution emissions not counting because they make lots of EV, wind turbine, battery and other "green" parts as a false notion. Been a few pages since the last rebuttal post.

 

[sk47]

“The rules will prevent up to 85 premature deaths per year and save up to $890 million a year in health-care costs and lost work.”
Seriously 85 seats a year. Wow So if you live to 86 instead of 85 it did its job huh?

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/sa...ut-natural-gas-heating-appliances-2023-03-16/

Hello; I read the short article. My comeback is a bit cheeky. On TV the streets of some California cities are become public toilets. People taking dumps and urinating on city streets.
Back maybe during the middle ages cities such as London and Paris were much the same. Chamber pots just dumped into the street gutters occasionally washed with rain. Lots of communicable disease. Over time societies understood the problems with that and spent lots of monies making "sanitary" sewers and indoor plumbing.
I do get calling out a completely unrelated issue is not great form, but maybe it is ironic enough. A city which cannot solve the problem of its streets being open sewers is going after natural gas water heaters and furnaces. I do wonder how many premature deaths might be accounted for by open sewer streets???

 

[K4fxd]

Looks like my prediction of electric rates going up and causing EV users to balk is coming true.

When you increase demand and reduce supply you get higher prices.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/ev-owners-increasingly-frustrated-home-161117741.html

 

[AZlb5.0]

Looks like my prediction of electric rates going up and causing EV users to balk is coming true.

When you increase demand and reduce supply you get higher prices.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/ev-owners-increasingly-frustrated-home-161117741.html

How dare you with those conspiracy theories I mean “far fetched” ideas that have come to fruition.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

Have you checked how cold the winters are in UK ? They'll more than fine I think...
And you have unique gift of finding all the articles that are clearly influenced by someone having business in preventing the change, they're all happy to have guys like you that fall for this shit so easily.

Fortunately, it's a damn good thing nobody pushing that change could be wrong or have any ulterior motive.

 

[Gregs24]

Have you checked how cold the winters are in UK ? They'll more than fine I think...
And you have unique gift of finding all the articles that are clearly influenced by someone having business in preventing the change, they're all happy to have guys like you that fall for this shit so easily.

Not sure what you are on about? If it is my last post then I have posted links to the company introducing the hydrogen trial, an article that covers both criticism and support of it and an exploding house. Not sure what 'shit' I am supposed to be falling for?

Or maybe you are just responding to one of the trolls I ignore - in which case crack on

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