Do bolt on performance parts really help at all?

[tw557]

I have been involved in building motocross, roadrace bike and a few Fox body 302 motors for years. They are always normally aspirated motors and most are carburetor too. Its all about efficient cylinder filling. Cam timing, lift, duration and overlap, intake tract length, header length to exhaust scavenging. Since the piston will always have a vacuum as its trying to fill, everything needs to be done to make that as efficient as possible.
But now I'm getting interested in turbo motors. And from most of the research I'm finding, the basics of turbo power is related to consistent boost pressure, heat control, timing and quality fuel. My assumption is that at all times at any given load on the motor, the PCM is LIMITING the boost with either the wastegate or the BOV. I assume this must be true since a PCM tune only, will add boost and HP at every RPM with all the factory parts.
So back to my original question. Do hard parts really do anything at all if the PCM is there to LIMIT the boost anyway. So if you add a downpipe does the wastegate just open more to relieve more pressure. Same with the intake and BOV. No question that a Intercooler could be very helpful though.

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[Terminator2]

I have been involved in building motocross, roadrace bike and a few Fox body 302 motors for years. They are always normally aspirated motors and most are carburetor too. Its all about efficient cylinder filling. Cam timing, lift, duration and overlap, intake tract length, header length to exhaust scavenging. Since the piston will always have a vacuum as its trying to fill, everything needs to be done to make that as efficient as possible.
But now I'm getting interested in turbo motors. And from most of the research I'm finding, the basics of turbo power is related to consistent boost pressure, heat control, timing and quality fuel. My assumption is that at all times at any given load on the motor, the PCM is LIMITING the boost with either the wastegate or the BOV. I assume this must be true since a PCM tune only, will add boost and HP at every RPM with all the factory parts.
So back to my original question. Do hard parts really do anything at all if the PCM is there to LIMIT the boost anyway. So if you add a downpipe does the wastegate just open more to relieve more pressure. Same with the intake and BOV. No question that a Intercooler could be very helpful though.

If the ECM in the ecoboost is a torque based controller like most modern ECMs then the bolt on mods by themselves will not help much as target torque will be reached at a lower boost level. However when combined with a tune the gains will be larger.

 

[Busser48]

I have been involved in building motocross, roadrace bike and a few Fox body 302 motors for years. They are always normally aspirated motors and most are carburetor too. Its all about efficient cylinder filling. Cam timing, lift, duration and overlap, intake tract length, header length to exhaust scavenging. Since the piston will always have a vacuum as its trying to fill, everything needs to be done to make that as efficient as possible.
But now I'm getting interested in turbo motors. And from most of the research I'm finding, the basics of turbo power is related to consistent boost pressure, heat control, timing and quality fuel. My assumption is that at all times at any given load on the motor, the PCM is LIMITING the boost with either the wastegate or the BOV. I assume this must be true since a PCM tune only, will add boost and HP at every RPM with all the factory parts.
So back to my original question. Do hard parts really do anything at all if the PCM is there to LIMIT the boost anyway. So if you add a downpipe does the wastegate just open more to relieve more pressure. Same with the intake and BOV. No question that a Intercooler could be very helpful though.

I take really does nothing, I didn't notice any performance difference with my DP, sound is good though. A wastegate is a bolt on part and is s great upgrade. Def works. The 2 things you will get the most power from dollar for dollar is a tune and e30. Insane results. The other option is Lessing your rotational mass with lighter parts, like driveshaft or flywheel/clutch

 

[Busser48]

Edit

*intake really does nothing

 

[tw557]

Yeah, I really have doubts the intake would do anything but I see a few manufactures like JLT that have some pretty big claims of like 15 hp or so. I just don't see how its possible but they are very expensive to find out it doesn't help at all but makes all kinds of noise which I don't want. I just don't understand how it can help at all if the motor doesn't get ANY extra boost since the PCM regulates it.

 

[Warhead]

I did feel a responsiveness increase once the intake was installed, before the tune. You're right about the noise increase.

It's the tune that made all the real differences though.

A good example to look at might be Cobb's different level stage hardware and tune combos. That might be slightly telling with what they see as needing to be opened up before pushing harder with more aggressive tunes.

Notice their level 1 is just an air filter and tune.

 

[Mid_life_crisis]

In a car like ours, a downpipe by itself should not increase power by a noticeable amount, but it should reduce lag all on its own. It should also make it easier for a decent tuner to get more power at lower rpm due to faster spool up.
From what I've read, an intercooler upgrade is the first bolt on you should look for. Heat soak is the enemy of all turbo cars and with a reasonable intake and exhaust coming from the factory, it isn't easy to improve on breathing in a way that will do much more than make noise. You can fight the heat though, which will get you more consistent power by keeping that intake charge cool.

 

[tw557]

Yeah, I can see that maybe the response or lag could be improved upon by freeing up both ends. This could help just up to the point the PCM says that is enough I guess. The heat is really the big thing I keep seeing as I do my research. Especially for any consistency and for safety for the motor. It really is amazing in some ways how simple it is to get turbo motor HP buy just having the PCM allow the boost to raise and fill that cylinder right up and control the timing and fuel delivery. So much more to it with a N/A motor and also so many compromises with achieving high torque or hp and not affecting one or the other.

 

[Weather Man]

For no tune, replacing the stock intercooler is best bang for the buck.

 

[Juben]

Bolt-ons will help in the sense that they'll help the motor to produce power more efficiently. An engine is basically a huge air pump, so increasing the efficiency of the pump will increase the power, however, as mentioned above, the stock PCM calibration will clamp down on any additional power that would be produced outside of the factory limits. That's why a tune is needed to raise the calibration limits, and in doing so, you'll reap the full benefit of the bolt-ons.

I've said it a million times, but heat management and proper maintenance is the key to produce consistent, solid, and most importantly, reliable power. That's why an intercooler is always recommended first followed by a tune. In doing so, you're beginning the process of heat management and also taking control of the reins to make the car run at its peak.

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