DD tires for R

[AndreiD]

A 305/30 tire will be the same height as another 305/30 on the same width wheel... what happens is when you change wheel widths, is you can either "bulge" or "stretch" the fitment of the tires, causing a slightly increase or reduction to the sidewall height due to how the tire fits on the wheel.

So if you are using the same size wheels as stock, then yes they will retain the exact same height.

If want to keep the same ride height with a non-R, you just need 295/35's and 305/35's, same as stock. Otherwise you will lose height going to a 30 series tires unless you run something ridiculously wide.. you would need a 345/30 to get the same height as a 295/35.

Ty! I like the higher sidewall....mostly because of bad roads and potholes! But also I think it will help protect the rim lip better under hard manovers...but that's just a guess....

Ty for clearing things up. So 295/35 and 305/35 on Cups 2 will fit the same as with the stock MPSS on stock rim sizes right?!

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[J_Maher_AMG]

Ty! I like the higher sidewall....mostly because of bad roads and potholes! But also I think it will help protect the rim lip better under hard manovers...but that's just a guess....

Ty for clearing things up. So 295/35 and 305/35 on Cups 2 will fit the same as with the stock MPSS on stock rim sizes right?!

It is definitely a little confusing for sure.

What you need to look at is the sizing specs on Tirerack's website for example. They offer the "tread width", which is the width of the actual contact patch. You'll notice that this number is ALWAYS smaller than the section width, which is the overall width of the tire, as it should be. What is also provided is the "measured rim width", and it is on this width of a wheel that they obtained those measurements. Cup 2's aren't made in a 295/35 or a 305/35 at least according to Tire Rack. In fact, the OEM MPSS is the only tire that comes in a 295/35 and 305/35 set.. so you essentially have the choice of running the OEM tires or moving to a 30 series tire.

It also gives a "rim width range" that is the correct range of wheel widths that would adequately suit the tire's size. Therefore, for example on a 10.5" wide rim, the tire would be "bunched up" or "bulge" more, which could increase the overall height of the tire by a very small amount. Likewise, on an 11.5" wheel, the tire would be ever so slightly "stretched", thus potentially decreasing the overall height.

So ultimately you have to look at the sizing specs on each individual tire you are considering, to see how they fit essentially based on what wheel they were measured on. Then you can know for certain whether they will fit similarly or not.

 

[nastang87xx]

For every half inch narrower or wider wheel you go vs the actual width measurement for the tire, you usually gain or lose about .2 inches of tire height.

Example, a 285 on a 10" wheel will measure a "perfect" tirewall height. A 9.5" wheel will make the tire bulge ever so very slightly and increase the tire wall height by about .2 inches.

 

[RustedAngel]

It is actually narrower than the Cup 2; see my post above concerning widths. And on the same wheel width, it won't be any taller... if you put it on a narrower wheel, i.e put a 305 on a 10.5" wheel and an 11.0" wheel, it may be slightly taller on the narrower wheel, but largely negligible.

And the PS4S are roughly between 16-20% heavier per corner, which is about 4-5lbs per tire. Have looked at many different tires and none comes close to the Cup 2's in terms of weight.

No, it isn't.

I've got them on my car. On an 11" wheel, and my ride height increased. You can see the taller sidewalk when compared to the same sized Cup 2. I know what TireRack quotes as meaurments, but it's not accurate to real life and how the tires are sized and fit.

The 305/30/19 4S mounted on a 11" width is as wide as the 315/30/19 Cup 2 mounted on a 11.5" wheel.

 

[RustedAngel]

Stock 315/30/19 Cup 2 on 11.5" Carbon R wheel in rear, 305/30/19 4S mounted on 11" Forgeline GS1R in front.

 

[Zitrosounds]

Stock 315/30/19 Cup 2 on 11.5" Carbon R wheel in rear, 305/30/19 4S mounted on 11" Forgeline GS1R in front.

which is front ans which is rear???? LOL

 

[RustedAngel]

which is front ans which is rear???? LOL

Dammit. Stupid photo uploader spun the photo.

Left-Rear/Right-Front.

 

[Zitrosounds]

Dammit. Stupid photo uploader spun the photo.

Left-Rear/Right-Front.

I figured due to the tread pattern just wanted to be certain.

Thanks

 

[J_Maher_AMG]

No, it isn't.

I've got them on my car. On an 11" wheel, and my ride height increased. You can see the taller sidewalk when compared to the same sized Cup 2. I know what TireRack quotes as meaurments, but it's not accurate to real life and how the tires are sized and fit.

The 305/30/19 4S mounted on a 11" width is as wide as the 315/30/19 Cup 2 mounted on a 11.5" wheel.

TireRack doesn't "quote measurements" they take actual accurate measurements of tires on wheels... You might gain a mm here and there, but it is negligible. You claimed to gain 0.25" ride height, which would mean the tire is 0.5" taller than the same sized tire in a Cup 2... that is almost 13mm difference, which I don't see happening. If you said 0.25" total, i.e a 1/8" ride height difference, it would be more believable IMO.

And if we're splitting hairs, the 315/30/19 Cup 2 is 11.7" wide whereas the 305/30/19 MP4S is 11.5" wide sooo... yeah, you're not going to be able to perceive the difference of a few mm over almost a foot.

 

[RustedAngel]

TireRack doesn't "quote measurements" they take actual accurate measurements of tires on wheels... You might gain a mm here and there, but it is negligible. You claimed to gain 0.25" ride height, which would mean the tire is 0.5" taller than the same sized tire in a Cup 2... that is almost 13mm difference, which I don't see happening. If you said 0.25" total, i.e a 1/8" ride height difference, it would be more believable IMO.

And if we're splitting hairs, the 315/30/19 Cup 2 is 11.7" wide whereas the 305/30/19 MP4S is 11.5" wide sooo... yeah, you're not going to be able to perceive the difference of a few mm over almost a foot.

I said with the tires AND camber plates the ride height was increased...

But regardless...the photos are there. I put measuring tapes to them. Do the same first hand. It's been mentioned several times that quoted sizes will vary in how they fit.

Do with that as you wish. I'm not here to change opinion, just give info was real world, first hand application.

 

[J_Maher_AMG]

I said with the tires AND camber plates the ride height was increased...

But regardless...the photos are there. I put measuring tapes to them. Do the same first hand. It's been mentioned several times that quoted sizes will vary in how they fit.

Do with that as you wish. I'm not here to change opinion, just give info was real world, first hand application.

I had missed where you mentioned camber plates. Given that, yes you could have gained more height of course as the tire tilt's more on a diagonal.

I was merely discussing the tire themselves, not your particular setup. It would be incorrect to say or imply that one tire is significantly taller than another in the same size. Just wanted to make that clear for others.

And I will do the same first hand as well when I buy new tires this fall or next spring, however I have my doubts whether I will come up with measurements any different from the guys and girls who do this for a living ;)

On a separate note, let us know how you find the PS4S overall! The regular MPSS is now decently cheaper than the MP4S and am wondering whether it is worth the extra cash for the MP4S or if I'll just get them later down the road.

EDIT: There was no mention of camber plates previously... so I no longer feel retarded for missing that detail LOL

 

[RustedAngel]

I had missed where you mentioned camber plates. Given that, yes you could have gained more height of course as the tire tilt's more on a diagonal.

I was merely discussing the tire themselves, not your particular setup. It would be incorrect to say or imply that one tire is significantly taller than another in the same size. Just wanted to make that clear for others.

And I will do the same first hand as well when I buy new tires this fall or next spring, however I have my doubts whether I will come up with measurements any different from the guys and girls who do this for a living ;)

On a separate note, let us know how you find the PS4S overall! The regular MPSS is now decently cheaper than the MP4S and am wondering whether it is worth the extra cash for the MP4S or if I'll just get them later down the road.

I was surprised as to how wide the 4S was when I bought it. But being it's a xL load tire and the Cup 2s aren't, it makes more sense.

I had the PSS on my old 5.0 and they were fine, but the only direct comparison I have for the 4S currently are the Cup 2s that came on the R.

With that in mind - I definitely think the 4S > PSS in terms of traction, steering feel, and how they hold up in heat while driving in something like Auto X. I've not yet gotten them onto a Road Course, so that's still TBD. Hopefully this week. But they stick like crazy as long as the suspension isn't too stiff. For Auto X, track felt like it broke them loose a bit too quickly. So I went down to Sport this past event (post FP spring install) and was much more pleased. With the FP springs on, my ride height dropped back down to right at what my stock R height was, and, with the ever so slight rate increase, Sport has kinda morphed into a Sport Plus, and seems to respond much better without being overkill.

Car loaded up great, held consistently fantastically, and didn't get crazy even in 100 degree heat.

I'm going to get a set of 315/30/19 Cup 2s to slap on these wheels and run that as a squared Track Set, and will comment on that later after it's completed. My thinking is that even on a road course with larger turns and higher speeds, the Track setting is going to be too stiff for the 4S and really be more matched with a stickier tire.

We'll see though.

For the time being, here's a photo of me driving from this weekend.

 

[J_Maher_AMG]

I was surprised as to how wide the 4S was when I bought it. But being it's a xL load tire and the Cup 2s aren't, it makes more sense.

I had the PSS on my old 5.0 and they were fine, but the only direct comparison I have for the 4S currently are the Cup 2s that came on the R.

With that in mind - I definitely think the 4S > PSS in terms of traction, steering feel, and how they hold up in heat while driving in something like Auto X. I've not yet gotten them onto a Road Course, so that's still TBD. Hopefully this week. But they stick like crazy as long as the suspension isn't too stiff. For Auto X, track felt like it broke them loose a bit too quickly. So I went down to Sport this past event (post FP spring install) and was much more pleased. With the FP springs on, my ride height dropped back down to right at what my stock R height was, and, with the ever so slight rate increase, Sport has kinda morphed into a Sport Plus, and seems to respond much better without being overkill.

Car loaded up great, held consistently fantastically, and didn't get crazy even in 100 degree heat.

I'm going to get a set of 315/30/19 Cup 2s to slap on these wheels and run that as a squared Track Set, and will comment on that later after it's completed. My thinking is that even on a road course with larger turns and higher speeds, the Track setting is going to be too stiff for the 4S and really be more matched with a stickier tire.

We'll see though.

For the time being, here's a photo of me driving from this weekend.

Great feedback and photo!

Jealous of the larger areas where you guys can set up your Auto-X courses! Our auto-x events are very small in comparison to a lot of the videos I see online.

In terms of the PS4S setup you have, considering the Forgelines and the tires are both heavier than the stock setup (not a massive difference but still significant), have you noticed any difference in steering feel or how the car behaves over bumps or what have you?

Also assuming that the PS4S is much more friendly when it comes to picking up and throwing rocks/sand on the roads?

 

[RustedAngel]

Great feedback and photo!

Jealous of the larger areas where you guys can set up your Auto-X courses! Our auto-x events are very small in comparison to a lot of the videos I see online.

In terms of the PS4S setup you have, considering the Forgelines and the tires are both heavier than the stock setup (not a massive difference but still significant), have you noticed any difference in steering feel or how the car behaves over bumps or what have you?

Also assuming that the PS4S is much more friendly when it comes to picking up and throwing rocks/sand on the roads?

Let me apologize really quickly - I am horrible at keeping up with 6G and try to reply when I have time after a notification of a counter reply is sent. That doesn't seem to get sent to me very timely, so I lose track of which threads in relation to age of thread.

When I posted my initial replay regarding tires, I did not have camber plates on yet. When I measured (and I didn't expect it, but I all of a sudden was not scraping places I used to scrape) I did indeed have about 1/4" more (give or take a 1/16", my car doesn't sit exactly level) measured at the front splitter.

I chalked it up to not only the extra width and load rating - but the tread depth itself. Cup 2s are 180, 4S are 300. Seemed totally easy to believe.

Once the plates went on - I never updated my initial replies as it seemed the thread had died. lol.

However, this ends up being the entire reason I went ahead with the springs - to get it back down to around stock ride height. Now, after letting it settle, getting an alignment, and beating on it this weekend the measurements are as follows (measured at the center of the wheel to the wheel well).

Front: 26.75".
Rear: 27".

Go measure your stock R. Ford quotes a 20mm drop from the springs, so you can see, specifically in the rear, exactly how much the 4S added solely.

Moving on - they're definitely more friendly in the rock chunking catagory. I didn't really care about the rocks being flung regardless, but it's much more quiet now, and rain isn't nearly as frightening.

The difference between the stock complete assembly (Carbon wheel + Tire + TPMS + Balancing Weights) is not as great as one would think.

The OEM front as a complete assembly, after 2800 miles (assume some weight loss from tread wear) was right at 47.8lbs when measured on my digital bathroom scale. The rear was close to 49. I think it was like 48.9.

The Forgelines with the 305/30/19 4S, as a complete assembly, were all nearly dead on the nose at 51lbs.

I got the offsets matched to place the outboard edge of the 11" width at the same place as the stock R wheels, so the geometry was dead on.

As a result - other than the obvious differences of the feel you get from a different compound tire and way more meat from the tread depth, there's not been anything funky or odd about its handling characteristics of which bears mentioning. I think the 4S is probably the best option for a R owner looking for a more overall performing tire when not wanting to run the Cups, for sure.

 

[Paul@PKAUTODESIGN]

Hi,

Will doese sizes keep the same overall height as stock? What about for a normal GT350 (non R)?

I'm asking for a set of Forglines, and can't make up my mind for the tire. I don't want to run into lowering the car or offset the speedo reading...

If you are keeping the OEM GT350 sizing then 295/305 is a better options so you do not overbuldge the tire.

If you are going to a 11" front then a 305 front back is smart

R spec fitment

305/325 is proper

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