California New 2019 Law!!!

[motodad]

Like the fact sheet said...... what went into effect was a mandatory fine vs fix-it ticket. The db cap has been there for a few years. Additionally, I have found NO evidence that any California law enforcement agency has stepped up enforcement of the exhaust sound laws.... so....

Have you been ticketed previously? Probably not because most are sensible and respectful of others. Don't drive like a turd, in populated areas or places you exhaust may echo or amplify, and most likely you have nothing to worry about.

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[erikkire18]

Looks like I won't be driving me car anytime soon , don't want a state ref over my exhaust. I'll cry if I get state reffed haha

 

[CrashOverride]

More interesting stories...

https://jalopnik.com/why-people-are-suddenly-freaking-out-over-californias-e-1831620651
https://www.hotrod.com/articles/californias-new-exhaust-noise-bill/
https://www.motortrend.com/news/californias-new-exhaust-noise-bill-what-you-need-to-know/

I think there are 2 very different issues that people are confusing and getting caught up into.

The first group doesn't like or didn't know about the 95db cap. It's been on the books for a long, long time and I have no problem with that. I would like to think my roush axleback and steeda resonator delete, although fairly loud, is not that loud. I'm still running all of the cats, still running 2.5" tubing and still running two mufflers. I think most people fit into this group, namely wanting to abolish the 95db cap.

Not me, I'm fine with it.

The second group (Dare I say more educated and/or diligent) has a problem with the conversion of a wrist-slap and a legitimate chance to not only check the problem (Find out if the exhaust is in fact, too loud) but also the chance to repair it, and be done with the whole issue...without spending a lot of time to get it checked out, then going to court, and still being stuck with fines that are almost 10x as much. Worse, the state offers no way for one to test beforehand. If I want to make sure my car passes smog, I go get a pre-test. If it fails, I fix it, go back and get another pre-test. I don't have to wait until I get pulled over, hit with a citation and a large fine, and then fix the problem after the fact. And that is where I have a problem with it. I also have a problem with the fact that it was buried in an otherwise irrelevant (Not to say not needed, but has nothing to do with cars) bill.

I still agree though, there is a difference between driving modestly in a residential area and trying to emulate Ken Block.

 

[2morrow]

I went ahead and bought a new resonator and a db meter. One reason was all this but the other was to not get flagged on track. There was a couple times I was measured at 101 db and I have a MBRP street which I think is not that loud.

I'll do a before and after and post it up.

 

[Niz55]

Is you db meter calibrated with a cert?

 

[2morrow]

Is you db meter calibrated with a cert?

Nope. according to purchasers in the comments its off by +/- 2 db and is $20 compared to $200-$2K. That's ok, I just need to get an idea of where I'm at and of course, know my rights lol.

 

[CrashOverride]

I found this Overkill podcast by Kris Clewell and Jake Solberg which, although hokey at some parts, still a bit educational and highlights the lack of understanding of everyone from the CHP officers, to the BAR, to even the assemblymen. I'm not sure that poking fun at the people they interviewed or going down the "profiling" route, or even complaining that 95db is too quiet (After all, it's been law since 2003). I wish he would have stuck to what the law was about -- changing if from a fix it ticket to something else. Nevertheless, here it is:

To skip some of the silliness:

• They interviewed Jeremy, the guy that started the petition on change.org starting at ~ 02:00
• They played the infamous audio of the officer explaining it was a $1000 fine to what sounds like a girl at 12:45
• Around 14:54 they speak with a CHP officer about it over the phone
• Around 34:00 they speak with Assemblyman Jay Obernolte (Vice chair of state budget committee) -- Remember that the bill was sponsored by Assemblyman Phil Ting, who is the Chair of the Budget Committee. Assemblyman Obernolte is a self-professed car guy who actually modified an older mustang (He obviously knew what Hi-po parts were). The interesting thing is that the bill pased without a single "no" vote. I'll get into that later.
  
• Around 47:00 they speak with the communication's rep (Not sure on her exact title) for Assemblyman Ting. It's not relevant to the discussion here, but nonetheless is relevant about AB40 which is to ban all combustion engines in California by 2040.
• Around 51:00 They speak with a person from the BAR about the actual test. I'm not sure if they are an actual referree, so I can't fault them on knowing the actual numbers. Nevertheless, they thought the fine was $1000 and that the test was performed at 2/3 of maximum engine speed, which is between 3000-4000RPM on most cars (Their words, not mine).

I think there are a few things we can learn from this:

1. It would appear that right now, there is no uniform understanding of the specifics of the law.
2. Whether or not we like it, the onus is on us to be considerate of others and not try to set off alarms and strip out the entire exhaust system just to be loud.
3. The onus is also on us to keep current on proposed bills like this. How? I don't know as it would be difficult to check for proposed bills every day. If there is a "lesson learned" it is that we (As a car comminity) could have spoken up before it was signed, and before it was law.
4. We learn that Omnibus bills are essentially a collection of "stuff". Call me biased here, but it would seem to me that this is a convenient way to include a few things that everybody wants (Veteran's benefits, helping the poor/needy, etc.) with possibly the real intent of the bill...by burying the part that they know will cause problems. This way the assemblymen (Assemblypersons?) can later say "Hey, did you really want me to vote no for helping the Veterans?" (Which is why I think not a single assemblyperson voted no)
5. The last thing is that I think we need to be polite and responsible and contact the assemblyperson from our district and explain our concerns. Again, I feel it is far too late to say that 95db is too quiet - that issue was put to bed 15 years ago.

Who is your assemblyperson? Click here.

I also dug up a very recent video on YouTube of an actual sound test being performed on an STI. If nothing else, we can see the ref seemed to be a decent person, and we can see it is quite unbiased. I would say just by looking at the video that the microphone is pointed outwards 45 degrees, relatively level with the exhaust tip, measured by 3000-4000RPM and measured with a professional level microphone.

LethalGarage did a pretty good video and tested a few different cars (Camaro's and a Truck) to see what the readings were.

What I am still not clear on is the total cost. Some say $25 first offender, some say $197, others say $1000 and finally some say it is up to the judge. It is also unclear of the actual BAR testing fee. Although I highly doubt it is the case, I wonder if the judge can dismiss/refund the cost of the test - presumably if the test shows the vehicle is compliant. I am also unclear of the court costs which are (I believe) tacked onto the ticket fee. Lastly, I am not sure if, even after appearing in court with a certificate of compliance, which fees stay? E.g. does the $25/197/1000 ticket stand? Is the sole point to going to court is not to do anything else other than to prevent a different ticket and/or show that the vehicle was fixed. I'm not clear and I wish Clewell and Solberg would have spent more time/effort on finding that out instead of guessing the fines for other crimes.

 

[CEHollier]

Crash looks like you did your research. Please don't take this the wrong way but. Thank you Lord Jesus for the fact that I live in a free state instead of California.

 

[Nomadic]

Good all the annoying f#$ks on Harleys with insanely loud aftermarket pipes and Ricers with Fart Cans driving up the coast will all get fined up the a$$.

 

[CrashOverride]

Crash looks like you did your research. Please don't take this the wrong way but. Thank you Lord Jesus for the fact that I live in a free state instead of California.

Hey nothing wrong with thanking the Lord

 

[CEHollier]

I wonder if any stock exhausts will exceed the 95 dB?

 

[CrashOverride]

Good all the annoying f#$ks on Harleys with insanely loud aftermarket pipes and Ricers with Fart Cans driving up the coast will all get fined up the a$$.

The only problem is that this law doesn't apply to motorcycles or vehicles more than 6000 pounds GVW. I'm sure each does have a respective noise ordnance, but they are not subject to this, which I feel is a bit absurd. However...It would appear that the impetus behind this was because of street racing in which case I would argue that Harley's are not really part of the problem (No, I don't have a motorcycle at all, so not taking sides here ). Sport bikes? Yeah, that's a different story.

But, I agree with you completely, bikes and imports can be obscenely loud.

 

[CrashOverride]

I wonder if any stock exhausts will exceed the 95 dB?

The response I got from SEMA seemed to indicate that any vehicle, regardless of what it has, can be cited. I can see why, based on what CHP is being instructed/equipped to do...If it's "Loud" (Subjective, for sure) then write 'em up. They are not going to know what is/isn't stock on every vehicle, nor are they going to crawl under the car -- it's an officer safety issue, and I can't find fault in that.

Personally, I think the appropriate actions would be to amend the bill one of two ways:
1. Roll it back the way it was (Fix it ticket with a low fine)
2. Dismiss the ticket and all fees (Ticket + testing + court costs) if the vehicle certificate of compliance shows the vehicle complies with the law.

#1 isn't going to happen again. Undoing things is really unpopular. Prohibition was successful, but there was a lot more support than we would have (More people like to drink than are okay with what they perceive as loud exhausts)

#2 won't fly because the state couldn't afford to pay judges and refs with thousands of these cases when a large number of them are refunded.

Another possibility, and something that I think is the best solution, would be to create a new proposition on the ballot to change the newly enacted portion of the bill. That will take the onus off the assemblypersons and instead place it on the voters. Do I think it would pass? Well, ask the people that voted twice for a gas tax increase...But nevertheless it would allow SEMA and their associated allys (edelbrock, greddy, magnaflow, gibson, stillen, saleen, et al.) to have a reasonable fighting chance.

 

[CEHollier]

The response I got from SEMA seemed to indicate that any vehicle, regardless of what it has, can be cited. I can see why, based on what CHP is being instructed/equipped to do...If it's "Loud" (Subjective, for sure) then write 'em up. They are not going to know what is/isn't stock on every vehicle, nor are they going to crawl under the car -- it's an officer safety issue, and I can't find fault in that.

Personally, I think the appropriate actions would be to amend the bill one of two ways:
1. Roll it back the way it was (Fix it ticket with a low fine)
2. Dismiss the ticket and all fees (Ticket + testing + court costs) if the vehicle certificate of compliance shows the vehicle complies with the law.

#1 isn't going to happen again. Undoing things is really unpopular. Prohibition was successful, but there was a lot more support than we would have (More people like to drink than are okay with what they perceive as loud exhausts)

#2 won't fly because the state couldn't afford to pay judges and refs with thousands of these cases when a large number of them are refunded.

Another possibility, and something that I think is the best solution, would be to create a new proposition on the ballot to change the newly enacted portion of the bill. That will take the onus off the assemblypersons and instead place it on the voters. Do I think it would pass? Well, ask the people that voted twice for a gas tax increase...But nevertheless it would allow SEMA and their associated allys (edelbrock, greddy, magnaflow, gibson, stillen, saleen, et al.) to have a reasonable fighting chance.

Can you imagine every officer with a case of sports car envy pulling cars over and writing subjective exhaust tickets. And who has time and money to deal with testing and going to court and prove your car is legal? It could be like riding a merry go round.

 

[Freedom]

I hate the vagueness of everything.

I wonder if any stock exhausts will exceed the 95 dB?

80s dB max. Stock is extremely safe. It’s what is put in international spec after all and places like China are even more strict on noise.

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